MIL - I've really no idea why she was so upset about this?

[MyballsareSandy]

My 13 year old DDs go from school to the in laws every Wed, have dinner there and DH collects them. They don't particularly like doing this as they are old enough to go home alone, until me and DH get home from work, which we allow on other days. It's just basically to keep in touch with their grandparents, and usually the GPs love it (I think!).

Anyway, yesterday DH arrives at his parents to find his mum in floods of tears, and his dad having stern words with DD2. Apparently she was doodling in a notebook and wrote "Nan smells of fart" . Bit childish at 13, but really is it worth the drama that followed, I just don't get it.

DD doesn't want to go there anymore, she can't understand the reaction either and would much rather just go home after school, which I'm tempted to say yes to.

Well, it's interesting to see the extent to with the status quo (MIL is an evil witch) can be restored via judicious drip feed.

Anyway, with reference to what your mother in law said about your daughter, she certainly should never, never have said anything like that in front of her. But I can't help wondering whether she may have had a legitimate concern. You say your daughter lacks empathy and understanding of nuance that you would expect from someone her age. Does this cause you no concern?

I agree the last post from Sandy puts Sandy in a poorer light, for continuing to send the dds to a grandmother who plays favourites and openly comments in front of dd2 that she is odd and needs to be "tested" ... as well as being prone to emotional blackmail and histrionics. As soon as it was clear this was a pattern, not an off day, nan should have been quietly replaced aschildcarer (if it was known to Sandy and her DU when childcare was needed) and unsupervised contact should have been quietly cut out/ right back.

At the same time that OP looks less sympathetic, DD2 looks more so - maybe her social skills aren't brilliant for her age, and MIL has clearly been chipping away at her self esteem and favouring her sister. Writing in a notebook "nan smells of fart" is about the mildest way imaginable to respond to being in that situation week after week with no end in sight!

Let her off the visits Sandy - if you don't you're showing her that MIL has the right to be rude about her, dad's feelings are not as important as an adults - and we all know that's a bad precedent to set!

That doesn't mean "let her off" - you still need the conversation about both her and her nan's feelings beingof equal importance. .. which is why she will want to apologise to nan but won't have to go to nan's without you/ her dad any more (unless she wants to).

Yes FI who "gets" her told her off - so enough telling off has occurred, move along to the bigger issue now!

Dd not dad

After your last post OP, I wouldn't be making your DD apologise or forcing her to go back to her grandparents on Wednesdays if she didn't want to go.

It sounds like her grandmother has been chipping her confidence away for years, plus MILs behaviour in favouring one child above the other could be damaging their relationship with each other as well.

Oh gosh i was right , mil is toxic and child has been forced into misserable visits . The subtext was so bloody obvious. children have a tendancy to behave how they are treated.

DD should definitely not apologise given the new info IMO. I really feel for her :(

Even if she should be tested (though MIL doesn't sound like the best person to judge this does she...), it should never have been said in front of her. And calling her odd...it's not concern it's fucking nastiness.

Other posters have raised a valid point about why you never stepped in to stop such regular visits after realising how unfavoured this Dd is compared to her sister. But you have no duty whatsoever to continue the arrangement.

Still upset that some people are insisting a 13 year old isn't a child.

And oh my god that is so true about what a previous poster about if it has been a boy not girl doing the cheeky doodling.

Goodness, this has been blown out of all proportion in true AIBU fashion.

What the op's daughter did was rude. She shouldn't have done it. Sometimes my young teen says really stupid things which he thinks is funny and it misses the mark. He is 13, but an immature one. I explain how what he said is hurtful and rude and he gets it.

I don't think he needs to be sent to boot camp just yet, or that he is going to turn into an arsehole adult. He is 13, but still messes up at times and do things which aren't really socially acceptable.

I'd be worried about your dd going through life, coming out with inappropriate and rude stuff, with no idea she's making a bit of a fool of herself. It does reflect badly on her upbringing I'm afraid.

Now this is just hysterical. I am glad you have teens who never fuck up and do things they shouldn't do. I bring up my children perfectly fine, but mine do have minds of their own, and sometimes they do shit they know they shouldn't do. I have no doubt whatsoever, that when my 13 year old matures more he will no longer say things on the odd occasion that he shouldn't say, because he will have more maturity to think things through better. Some 13 year olds are still pretty immature.

A child writing nanny smells of farts is rude, but not really worthy of the comment about how you are worried about how she will get through life.

Mellowautum- this comes as no surprise to you and me both!!

Its a bit childish, but like others say unless there is underlying sensitivity it seems a wierd overreaction, have you asked your mil about why she was soo upset? I do think a calm chat with DD is needed tho was it in a giddy moment?

NoMarymary Thu 13-Nov-14 16:58:37

13 a child? Like the ones who have babies or intercourse are children? No 13 is not a child.

