MIL - I've really no idea why she was so upset about this?

[MyballsareSandy]

My 13 year old DDs go from school to the in laws every Wed, have dinner there and DH collects them. They don't particularly like doing this as they are old enough to go home alone, until me and DH get home from work, which we allow on other days. It's just basically to keep in touch with their grandparents, and usually the GPs love it (I think!).

Anyway, yesterday DH arrives at his parents to find his mum in floods of tears, and his dad having stern words with DD2. Apparently she was doodling in a notebook and wrote "Nan smells of fart" . Bit childish at 13, but really is it worth the drama that followed, I just don't get it.

DD doesn't want to go there anymore, she can't understand the reaction either and would much rather just go home after school, which I'm tempted to say yes to.

The girl needs to apologise. It is clear she hurt her GMs feelings. teenagers' feelings don't override their grandparents'. She should be advised to tell her parents how she feels rather than taking it out on her grandparents.

OP, you minimising it is not doing your daughter any favours. You can sympathise with her without allowing her to be hurtful.

I think it is quite a mild thing to write to express annoyance or frustration. THe average 13 year old has at her command a great number of far more colourful swear words. Given that it was also written in a private notebook and not said leads me to think it was just a mildly annoyed 13 yo who had been denied a biscuit before dinner for example.

I still think the GMs reaction was ott, esecially as it was probably written with no intention of her reading it.

Your last line is pathetic, BTW, OP.

The word fart isn't the issue for me (we use it freely in this house), it's the implication. Even if the daughter had written "dear grandmama has the odour of flatulence about her person" it's still implying that she smells unpleasant and is therefore rude and personal.

Zevite, I dont like the word either and in this house its referred to as boom boom if its ever acknowledged that someone did a boom boom.

Something just dont need to be acknowledged because its something we all do and it is what it is.

13 years old is the key here I think. She is 13. If she was 23 I would be a bit concerned. It was something she wrote she didn't say it and she wasn't to know that it would have the effect that it did. Or maybe she did and thought bugger the consequences! It could have been handled better. It must have really upset the GP. Have you spoken to DD to ask why she wrote it? Like I said she's 13 years old. Yes it's rude yes it upset people yes it was not a nice thing to write...but it can be sorted. Is she sorry she wrote it?

bigbluestars Thu 13-Nov-14 19:03:28

Totally agree.

It's not at all bizarre that the OP hasn't come back.

From her OP, I guess she works, ad the time of the OP suggests she may have posted at lunch intending to pop back later to see what replies she has.

I do the same, and I've only just had 5 mins to come and take a look at MN, the OP may be busier than me tonight and may be intending to come back later. We don't all have time to post when other people demand it.

On the subject of the OP, though, I would say the DD has been a bit rude. We don't know how the MIL came to see what was written in the notebook, the DD may have been letting off steam and never intended for it to be seen.

I think that MrTumble's point about a discussion with the DD to encourage an understanding that she hurt someone's feelings and a voluntary apology is best. Forcing an apology only breeds resentment.

I do think that separately, the issue of whether weekly visits are still a good idea should be looked at.

Odd that the op has not returned?

Not really her DD said her grandmother smelt of farts the way some of you are going on about how nasty she is and how dreadfully mortified you would be if it were your child you would think the DD had killed the family dog and shat on her grandmothers kitchen table.

Its no bloody wonder she's not been back perhaps she's back in the real world getting some perspective

I don't feel the need to announce that I have farted normally!
In a medical context i would refer to flatulence but yes more offensive when used as insult.

It would be rude if said to a teacher in a classroom or written on a note to a "friend", it would be rude if yelled at somebody working or in the playground. It may not be the most serious swear word or worst you use at home but when you attach it to a person it's rude. So it's staggering that some people think the MIL is overreacting! If its rude to anyone else (which it is) its even more hurtful to someone in the family who obviously loves & cares for their granddaughter, who has no doubt bought them presents & gifts throughout their life and may well have been actively involved in their care when younger. If I'd said this to anyone in my family at the same age or even as an adult there would have been hell to pay. Also with regards to her going to her grandparents well family & relationships are give and take aren't they. So many threads on mumsnet are about "entitled" family members causing drama & seeing themselves as the be all and end all of every situation - so it's not her first place to want to be, well tough she has 6 other days to choose where she spends her time doesn't she. She sounds like she needs to be reminded of the communal aspect of living in a family and apologies to her grandma carefully & thoughtfully. Sometimes in life we do things for other people and put others before ourselves, yes some teenagers are the least likely to want to do this but surely that's exactly when we should as parents, adults & society be gently nudging them in the right direction of how to think of others too,

I kept a journal for many years. It was most certainly not intended for anyone else to read. If they had they may well have found something that caused them upset. But that would have been their fault for reading my private diary, not my fault for writing it.

I think people are genuinely shocked that she seemed to be excusing daughter's behaviour and blaming MIL.
In real world I would be giving DD a good talking to.

I would say that whilst 'fart' offends lots of people here, what matters most is how she intended it. If it was just cheeky/silly and it hadn't occurred to her that it might be upsetting that's massively different to writing something that was intentionally hurtful. Feelings around word fart clearly aren't just generational, and vary massively throughout groups of people who don't swear otherwise. It's not fair to put our own feelings towards the word onto the 13 year old. So I'd say find out what she meant by it.

HOWEVER. The MILs feelings do need to be taken into account. Who knows why she reacted as she did. We inadvertently (and sometimes intentionally) upset loved ones throughout our lives and need to learn to take responsibility for our part in it. Perhaps it's a good opportunity to talk to her about how things we say can affect others in ways we might not predict, and that she needs to apologise to and make peace with her Gran, even if she didn't mean to hurt her. If she did mean to hurt her, then she needs to apologise bigtime!

Well said sunnybobs!

sunny- the girl didn't say anything rude to the grandmother though.

jessbags- " how things we say can affect others in ways we might not predict, " but the girl didn't say anything bad to her gran.

I can imagine a child, and this girl is still a child, not being allowed to watch tv/ being made to do her homework/being given a telling off for something else and not wanting to answer granny back and instead writing granny smells of farts as her way of 'giving old buck' as we used to say in Scotland.

It might even have been a face saving excercise between her and her brother, a private joke.

yes cariads again agree.

where is op, where is op, its totally odd she has not returned not even once to say she is busy

Not odd at all to me that the op hasn't been back yet. Her RL might just be more important than MN to her.

I wonder how OP would feel if DD came home from school in floods of tears because shed seen a note written by a pal that said DD smelt of fart? Would she dismiss her DDs feelings and tell her just to buck up? Or would she sympathise, give her a hug and say the friend was just being horrid?

No it is odd Fry people start threads to converse, I have never seen an op post one post then totally bugger off.

I did just that once. Posted about something I wanted opinions on, under another name, and then RL intervened and it was a couple of days before I had a chance to take a look.

I find it amazing grown ups need to call a fart a boom boom or have problems acknowledging a simple bodily function. Do you have sex in the dark once a month ?