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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask if you don't do Santa/ Elf in the shelf you don't spoil it for others?

301 replies

CatWreathkeith · 09/12/2014 08:42

Last year Dneice was told matter of factly by a 4yo at school there is no such thing as Father Christmas and it's your parents. In reception.

This year another child has told her that you can buy an EOTS from Amazon, because her mum has shown her it.

Why? Why would you do that? Why not say there are only a few elves that get to leave the North Pole and we didn't get one?

Or if your child wants one that badly get a cheap one from the pound shop

Grrr Angry

OP posts:
MonoNoAware · 10/12/2014 13:25

It's worth googling the difference between 'authoritative' and 'authoritarian' parenting styles, Ginger. In a nutshell, authoritarian parenting uses threats and bribes whilst authoritative is more democratic. Hard with a 2 year old I know, but possible in most instances and progressively easier the older they get. I was raised in a household where threats and bribes were rarely used, so it was easy for me to parent in this way. It must be much harder when you don't have direct experience of that particular style of parenting.

It's not about letting them have their 'own way' btw, that's yet another (bad!) style of parenting.

youareallbonkers · 10/12/2014 13:29

I'm pretty sure my children would have wondered why their mum and dad didn't buy them anything.

Punishments is much more successful as a way of behavior modification...in rats anyway ;)

gotthemoononastick · 10/12/2014 13:37

Mischievously informing people of the hidden green pickle somewhere on a Christmas tree! Some are blown glass and old!

Start a tradition for your family!

Zebrasandpapayas · 10/12/2014 13:53

I think elf on a shelf is freaky, sorry. If dc asks me about it I'll say that different families have different traditions but I won't lie to her and say it's real if she wants to know.

The name alone.... Elf on a ...... Just can't stand it, it sound dippy.

bigbluestars · 10/12/2014 14:04

squoosh- a stick was a metaphor.

squoosh · 10/12/2014 14:11

I know.

TalesOfTheCity · 10/12/2014 15:49

ginger It is hard work with a 2 (or worse, 3) year old, but I think it pays off. Like someone else said, it's just a different mindset and perfectly possible to parent without or with minimal use of rewards/punishment (consequences are different) and without telling children that they alternate between 'good' or 'naughty'. I think children are always good and need to know that, even when their behaviour needs correcting. Of course they need disciplining and boundaries and to be told off, but they are just tiny and learning. It's a very long process.

Punishments are often unrelated to the offence and are simply there to teach a child that if they do X then something unpleasant will be done to them.

Consequences are just the natural outcome of their behaviour and they need to be pointed out and explained. There is a subtle difference to punishment. Difficult for a 2 year old but they do start getting it, slowly.

At that age I would use the counting to 5 thing where I would ask, then of it wasn't listened to say "you haven't done whatever. I am going to count to 5 to give you a chance and then ..." which was normally enforcing what I had asked and that was it.

Good luck.

NurseRoscoe · 10/12/2014 16:51

People really ruin their kids childhood by never doing Santa just because they don't want to lie? Wow.

TimeWarp · 10/12/2014 16:58

Childhood is not ruined if there's no Santa, what a weird idea. The majority of the world do not have a Santa tradition and it doesn't make a jot of difference to the happiness of the children. Lack of food, clean water, safe housing and education, yes that does reduce happiness, lack of Santa is so trivial as to be unnoticed.

NoLongerJustAShopGirl · 10/12/2014 16:59

"People really ruin their kids childhood by never doing Santa just because they don't want to lie? Wow."

People do not RUIN kids childhood by not doing Santa - what nonsense. (also PA - like your "wow")

Just because we say that people who love you give you presents and share a spirit of giving and love due to the celebration of the birth of Jesus Christ the son of God. Rather than a fat, jolly, imaginary man coming into your house at night and only leaving you stuff if you have been good.

(playing "devil's" advocate as I am an atheist - but have never done Santa.)

MiaowTheCat · 10/12/2014 18:57

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Bulbasaur · 10/12/2014 19:29

Miaow My parents printed our Santa labels and letters so we couldn't tell their hand writing. Grin Though the illusion was ruined when I went to my aunt's as a kid and saw my cousin's letter in her handwriting.

My parents just got around the questions with "Kids who don't believe don't get presents". Never spoke of it again, even as adults Santa drops some gifts and stocking stuffers at my parents for us.

Summerisle1 · 10/12/2014 19:54

*Would anyone seriously cancel Christmas over bad behaviour? Of course you wouldn't because it would be a horrible thing to do to a child who is excited and looking forward to it, no matter how badly they'd behaved.

So why threaten it if you have no intention of doing it?*

This. Absolutely!

