To leave ds to scream in his cot tonight...

[listsandbudgets]

because I can't manage to deal with him tonight.

He's 2+4. EVERY NIGHT of his life he's screamed endlessly at bedtime. We tried going to him, lying down with him in the dark, cosleeping singing to him, letting him come downstairs, cuddling him, ignoring him, sitting holding his hand, seen GP and had various cchecks carried out to make sure he's not in some kind of pain...

but still he screams endlessly "MAMA,MAMA, MAMA, MAMA, MAMA...

Over and over again.

We finally get him off to sleep about an hour - two hours after putting him to bed (I say we its normally me as dp works away Monday to Thursday and someetimes longer).

He then wakes at 3am and it all happens again until about 4.30-5am.

Its affecting my mental health. I keep losing my temper, keep bursting into tears for no reason, I can't function properly at work and I'm facing a disciplinary for mistakes, I feel like everyone hates me and I wouldn't blame them

I've not had a full nights sleep since 3 months before he was born.

I can 't do it any more. I just can't do it....

AIBU to sleep in teh spare room with a pillow over my head and let him scream?

You'll all flame me I know you'll flame me and I deserve it.

He's still screaming I put him to bed at 8pm and I've already been in and given him 2 X10 minute cuddles

It sounds really hard op. If it were me I'd start letting him sleep in your bed. It sounds like he really wants to be with you, it's what I do with dd. If you choose to do this then once he knows mummy will always be near then he will sleep much better imo, with a bedguard you should be able to leave him sleeping in your bed with a monitor so you can have your evening and then join him later.

Works for me but I appreciate not everyone likes to sleep with their toddler.

I just wanted to say that i am anti controlled crying but after reading your op I can't see what else you can do.

Make a nuisance of yourself at your gp's until you get some help

What did the gp do to rule out pain?

Because if it has been a problem for that long, I'd wager that something might be up.

And to the poster who said imagine how horrible it is for him - no, it doesn't make you feel good, screaming. Which is why most people don't do a lot of it. But if they knew it would get them what they wanted, they might!

What is your point?

Massive sympathy. Leave him to it. He's safe, fed and in bed. You can do no more, and your health is failing because he is so difficult, which is not OK. Look after yourself - you are the one most in need tonight.

Also, i followed a book called the three day nanny from my library,which had some useful tips like start with naptime not bedtime (assuming he naps) and if it doesn't work then take him out to nod off in pram or car so he is not too exhausted at bedtime. And if you do listen then remember it is "shouting" not crying, and write down the times between and for thinking pauses and watch the pauses get longer and more frequent as he works out what he needs to do.

OP I feel your pain. Just to give another perspective/experience, as there are times when it's not a straightforward behavioural thing.
By the time DD was 6 we had never had any consistent settled period of sleep for longer than around six weeks....since she was born...multiple wakings...early wakings...protracted settlings...we had persevered with behavioural methods and sleep hygiene/routines consistently since a few months old (apart from CC as her meltdowns were too frightening to consider it and I was glad I went with instinct on that when we had an eventual diagnosis)...but only after an eventual referral to community paediatrician were the words 'significant sleep disorder' uttered and a prescription for melatonin issued.
I'm posting this because I totally know how grim it is. And because it is not always behavioural. Currently in the UK, only a paed can prescribe melatonin. Your GP can refer you to one.
If you know deep down there's something more to it than the run of the mill, don't be fobbed off, ask to be referred.
PM me if you want a hand hold or there's anything I can offer in the way of how we did/didn't cope with it that might help.

Poor you. I know what torture this can be . Ds is just 3 and is clingy cries Mummy Don't leave me etc. What is working well is the promise or threat of Father Christmas bringing or not bringing presents for naughty boys. We have discussed brushing his teeth, not crying at bedtime being helpful etc and it is working amazingly well. Or promise chocolate buttons in the morning?

My point is that yes, it's not nice for him to be screaming. But he's doing it because it gets the results he wants, and at the moment, in his wee mind, it's 'worth' it. Solving this, however the OP ends up solving it, will mean he isn't screaming, which will be nice for them both, and IMO it sounds like she's tried everything else, and might have to just do it cold turkey.

To put it more bluntly - most people will put themselves through something unpleasant if it has a 'reward' and I believe it's important for kids to learn that screaming doesn't produce 'rewards' - it's for emergencies only!

OP I really do think that the crying is so ingrained now that if you leave him to cry he will do it all night. And I'm not sure that you can take it, or it will be good for him. Controlled crying is a good option but it has to be done properly and I'm not sure it's on the table for you any more.

