to feel cheated that you can't actually have it all?

[ChocolateOrangeInASantaHat]

Many moons ago I was educated in a fantastically positive school, where as females we were taught that we could achieve anything a male could achieve and that if we worked hard enough and planned well enough, we could 'have it all' in life.

So now, with my collection of letters after my name, respectable job, 2 usually well-behaved children, lovely husband and a multitude of lists to keep life running smoothly, I'm slowly realising that it doesn't matter how hard I work or how meticulously I plan, unless I steal a bloody tardis I still can't have it all.

Feeling particularly bitter as was up all night with poorly child, who I then left with a relative to not miss work today (=feeling like rubbish mother) and then as I'd had no sleep I was not very productive at work (=also feeling like rubbish employee). Since others at my level are generally male and tend to have stay at home wives, this kind of feeling inadequate at both home and work doesn't tend to occur for them.

Honestly feeling like I should advise daughter to either:
a) marry rich man, get good prenup and focus on children/household or
b) be career driven and marry man who is happy to stay at home and focus on children/household.

AIBU to feel cheated that I can't 'have it all'? (NB in case lost in my sleep-deprivedness this is a --partially- tongue-in-cheek AIBU)

Yeah, move house or jobs? LOL! Because it's that easy.
We already live in an expensive area, not sure we can afford central London prices, but thanks for the LOL! And dh job is London centric, before you suggest we move to a little village in Lanarkshire for a similar salary! It's lovely that you've got an exactly 50/50 split of duties, but you might want to try being less judgmental and impatient with people who don't.
And are, shock bloody horror, content with that.
But thanks for the lol.

and lol again @"ask hard questions"
Asking doesn't usually provide the resources to move house and jobs. Especially when you have a child in the middle of GCSEs.

It's the way you said it Alicia, the way you were so proud that you didn't mention your kids, looked the same etc, as if to do so was the reason many of us who work full time were having problems. I think you do yourself and other working mothers no favours by pretending your children never happened. Bosses shouldn't expect their employees to put their demands and expectations above everything else and your attitude panders to this. I think working mothers shoudld be proud of being working mothers. The same with fathers actually. I would be surprised if any of my male co workers never mentioned their kids and behaved as if nothing had changed.

That's why I thought it was sad. It was nothing to do with how much time you spent with your kids or the quality of time you had with them.

I believe I am able to provide a comfortable life for the 5 of us due to when I am at work bot bringing family life in to it. Work is work for me and tbh I am so busy I often don't even think at all about my children when I am at work.That's how between the 2 of us we only next to do 3 days work.

Everybody has choices. It's quite right IMO to teach girls they can do anything they want if they work for it, just as we teach boys.

There's no law saying that you have to have a kid, or lots of kids, or that you have to stay at home with them.

Even if you do stay at home with them, they grow up pretty fast. Your working life could be forty years or so. Small children will only be a very short portion of that, unless you choose to have lots of kids.

The phrase makes me so angry.

It's never applied to men, and it's a phrase that implies that a woman will only ever be acceptable in society if she's all things to all people. Its a massive mythical stick to beat women with, more so you hardly ever hear men using that phrase about other men nor women. Men don't try and have it all and aren't expected to "have it all".

If a man is a captain of industry and no one questions whether he's a good husband or father. In fact a man can be a captain of industry and be single, and society would still think he had it all. If a man is a sahd then most people think he's a hero. No one bloody thinks that about sahm. It's okay for men to make do, be average at everything or excel in one area but not others. But not women. This makes women feel shit about about themselves because they're not perfect.

I am constantly told by other women that I have it all because of the combination of my career and family life. But do you know what? By the laws of physics I could not possibility have it "all" but neither do I want to. It's not something to which I aspire. And neither should any woman. Therein lies the road to unhappiness.