I never threatened my dcs with Santa. For the simple reason that I never threatened anything I wasn't prepared to deliver. Which is one of the reasons why I dislike this Elf on a Shelf nonsense since the very presence of the nasty little snitch suggests that Christmas is entirely conditional on perfect behaviour throughout December.

As for the original question, you can't police what other people's children tell yours. Neither can you expect the parents of these children to lie to them in order to protect your dcs (or a neice in this case). Everyone eventually discovers the Santa myth. But just being told that he doesn't exist still doesn't stop children continuing to believe either so this all strikes me as a wild over-reaction. Especially over the Elf on a Shelf which is, after all, a recent invention that's merely a money-making gimmick.

Bluestocking · 10/12/2014 20:03

Apparently they do Tool on a Stool at the Playboy Mansion. Hef places an outsize dildo with googly stick-on eyes on a stool in "the infamous Master Bedroom". The resident Bunnies all have to be very good for the whole month of December or the Tool will squeal on them. Rumour has it that there are Bunnies well out of their teens who still believe that the Tool is a sentient being.

DixieNormas · 10/12/2014 20:04

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Fallingovercliffs · 10/12/2014 21:06

Y'know I'm glad I had parents who were prepared to 'lie' to me to create a magical, exciting experience;, and who had the generosity to allow 'Santa' to take the credit for presents they had saved and sacrificed for because they knew it would make for enchanting and thrilling memories that would stay with me forever, than po faced parents who over analysed and over thought everything and sneered at or disapproved of, the idea of the fable of Santa.

SurfsUp1 · 10/12/2014 21:24

Summerisle1

Would anyone seriously cancel Christmas over bad behaviour? Of course you wouldn't

Santa is not coming to my boys this year. They were warned repeatedly over a period of months and yet the fighting continued and so they will not be putting out a stocking this year.

I agree that you should not make any threats that you have no intention of carrying out, but I'm not willing to have Santa give my boys presents until they stop beating the bejezus out of each other.

They'll still get gifts from me and other family, but it will certainly be less that it otherwise might have been.

Iggi999 · 10/12/2014 23:45

There is another thread currently running about a mil who informed the OP's young dd that there is no Santa. No-one as far as I recall defended the mil's right not to "lie" to the child. They thought she was nasty and her behaviour uncalled for.
I agree with the poster who talked of the theatrics of it all, I think young children are very into this kind of thing - note popularity of panto, which adults (mostly) hate!

NobodyLivesHere · 11/12/2014 03:59

I have an elf that a friend knitted for us. He sits on the Christmas tree being a fat, judgemental bastard.

TooHasty · 11/12/2014 10:27

SurfsUp1 That is wrong on so many levels , I really don't no where to start

StripedCandycaneOss · 11/12/2014 10:57

we dont do EOTS, i think the doll is creepy, and its expensive tatt, but i wouldn't spoil it for anyone elses kids if it was mentioned in conversation.. thats just being cuntish.

NoLongerJustAShopGirl · 11/12/2014 11:00

po faced parents who over analysed and over thought everything and sneered at or disapproved of, the idea of the fable of Santa

So what exactly is po faced and sneery about telling our children that at Christmas time we exchange gifts with people who love us and care for us, we spend time feasting and celebrating with those we love, that PEOPLE choose presents they think we may like.
I'd rather my kids grew to know the deep seated love and care that surrounds them, than think it is all magicked up from some imaginary guy from the North Pole.

People like me do not "over analyse" at all... we just refuse to engage in the crap...

Inthedarkaboutfashion · 11/12/2014 11:04

Iggi the MIL who told the child about Santa is totally different to a five year old telling another child that Santa isn't real. Do you really not see that there is a huge difference?

TheMuppetsSingChristmas · 11/12/2014 11:06

I've never cancelled christmas altogether, but I did take the tree down, every decoration and card in the house, and take away their advent calendars mid december the year before last. Their behaviour had been appalling despite repeated warnings. Funily enough they never really cared about the calendars but they did miss the tree. I put everything back up on christmas eve and I also left a little note in their stockings from Santa saying how disappointed he'd been to hear of their behaviour initially, but how pleased he was they'd tried much harder afterwards. I don't see that SurfsUp approach is all that different or worthy of such disapproval.

Fallingovercliffs · 11/12/2014 11:25

There really are some unimaginative and joyless parents on here. There is nothing wrong with conjuring up a bit of magic and wonder for children at Christmas and letting them believe their big presents come from some mysterious figure who travels around the world on a sleigh on Christmas Eve night.
To start talking about parents telling 'lies', or children not realising their presents come from 'real people' is really missing the whole charm and enchantment of the Santa story.