To have no idea how to explain to my 9 year old DD what The Rapist Ched Evans did

[Hoppinggreen]

DD has obviously picked up some snippets about this and has asked what happened. She does know about sex but we haven't discussed what rape is and I don't know his to explain why the victim went to the hotel and what went on from there. I don't want to victim blame but I do want to perhaps talk to her about personal safety.
I also want to make the point that what The Rapist and his apologists are doing now is wrong and how Jessica Ennis ( who she worships) has done a great thing by condemning Sheffield utds actions.
Any suggestions?

happy to - and please don't misquote me

www.rapecrisis.org.uk/commonmyths2.php

also if you consider that awful '1 in 3 rapes happen when the victim has been drinking' NHS posters (not drinking btw NOT drunk) then 2/3rds of rapes happen when no drink is involved at all - ergo you are safer pissed!

*note ...not 'not'

Ghosty - I already looked at that. It is not about rape by strangers.

I have found one report, fully referenced, which concentrates exclusively on rape by strangers. It discusses locations, times, vulnerability of victims and alcohol though so I am sure you will only see it as victim blaming.

www.popcenter.org/problems/sex_assault_women/

True Empire it's depressing to be having the same discussions over and over ...for decades

but 90% of rapes are NOT by strangers so I still don;t understand why you think THIS is the issue

you are more at risk going about your normal daily life than walking naked in a park at 3 am

I guess it's hard to blame women for going shopping or walking the dog though

Empire - my only 'point' is that I think is sensible to give teenage DD's safety advice that might reduce their chances of being a victim or rape by a stranger.

Everytime a poster has given that opinion, you disagree agree with this because you see it as victim blaming. I think it is sensible to give that advice and to look at precautions that can be taken to help reduce the risk of women being targeted by rapists who are strangers to them.

I think it is the issue because the OP was about the Ched Evans case which was rape by a man who was a stranger to the victim. I can't keep repeating myself.

do you give them safety advice to avoid rape by people they know and or love - you know like don't have a husband, boy friend, male friends, male relatives etc etc - given they are much more likely to 'put themselves at risk' by doing those things

you can't 'prevent' rape no matter how hard you try

MyEmpireOfDirt There is some truth in the mugging analogy.

No, you can't disguise the fact of having a vagina where you can leave the IPhone at home, but consider this. I'm sixty-odd, slightly below average height, specs. I can no more leave that physical vulnerability at home than a woman can leave her rapeable orifices behind. So I'm careful where I go especially at night.

But if I get mugged because I went where it would have been better not to go it's the mugger's fault not mine.

And it's the same with rape. Teaching your DD to be streetwise and careful is not blaming the victim. It's not a zero-sum game.

I know, I know, some people won't see it that way. But their ignorance does not excuse any of us from teaching our children of either gender how not to be more vulnerable than they need be.

but that's the point a fair few of us have made - you of course teach your children (male and female) to be aware of the risks of being drunk etc but you don't link it to 'preventing' rape - you link it to not dying of alcohol poisoning or hypothermia or eating a dodgy kebab

linking WOMEN drinking directly to rape is telling women to alter their behaviour to 'prevent' something they can't or they are culpable in some way

better to spend your time education men not to rape

god my typing is shite today!

Can I ask something? Not trying to be deliberately goady, but just interested in opinions in the light of where this thread is heading.

Two people who have the cars stolen: one who takes all sensible precautions, one who leaves it unlocked with the keys in the ignition. Both are victims of the same crime, car theft, but only the first one would be entitled to claim on their insurance.

Two people are raped. One who takes all the sensible precautions as outlined above, one who gets drunk and goes home with a complete stranger, makes out with him, and then says she doesn't want sex. Both would be equal victims of the same crime of rape. Do you feel both would be entitled to the same payout from the victim compensation team? Or is one less deserving than the other because they didn't take precautions?

Genuinely interested in your answers and I've no idea what would actually happen in real life. Does anyone know?

Actually that does sound quite goady. Sorry, it wasn't meant to.

Some people are just hell bent on seeing taking safety precautions as victim blaming. It's ignorant and foolish not to teach your children about the danger they could encounter by placing themselves in a vulnerable position. If you could do something that can minimize your risk of being raped, why shouldn't you do it.

No, but I think people have a certain responsibility to take reasonable precautions to protect themselves against crime. If you don't take reasonable steps, are you allowed victim compensation if a crime is committed against you. Any crime, not just rape?

I think Creampie because you are again thinking there are precautions that stop you being raped - you are equating a women maybe getting pissed with somebody leaving their keys in the car ...but women aren't cars and they tend to be raped regardless of their actions not because of them

women aren't houses or cars - they can't be 'safely' locked up - you could stay stone cold sober and still be raped - you are not responsible

you can't minimise your risk of being raped though ffs

Ladyluck if your argument is any way sensible you would teach your kids to stay pissed since 2 thirds of rapes happen when women are sober