I think that quite a large percentage of women, if they could afford it, would choose to be SAHM's at least whilst their children were pre-school and primary school. Unfortunately, the negative affect of womens liberation has been that as soon as there are families living on 2 salaries, the house prices start to reflect that and suddenly no one can afford to own a house and be a SAHM. I have so many friends who work 'because they have to' and it causes such high levels of stress for the families. We have both had jobs that have been flexible enough for us to share the childcare and not have to rely on paid childcare but I know when I had to work fulltime for 2 years whilst DH was unemployed, I found that the emotional energy I had left for the kids by the time I got home was virtually nil and I was so relieved when he found work and I was able to reduce my hours to halftime. My lowest point was when my husband phoned me at work to say how my daughters surgery had gone and I had got so busy at work I had totally forgotten she was having surgery that day. To do my job well involves 100% focus and combining that with being a good parent is very difficult even on reduced hours. I have a friend with 14 children and she often says that the most important thing is to be there whenever your child needs you, not to have to schedule in 'quality time' once a week but to be there for the daily questions/feedback from school/discussions about friends and issues,cuddles and arguments.I often have to explain to my 12 year old that the reason she has to share a room with her annoying 8 year old sister is because we have chosen to live on a lower income to ensure one of us is always there for the kids. She usually thinks she would prefer a bigger house but in reality I believe she is better off with an available parent and she has had greater need of that availability since she started secondary school as there are so many issues she comes home wanting to talk about.

I'm not sure that's right novice about SAHDs being seen as a hero - I think a lot of women might think it was unusual, nice, a good thing to support. But I'm not sure many men would have that reaction. I think SAHDs actually have a really hard time in feeling a sense of status - they're judged much more for that decision tham women are. I've known a few speak about how they can be excluded from the socialiseing with kids that women do together, struggle to answer the "so what do you do?" question at parties, or explain a gap in their CVs which isn't viewed on as normal by an employer.

You can't have everything. Where would you put it? - (Steven Wright)

I support vdb's views totally.

ChocolateOrange
Since others at my level are generally male and tend to have stay at home wives, this kind of feeling inadequate at both home and work doesn't tend to occur for them.

The part I've put in bold sounds like a sweeping and sexist generalisation, unless of course you've had in depth conversations with your male colleagues, and that's what they've told you.

Whether you 'have it all' is highly subjective, a state of mind almost, based on personal expectations/fulfilment of those expectations. Two people with similar life circumstances (home, work, financial) might have very different perceptions of whether or not they 'have it all'.

loiner45
I personally think a balanced life is healthier than pursuing one goal

I couldn't agree more. I also think happiness comes more easily if people don't think in terms of absolutes, and seeking perfect outcomes. Life is full of things not going smoothly and rough patches - the things OP describes in her first post I would consider to be mere blips, rather than a cause for dissatisfaction. They happen to everyone.

Why didn't your lovely husband look after the sick child?

Probably because most children want their mums when they're ill.

OP YANBU

I do think too many women accept sexist men. The reference above to not being able to move because of a husband's job. We moved hundreds of miles for my (yes me the wife) work, not his. That was 30 years ago. If 30 years ago there were plenty of men happy to move for their wife's career why not now? Do mumsnetters choose sexist men for some reason? Yet women under 30 on average in the UK earn more than men.

As for the suggestion that children need mummy when they are sick and daddy or their beloved nanny will not do is sexist to the core and not the reality for many working couples. Most couples if one has to rush to a sick child decide which has the more important meeting that day and who can rejig their schedule most easily.It is only sexist couples where there is any assumption women do that.

I completely agree with Victorian that there is a solution for the high skilled women who desperately want to return to a fulfilling career, but end up in low skilled jobs that don't involve commuting so that they can see their kids.

I have an amazing employer and everyone in the company works weird and wonderful hours to accomodate life circumstances. As long as the office is manned it seems to work. My kids are very young so I'm only working a 0.6fte. I tend to do one long say where I commute and book meetings, but otherwise I just do 4 hour chunks in the day and spend the rest with my kids.

