To ask you all to sign petition regarding Oldham and Ched Evans

[floatyflo]

Actually I don't believe I am being unreasonable. But wanted to bring it to attention.

MN seems to be a quiet on this today but I think the fight should still go on. I can't link to it as I am so not tech savvy enough but it is on change.org. (Same person whk set up the Sheffield Weds one so of you sogned that one it is pretty easy to locate).Already has over 9000 signatures so please please please continue to sign and share!

I don't, there are two tools here: the law and public opinion.

I'm not sure that the law is the right tool for determining the employees of a private company above and beyond public interest eg professions in contact with children, professions regulated by the FCA etc. To try and make a law for sportspeople, many of whom are effectively self employed (Andy Murray, for example) would probably not work.

Footballing bodies might issue guidelines though and that would be a better campaign.

deal in doubt - stand sponsor threatens withdrawl Miliband supports not having anything to do with him

Isn't he being "hounded" by her supporters, as evidenced by the very public campaigns to prevent him playing football?

No. He is not being 'hounded.' Creating or signing a petition to stop a convicted rapist rejoining a profession where he is in the public eye, and considered a role model for children and adults, is a legal democratic right. No petitions would have raised had Evans not attempted to re-enter professional football.

His victim however, was named and threatened on twitter, which is breaking the law. She is entitled to life-long anonymity. She has had to go into hiding 5 times. She has had to leave her home, her family and friends. She has had to change her identity. She is at breaking point according to her father. It's not remotely comparable.

Does anybody know about Graham Rix? A professional footballer who served a prison sentence for having sex with an underage girl. He returned to play for premier league teams after serving his prison sentence and there wasn't anywhere near the same level of media interest and public protests. If the law stated he couldn't return to that role then he wouldn't have been able to do so. There are many cases that get no media attention and because there is no law preventing them going back to work they they do so. Football clubs pay vast amounts of money for players and will have them return to playing after convictions if they can do so without mass media attention. Why not change the law to prevent that? What is the harm in doing so?

And I agree with Chunderella - tackling individual cases whilst seeking a broader level approach is appropriate.

"Do you not think it would be more useful to change the law to prevent all of them from being in high profile sports roles"

No, not "more useful" for it's already legal to do this.

And i think you'd find your view that your DC wouldn't support a particular individual would be disproved sharpish if it was your club he was coming to. Club loyalties just don't evaporate, nor can one player within a club be avoided when supporting a team.

fuctifino - I didn't say I didn't believe you - it just sounds v highly improbable (with no reference to the Improbability Drive, which would possibly make it a certainty...)

Do you not think it would be more useful to change the law to prevent all of them from being in high profile sports roles than to sign a petition against just one of them when the petition has no legal weight and could be ignored if a club really wants to sign him?

As a matter of fact I probably would support such a law. But the fact is its not actually necessary and therefore not really relevant in this. Oldham or any other club are under zero obligation to sign Evans.

Its all very well shrugging shoulders and saying 'well thats just the way tjings are' but What I would prefer to see is a change in attitude in the football industry - it doesn't have to be like this.

Quoting Rix and Gazza teaches us just how far we have moved on since those days. neither of them would have been given any sort of contract IF it were repeated today.

So we cannot be a hostage to a bad old time. We have evolved, and those cases show us how far. Thank the fuckin' lord.

Apologies, my DH corrected me: Graham Rix returned as a coach to a professional team, not a player.

Graham Rix was convicted only after his playing career has ended.

And he returned to management with a specific limitation to prevent involvement in youth football.

If CE was planning employment in adults-only sports management then I think there would be no outcry of this kind. Though as his offence was against an adult, it may be harder to find an employer to take him on.

Gazza isn't a good comparison either - no convictions. I do not want to sound like an apologist for him, but I think proof beyond reasonable doubt (ie a conviction) is the baseline here.