Please consider getting a mattress and sleeping in his room. I would do a gentle, soothing bed time routine, explain to him that he needs to sleep in his cot, and that you will sleep next to him. You may need to start sleeping together on the mattress in his room before he'll move into his cot.

Pain causing screaming would be unlikely to vanish for the day and turn up at bedtime. This is part of the little boys routine by the sounds of it bath, story, bed, scream, Mummy comes.

grumbleina I agree but I'm worried that OP's son has become so used to his crying eventually producing a parent that the route 'through' crying, if you will, will be a rare kind of torture for all concerned

My DS was a bit like this, I'd have to be with him till he fell asleep, and if I snuck out and he wasn't absolutely passed out, he'd instantly leap back up and start shouting. I'd spend a couple of hours every evening in a dark room waiting for him to finally let me go.

What sorted it, funnily enough, was moving him from a cot to a bed. There was talk of how it was a big boy bed, but the first night he was in it, I settled down next to it and he said the magic words 'go away mummy'. And that was it. He was just turned two, and fell asleep on his own every night since. He still sometimes calls us in to fix his covers or find his bear or whatever, but that's totally doable.

So I would agree with the poster who suggested buying lights and bedding and making it a start of a new era.

Well you cant really know why he is doing it grumbelina. What OP describes is very extreme tbh and IMO warrants further investigation to rule out any medical issues. In OP's shoes i'd be holding off on leaving him to scream til anything more serious than behavioural reasons were ruled out.

That sounds awful. Poor you.

Tonight why don't you go in, say 'I love you, here is a kiss and cuddle but (firmly) this is the last one, it's quiet time and sleepy time now. I am off to bed/to do my chores and will not be back.' Then leave. That way he knows the score. Do the same when you leave the room tomorrow.

For bedtime I would choose a routine(whatever worked best out of those you tried) then stick to it like glue going forward. Eg. Bath, two books, cuddle, wee, bed no talking. Don't let him throw the routine off course or go into bargaining. Eg. If he hasn't chosen a book and is running around the room, then calmly sit down, say the book is starting and quietly read it. If he misses it then he misses it but you don't get into a battle of wills.

Lastly -talk him though the bedtime routine and what you expect of him a couple of times during the day, at a quiet time and in a friendly way. Ask him to repeat it back. Eg. What do we do after bath time? Yes, very good we put in your pj's. Can you talk after the light is out? No- well done you know the rules so well. Etc. This is what has worked for us. But also maybe talk to gp or hv if it doesn't improve, is he fine during the day?

He's screaming because he's so bloody tired and can't get to sleep without a parent there, I'd stake money on it. If I had any

Missed the post about a new era but I think transforming his bedroom is an excellent idea.

My DS was the same. He was 2.6 when I crashed my car through exhaustion, I couldn't function anymore and used to shake all the time, had tonsillitis 4 times in a year, 3 bladder infections, 2 lots of flu, a permanent headache, I was seeing things and hearing things I honestly felt like I was mentally ill...there's a reason they use sleep depravation as a torture technique! People don't get it unless they've been through it.

Seriously, leave him to cry, he's got used to you coming to him and having attention so you have to break that habit. First few days will be so hard but it is worth it. Took 4 days with DS. He is now a very loving and confident 7 year old and we are incredibly close so it hasn't left any ill effects!!

The other thing is, make sure he is tired at bedtime and hasn't had a late nap/it's not a very early bedtime.

OP - does he quieten down when you are with him? With both mine I had to stay with them in their room until they drifted off to sleep. (I also co-slept with DD2 until she was about 10 months). Sometimes actually in the bed with them and as they got older holding their hands until they fell sleep. I tried lots of the other sleep methods, including controlled crying, which I hated and it didn't work.

It would often take up to an hour to get them to sleep, depending on how much they had napped during the day

They both also used to wake and either came in with me or I would put them back to sleep.

BUT they both started to go to sleep and to sleep through at about 2.5-3 years.

From reading your posts, it sounds as though your son is picking up on your anxiety and exhaustion and the whole sleep routine sounds pretty tense. Is there any way you could summon up the energy to somehow be more relaxed about the process - IYSWIM?

Either, you have my sympathy. It WILL get better though.

BitchPeas I think you may have posted about your car accident before, I was going to refer to a pp on another thread who was not safe to drive due to sleep deprivation.

Also he can't be in pain of he's ok until she turns over when they cosleep

It sounds like he isn't sleeping very well if he notices that. It doesn't have to be pain,it could be discomfort.

Does he snore?

Go to a sleep clinic and get some. Help and support.