As for the suggestion that children need mummy when they are sick and daddy or their beloved nanny will not do is sexist to the core

No it's biology. The percentage of dads who are their children's main carer is small.

Biology?! Rubbish. No biological reasons at all why fathers can't do this stuff.

vdbfamily, what sweeping statements, women (not parents, women) really wanting to SAH and "women's lib" impacting house prices!

You might feel that it's best for one parent to physically be with DC all day during the early years then outside school hours beyond that, and have set things up that way. Works for you, fair enough (although IMO it'd be nice if the proportion of men AH was higher). other families do things differently, for whatever reason, which is equally fine.

There's definitely a different link between Mothers and babies. Greengrow, you can say that kids are just as secure with a nanny, but I laugh at that idea.
Biology does come into it. Men can't get pregnant or breastfeed. The only place I know on earth where Dad's are exactly the same as Mum's, in their kids eyes, is Mumsnet.
My kids, friends kids, colleagues kids, all want Mum when they're ill. They want Mum. I know, I know. Go on. Say it's social conditioning. Social engineering.
I say not. That's not what, with advancing years and older children, I've watched happen around me. Perhaps the world needs to become more female, more empathetic, more child centred? Instead of us women trying to emulate men by leaning in, working ridiculous hours, never seeing our kids and pretending, when we're at work, that we don't have any children, why don't we work towards a world where childcare is valued, where sahms aren't seen as a problem, where flexible and part time work is viable and properly paid, where work life balance is addressed properly?

Having IT all....what is IT? One definition might be, "What you want".

I went to an academic girls school...fail your O levels and you'll fail your life. You would probably have been given detention if you career choice was to be a SAHM. Quite possibly if you'd mentioned having kids ... What you were supposed to be aiming for was 3 or 4 science A levels, Oxbridge, and a Nobel prize.

Anyway, I did well, went to university, became a lawyer, and subsequently a mum of 2 boys, 8&10. I had 3 years out when they were young and went mad. I liked elements of being at home, but I was bored and losing confidence. DH told me to go back to work, and well done him.

I now earn about the same as him, in a job with flexibility and lots of interesting travel. I work from home when I want and see plenty of the boys. We have an AP and a cleaner, and DH pulls his weight round the house.

Yes we are busy, and it would be nice to have more leisure time or me time (ha! Don't know what that means!) but I think I pretty much do have it (ie what I want) all.

I am not in Greengrow's super league, but we are very well off compared with most people. I'm happy with my lot, even if I'm a huge disappointment to the head mistress of Leeds girls!

And having just read Meech's post, I disagree.

My boys do see mòre of me. DH spent years at sea. They are equally happy with either of us. Even when Ill, which doesn't happen often.

Mechimoo I agree with every word of your last post

meech spot on post. That was exactly what i was trying to say about biology.

I think you can have it all but it is hard having it all!!! I kind of have it all in that I work from home so am flexible for my children. When they were young I worked when they napped, in the evening and when they were at preschool. I was shattered. Now I try to limit work to the school day but still have to work evenings quite a lot. I also do everything at home, no one appreciates me and I hate/am bored of my work and have not a got much of a social life because I don't met anyone through it! My work never goes away and I feel like a student with an essay deadline all the time.

My ideal would be to be a SAHM with a husband that earns a decent(er)salary. I am not career minded and would love focussing more on the home. In that I would love to have time to cook wonderful meals before the kids get home, bake, have the house perfect but also time to meet friends, go to the gym and do crafts and painting!!! I would also have liked more children but can't afford it. I would like to be able to start a 'fun' career when the kids leave home!!! In my dreams! Not a very feminist point of view but there you have it. My husband would also like to be a SAHD especially now the kids are at school!!!

I too found that I couldn't have it all, in that I couldn't feel like a good mother AND a good employee. I just ended up doing both jobs not as well as I'd have liked. Mine wasn't even a high powered job, just a professional one that involved significant amounts of work at weekends and in the evenings.