to think britain is a difficult place to be if you're muslim ( part 2 )

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The attack on Charlie Hebdo.
Shall we have 3 guesses who's responsible?

Tariq Ramadan..... that moderate who calls for a 'hold' on stoning until the conditions are right !!!!

FFS you are so clueless.

Interesting. I am a muslim and so are my children, my DH. I am scared to go out today, scared to be in the public. I know I will get abuse.
My DH got told that he must be a terrorist too as he is muslim, this was at his work.
I am scared to be a muslim. I am scared because of the way people think about my religion due to the actions of these horrible, evil people who take my holy book and use it to their own awful advantage to kill, maim and terrorise. I am scared of these fanatics, if they had their say I would wear a niqab and stay in my house. My family (I'm a convert) would be killed.
I am scared for my children, for the future. I am scared to live here and we have started to think about moving to my DH's home country...not that it's that great either, fanatics kill there too...
I am scared...not of Islam but people, the ones who call themselves 'real muslims' (what mockery, killing innocents) and non-muslims alike.

" ... Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error ..." [2:256]

The Quran is Muslims holy book and this is what is says. From what I also understand is that not all Muslims accept every Hadith because some narrators were untrustworthy or inaccurate with their information about the prophet or his teachings. I'm pretty sure the holy book itself over rides a set of narrations? Salahuddin the Muslim leader is famously remembered for allowing free speech and practising of different religions/having religious temples built in his conquered land. Muhammad was no different by historical accounts either.

" ... Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error ..." [2:256]

So Miranda I repeat again from my post earlier:

" I'm still waiting for one of the moderate muslims to tell me why there is no compulsion in religion but yet simultaneously I should be killed for leaving the 'faith'. At least the extremists are consistent ! "

Perhaps you can answer ?

Florabeebaby you have my and many others sympathy. I think it will only get worse in Britain though to be honest, and family members of mine are thinking to leave with their children. If you wear a scarf that makes everything more visible too. Just keep a close eye when you are out, that's all you can do.

I see this thread has gone full circle.

Islamaphobia does not equal hatred of muslims.

Criticism of Islam is not hatred of muslims.

Muslim reprisal attacks are largely imagined and made up.

Perhaps you could go ask a Muslim mistressmia, or knock on the door of a mosque if you're brave enough and ask them to explain it.
Even then id doubt you would listen because your mind is already made up. From what I understand from the Muslims I've met and extended family members, the holy book overrides the Hadith narrations with regards to laws. And like I mentioned before, errors will and do occur when a Semitic language is translated to a Germanic one. Maybe a reason the Taliban for example aren't exactly known for their scholarship on Arabic let alone the Quran.

Muslim reprisal attacks are largely imagined and made up?

Fuck me, you are beyond help mistressmia

I'll tell that to the hoardes of young Muslims I've known who have had their scarves ripped off, drinks chucked over them by passing cars, men called terrorists and 'pakis' and women with their children being screamed at in the street for being 'on benefits', 'go back to where you fucking came from' etc

Your last comment really shows your true colours IMO.

And yes the scholars I've mentioned are of a very high rank according to my relatives. I don't know the names of any others but am aware there is a lot more out there with similar views. I'm trying to educate myself so I don't have these views that subconsciously demonise Muslims, because these people are family, friends and neighbours.

Muslims are criticising these attacks and saying there is no basis for them. Including Imams and Islamic scholars.

www.onislam.net/english/news/europe/481651-muslims-blast-charlie-hebdo-attackers.html
""Arab League chief Nabil Al Arabi strongly condemns the terrorist attack on Charlie Hebdo newspaper in Paris," the League statement was quoted by The Gulf Today.

Al Azhar condemned the "criminal attack," saying that "Islam denounces any violence," in remarks carried by Egypt's state news agency Mena.

In a separate statement to AFP, Al Azhar senior official Abbas Shoman said the institution "does not approve of using violence even if it was in response to an offence committed against sacred Muslim sentiments.""

www.thecairopost.com/news/132517/news/dar-al-ifta-condemns-attack-on-french-magazine-charlie-hebdo

Negm told The Cairo Post he called on all Islamic organizations in France to officially condemn this crime and to explain the Islamic vision regarding the respect of the right to freedom of expression as a basic guarantor for the democratic process in the whole world.

He said that those who committed the attacks are seen by all religions as devoid of humanity and Islam is innocent of such attacks.

What more do you want people to say?

Perhaps you could go ask a Muslim mistressmia, or knock on the door of a mosque if you're brave enough and ask them to explain it.

Funnily enough I did ask three local maulvis. All friends of my father. Even asked my own father why I should be killed. All said the same... because that is what Allah has decreed.

Thankfully my father was not a violent man, or I may not have been here to write this post. I wouldn't dare go to ask this questions of my relatives in Pakistan. Very likely would be killed.

i'd forgotton you were ex muslim mistress

And what evidence did they give you for 'it's what Allah has decreed'? Ask them, then post on here and tell us.

That's some entitlement there, Miranda! I really don't think Mia owes you that, having experienced what she has.

Isn't that what it says in the quaran? That if you leave you should be killed?

Miranda Whilst I sympathise with those muslims who have had drinks thrown at them or scarves pulled off etc it rather pales into insignificance when compared with being beheaded in the street or gunned down just for doing your job.

Al-Azhar : that bastion of progressiveness

Al-Azhar sheikh demands new international law criminalizing defamation of religion www.egyptindependent.com/news/al-azhar-sheikh-demands-new-international-law-criminalizing-defamation-religion

And have they repealed this Fatwa:
Head of the Fatawa Council of Al-Azhar, Abdullah al-Mishadd, Al-Azhar University, the pre-eminent Shariah legal authority, fatwa issued 23rd September 1978: “This man has committed apostasy; he must be given a chance to repent and if he does not then he must be killed according to Shariah. As far as his children are concerned, as long as they are children they are considered Muslim, but after they reach the age of puberty, then if they remain with Islam they are Muslim, but if they leave Islam and they do not repent they must be killed…” formermuslimsunited.org/apostasy-from-islam/al-azhar-fatwa/

.... unlikely considering the death penalty for Blasphemy and apostasy still stands in Egypt.
www.dailynewsegypt.com/2014/07/13/post-revolution-blasphemy-convictions-increase-get-personal/

Yeah Mia. Go and put your life at risk just to satisfy Miranda's sense of entitlement!!

Or being murdered for being white (Kriss Donald and Gavin Hopley) then receiving no media attention because your race doesn't warrant it.

In the 'quaran'? Someone tell me! Go on, someone post the evidence that apostasy is punishable by death from the Quran. It's not what I've learnt from educated Muslims.

With all due respect to mistressmia I would lay bets on that 'what she's been through' is a result of the patriarchal and traditional Pakistani culture, if that's where she's from (assuming so as she said her relatives are from there). I have a Pakistani friend who was forced into marriage although the Quran states in one chapter that men are forbidden to marry women against their will. My sister in law is Pakistani and some of the culture is just downright sexist IMO, waiting on boys hand and foot stands out in my mind.

Miranda: me repeating myself time and time again will get boring to those who read the original thread. I also don't have time to spend my whole day answering apologists like you.

There were enough unanswered questions and criticism on the 1st thread. Read and come back to me. Till then no one can take you seriously.

Hmm, Ayaan Hirsi Ali wasn't from a Pakistani background, was she? Nice sweeping statement about a country of 200 million people, incidentally.