To have no idea how to explain to my 9 year old DD what The Rapist Ched Evans did

[Hoppinggreen]

DD has obviously picked up some snippets about this and has asked what happened. She does know about sex but we haven't discussed what rape is and I don't know his to explain why the victim went to the hotel and what went on from there. I don't want to victim blame but I do want to perhaps talk to her about personal safety.
I also want to make the point that what The Rapist and his apologists are doing now is wrong and how Jessica Ennis ( who she worships) has done a great thing by condemning Sheffield utds actions.
Any suggestions?

by that I mean you'd have to explain the full range of discriminatory assumptions made about women, from whore and Madonna to a John Lewis advert to make any sense - that could take years - so interventions based on things men who rape can understand more easily is usually more effective.

There seems to be an argument that on this thread that because looking both ways before crossing at a pedestrian crossing won't prevent all pedestrian deaths at the hand of careless drivers, no-one should look both ways before crossing at a pedestrian crossing. (And anyone who says they should is a victim-blaming cunt.)

No one said "victim blaming cunt", fraidy.

exactly what MyEmpireOfDirt said - I do discuss the use and effects of alcohol with my eldest 2 - and other drugs and I discuss how it can impair decision making etc but I do not and will not link that with 'you may be raped' because being drunk doesn't make you any more likely to be raped than wearing a hat does - statistically more women are raped when sober - so maybe that's a bigger risk

you can't 'prevent' rape unless you stop men and boys from raping

Prevention, protection - I'm not seeing anyone using these words to describe how being mindful of one's environment and behaviour guarentees safety. We know that some rapists are opportunists, and thereby know exactly what they are doing, unlike others who don't bother (or are limited) to think anything through at all.

And I don't think anyone has ever argued that not drinking, staying in places you feel safe etc. is a bad idea. It's a good ide?, for many reasons including personal safety, but people are mistaken (and unhelpful) if they repeat the lie that it will protect you from rape

I've never, ever heard anyone (on here or in rl) say that these steps 'protect you' from rape. It's ridiculous terminology to keep using to try to prove a point.

But I will tell my dc not to not drink to excess. Not walk home at night along deserted back streets. Not to go off with someone they've just met. Etc. Because it may help them to avoid a number of nasty situations, rape potentially being one of them. It's just common sense.

Back to 'crossing the road': looking both ways does not guarantee that you will never be run over by a car (sometimes cars mount the pavement & run pedestrians over). But it does reduce the chance of being run over when crossing the road.

Taking safety precautions: getting in a cab, staying with friends, not going home with a man you do not know... These things do not mean a woman will never be raped (for all the reasons given on this thread) but they do mean that a woman is less likely to be raped by a stranger who is out looking for a vulnerable victim.

Yes, I do know that taxi drivers can also be rapists. But I would still tell my teenage DD's (in the future) to use taxis from a local firm we use, instead of wandering around on their own at night when they have been out to pubs/clubs with friends.

How is that victim blaming? To me it just seems like common sense.

better tell them not to get married, have male friends and relatives, male land lords, male work colleagues, take taxi's, be old, be a nun, wear trousers, wear skirts, have short hair, have long hair, have fun, stay at home, go to work, etc etc then - since women get raped because of all those things as well

I think point scoring in a discussion like this is pretty ridiculous - oh and when you quoted me you missed out the bit about working for rape crisis for 17 years

no soggy because looking both ways wont stop somebody deliberately running you over - because rape isn't an accident - you don't trip and land on somebodies penis - it is a deliberate act of violence

You are in a far better position to make wiser decisions than being absolutely drunk. I will teach my kids this. It's surely common sense.
Yes a rapist will still do it, but it can minimize the chance it may happen to you by taking precautions.

My eight year old knows what rape means. He's known the facts of life for years but it is a very hard concept. I just told him it's when a man makes a woman have sex and she doesn't want to. He's heard the term a lot and has seen some depictions, it was eastenders that started the discussion.

Yy ghosty - wg

You're being pretty ridiculous yourself Gordy and I really don't know what you're arguing against tbh.

Yes women can and do get raped. No, you can't 100% negate the risk by any action.

But you can be aware of how to minimise certain risks - like not walking down remote streets in the dark alone, or getting in a car with a random man, or drinking until you can't stand.

As the mother of 3 dd's I don't for one minute believe that you (or any mother) would not give this advice to your dc. So like I said, I don't really know what you're arguing against.

...whilst the occasional driver may be a criminal looking to run someone over, most accidents are caused by lack of care and attention (on the part of any or all parties), unexpected road conditions etc - not through criminal intentionality.

YY Memphis.

I told my 8 year old that he'd hurt the woman. He felt that violence off the pitch should be a sackable offence for a football player especially if it was so serious that he went to prison.

From this post Empire - Even on this thread people have talked about precautions women should take. As if they are required, and not taking them makes a woman negligent - it seems that that's what you're saying tbh.

There ARE precautions women should take, to help keep them safe and try to prevent all sorts of scenarios. And men. And children.

Saying to a woman 'you really shouldn't drink until you can't stand' is NOT the same as saying 'if you drink until you can't stand you deserve to be raped'. At all.