I reported this comment and I am shocked it still standing, if anyone has been over to the pedophile or abuse threads in the news, you will understand why, if anyone does need wider perspective to understand 13 year olds are children and should not be having intercourse or babies at 13, its abuse if they are.

Its agaisnt the law to have sex with minors.

Saying children are willing participants is one huge reason why thousands of girls have had their child hoods stolen by abusers up and down the country, plying them with drugs and alcohol and telling them they love them, then trapping them with violence and threats to them and their families

Please support me in getting this atrocious comment banned, am shocked its still there.

Massive drip feed there, OP.

I suggest you take a really good look at MrTumbles posts. They make a lot of sense.

So this has obviously coloured their relationship, understandably. DD1 is the golden child in MILs eyes, even in the tone of her voice when she is talking to DD1, but despite many conversations over the years, MIL hasn't changed.

I am shocked you would send two children to a woman who is so clearly faviousing one, how is this affecting your daughters self esteem, my DBRO was always given less money than his sister from GM, this was the twice a year they saw her...it has affected him all his life, fancy sending them once a week to this?

Dreadful. And all on the altar of keeping them having this lovely bond?

I would take dd2's side absolutely here. Grown woman in tears about this comment from a girl she regularly disregards? She needs to man the fuck up and if they were my kids neither would be going anywhere near her again.

I would be gently talking to my dd1 about how the mil treats both girls and what really happened in this instance. My mil favours dd1 and I am 'coaching' her to say that dd2 needs one too when mil drags her off to the kitchen in secret for 'special treats'. Luckily we see them once every two months not every week;

Now that you give further information this is not as clear cut.
The first post gave a picture of a 13 year old with no developmental issues being very rude to her grandmother who had done nothing wrong and the OP excusing this and turning the blame on the grandmother.
I think it was OP's attitude more than the teenagers behaviour that provoked a strong reaction.
Now you describe your daughter's limitations and MIL's long term relationship with her it all becomes more understandable.
I would still be talking to her about this being unkind-but I would be reducing contact with someone who is sapping her confidence.
Has MIL's reaction got exaggerated in the telling as you didn't actually witness it? Could she just have been sniffling a bit?

She was never "extremely rude"
Unless you've never actually been outside and met anyone.

My mil would've been upset and cried and my fil would've told ds in no uncertain terms that he was bring rude and hurtful.

My mum would've roasted ds alive.

Ds would never do anything like your dd though OP,I think it's appalling and so hurtful, and my eye she was just doodling and gran 'accidentally' saw it, it sounds deliberate.

A couple of hours a week to see grandparents is hardly a big deal and I bet it's the high light of their week to see the kids. It does kids no harm at all to do things they don't want to now and again, it teaches them about family duty and actually just sucking it up and getting on with it now and again.

ZeVite I totally agree with your stand on the consent issue.

With you entirely, ZeVite

AmandaClarke I go outside and meet real people all the time-including many young offenders, teenagers, older people etc and I thought it was bloody rude before OP's updates.
If I had written that at 13 my parents wouldn't have let it drop for weeks. Checked with DH() from a very different background-he says they would have "killed" him-metaphorically speaking I hope.
Don't think basic manners should have changed that much-but I do understand it more now that OP has updated us.

Zevite - you do realise that there are some 13 yos who have sex with their similar-aged boyfriends, do you? it's not always abuse by a predatory older male!

DeVite You are right, but I think noMary is a bit unhinged of a goady fucker prone to posting ridiculously extreme opinions, either hoping for as reaction or because of some personal chip on her shoulder - she was the one who hoped the nan would disinherit the OP and her family and tell her 13 year old granddaughter to "fuck off".

I think some of you come from very weird back grounds!

Your parents would have "killed you" or "not let it drop for weeks". My Mum would have "roasted me alive" and so on.

A 13 year old wrote in their notebook "gran smells like farts".

It was a private notebook, not a 6 foot poster, not shouted out, not a letter written to Gran. Why was Gran reading the notebook? Was she interfering? Was it like the MNer who left emigration forms in a draw?

MyMum was strict but she would have, as I would do now with my DC:
a) got DD to apologise
b) not made my DC spend time with them when they are old enough to be on their own
c) wondered why someone was over reacting so much. It was rude, but enough to cry over?

I only skim read and there's drip feeding . So my post might not even be relevant now I can't be arsed to read the whole thing WHY do people drip feed?

Thumbwitch is right too off course, though at 13 (rather than, say, 15) the number of 13 yearolds having happy, consensual, sex with other 13 years olds is fairly small - a tiny minority, not really the standard by which to judge what a 13 years old "is".

Teens are not exactly children, but they are certainly not asdults at 13 either - everyone knows that really, its odd it became an either/ or... Whether the OP's dds are the same age as individuals who have had underage sex is not really relevant in any logical way is it?