SKY has just reported a sponsor (Merlin?) have announced they will terminate their agreement with OA if CE is signed.

yes they are a stand sponsor in the BBC article I linked to above from this morning.

We haven't moved on much. Garza and Rix might have been a long time ago (only 15 years in Rixs case), but there are other footballers and sports people currently playing who have committed serious crimes in very recent years. It just seems that we bandwagon individual cases singled out by the media instead of looking at the situation as a whole and saying 'actually I don't want anybody convicted of an indictable only offence playing football for a professional club where they are going to be in the public eye. I don't want the media telling me which cases are important enough to pay attention to whilst other convicted offenders just quietly return to playing for top flight clubs because the media has decided that their cases are just not interesting enough.
I just wish the media would stop reporting anything on this case for the girls sake. I'm sure she wants the media to just leave it alone so that people will stop talking about it and hopefully her harassment will come to an end.

He returned as a coach, not to play. His sentence was considerably less than CE's therefore the courts deemed this a less serious offence. Whatever the guidelines/law (and it seems the FA did comment on this one), some offences will be covered and some not.

Please note I am not saying he should have walked back into his old job.

Rix joined Chelsea as youth team coach in mid-1993; during an injury crisis, he briefly enlisted as a player for the club, playing a solitary Premier League match in May 1995 against his old side Arsenal. Rix became assistant manager in 1996 under new Blues boss Ruud Gullit, and continued in the same role under Gullit's successor Gianluca Vialli, winning the FA Cup in 1997, and the League Cup and Cup Winners' Cup in 1998

Sex offences and prison term
In March 1999, Rix was sentenced to 12 months in prison, of which he served six, for having underage sex with a 15-year-old girl. He was also ordered to be placed on the sex offenders' register for 10 years, and banned by the FA from working with youth players under the age of 16.[3] Upon his release from prison he immediately rejoined Chelsea in his old job. He won the FA Cup again in 2000 before leaving the club after Vialli was sacked by Ken Bates, after a brief spell as caretaker manager.

can you name these people In? Are they guilty of sexual assaults, serious assaults or anything of that order, refuse to accept their guilt so d onot see rehabilitation as a choice for them, and still playing. How many?

X post.

Well, perhaps that's what the victim wants. Who knows. I expect she cares a lot more about the people harassing her than she does about CE. So do you think she would've wanted him to be playing for SUFC and feted every Saturday now?

sorry Pan hadn't spotted your link

(if I had, I'd have named the company, Verlin, correctly)

I already acknowledged that he returned as a coach and not a player. It was still for a top flight club though with tens of thousands of supporters and his offence was against a child which for me personally (just my own opinion) is even worse.
I don't think any of them should be going back to their old jobs or any similar jobs but I am not signing a petition against one person when I think the whole system needs change.

Do you also think that people shouldn't boycott Nestle, I don't? It's another way of making a protest.

Who do these club officials actually talk to to assess a likely sponsor/supporter/gen public reaction? Do OA have a PR section? Do they reside in a lead lined box at the bottom of the sea?

By the way, of course you don't need to sign a petition if you don't want to - i do get your reasons.

"I'm sure she wants the media to just leave it alone so that people will stop talking about it and hopefully her harassment will come to an end."

The harrassment comes from CE supporters. He hasn't distanced himself from them in any way. Which I think speaks volumes about his character.

(you can see an example upthread of how that can be achieved whilst still considering legal options)

And yes, I would be delighted to see the FA making a ruling that conviction of offences carrying custodial sentences is incompatible with a playing career. Can you link a petition or any other initiative that calls for that?

I think Ched Evans and his supporters have done a lot to cause the media storm tbh. If his supporters hadn't hounded the victim, named her, if he hadn't set up his website, if he hadn't made himself/Natasha out to be the victim here, if he wasn't so obviously unrepentant - there wouldn't have been nearly so much of a backlash, it wouldn't be nearly so high profile in the media.