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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Nanny sick leave

229 replies

pommedeterre · 22/10/2014 09:54

As succinctly as possible - nanny doing three days a week for just over a year for pre schooler and toddler. All fine except bit crap at food and bit pestery for me to use her nail business.

I go on a version of mat leave for four months. Keep paying her and she helps with complicated nursery and school runs and takes toddler out. She goes in for routine operation, books two weeks off. Will now be longer as still poorly. Fine. Obviously paying her normal wage still, ok with that, grateful in fact for lucky timing with mat leave.
Except now i discover that when she felt better ten days in she babysat for someone else (then felt bad again meaning it will be more than two weeks).

Aibu in thinking she should have used her bit of energy to help me (just one school run would be awesome to be fair) rather than trying to make an extra £40???

OP posts:
ADishBestEatenCold · 24/10/2014 16:18

"So she would be fit for "some work" for the op - her main employer and the one who is currently paying her sick pay - by that logic. If she was up for lighter duties then id argue she has a moral duty to let her sick payer know this rather than continuing to let that peron believe she's unfit for any duties"

As stealth says, but additionally if she was considered fit for some lighter duties (as opposed to all the contacted duties within her nanny role), it would say so on her 'fit note' and therefore OP would already know!

The employee's doctor would not supply two 'fit notes' for the same period of time, one for the nanny employer saying not fit to work at all, and one for the babysitting employer saying fit to carry out xyz duties only.

Her doctor would supply only one 'fit note' for that period of time, saying either not fit to work at all, or saying fit to carry out xyz duties only plus any requirements for return to work support.

If the doctor had said that the employee was fit to do lighter duties, OP would have known that.

Original poster
pommedeterre · 24/10/2014 17:04

I havent seen any sick or fit notes. Doctor said two weeks to her then she has added another two days on to make 8 sick days in total. Her extra two days are based on her own assessment.

OP posts:
LIZS · 24/10/2014 17:23

She should have a note for the two weeks but could self certify the 2 days.

ADishBestEatenCold · 24/10/2014 17:28

The doctor would supply her with a 'fit note' for any sick time beyond 7 days, including non working days (used to be called a sick note). On the 'fit note' it may say she is unfit for any work or the doctor may say that she is not fit for general duties, but is fit for lighter duties, and so on.

AFAIR your employee is entitled to keep the original, but must first give it over to you to give you the opportunity to photocopy it. You will need this to file for SSP.

This www.gov.uk/employers-sick-pay/overview will tell you a bit about your responsibilities (and rights) when your employee is unfit to work.

ADishBestEatenCold · 24/10/2014 17:43

"She should have a note for the two weeks but could self certify the 2 days."

She cannot self-certify the last two days, in a continuous period.

She can only self-certify the first 7 days of this period, including non-working days/weekends (so presumably from the day she was admitted to hospital, or before that if she was ill immediately prior to admission).

Also, re OP's post "Doctor said two weeks to her then she has added another two days on to make 8 sick days in total".

No. Even although she was only due to work 8 of those days, the non-working days must be counted/included in the 'fit note, so 16 days in total, of which she may self-certificate the first 7 days (by giving over a RL self-certificate) and must supply a doctor's 'fit note' for the latter 9 days.

whatever5 · 24/10/2014 17:56

I would ask for her "fit note" so that some of the money can be claimed back. If she can't/won't supply this I would think twice about paying her for the time she has been away She has been very unprofessional about the whole thing.

Original poster
pommedeterre · 24/10/2014 18:42

Reading that link looks like you can't claim back ssp post April 5th 2014, ie from this tax year.

OP posts:
ADishBestEatenCold · 24/10/2014 18:54

I haven't heard that it's been stopped (though it may have been). I think it may be that you'll file this year's (after April 2014) at the end of the tax year (April 2015).

So, I do think she still has to give you the 'fit note'.

Weathergames · 24/10/2014 18:58

I work for LA and we would be disciplined if earning money by other means while off sick.

HR stalk peoples FB to see of any social activities whole people are on long term sick leave (which is a lot).

One lady came back from three months off with depression looking very much like she'd had a Facelift.

YANBU.

Aridane · 24/10/2014 19:17

I'm afraid I agree with the small minority that YABU (for the reasons they have given)

Enjoyingmycoffee1981 · 24/10/2014 19:48

She was a bit thoughtless. Have a chat with you, as otherwise you might stew on it. She will no doubt apologise and admit to being thoughtless. There we go, end of the matter.

Instead you waste your time and energy discussing and arguing with some, over the course of a couple of days, over something really very trivial. She has had an extra two days off. She did a bit of babysitting. She was thoughtless. However, as a mother surely you know that the school run, when you are feeling shit, really is tough. Sitting on your arse in front of the TV, peice of cake. So I don't see it as she did some work when she would have been helping you. Rather, she did some work when she was being paid by you so it was rather inconsiderate of her.

Enjoyingmycoffee1981 · 24/10/2014 19:49

I meant have a chat with "her"

Original poster
pommedeterre · 24/10/2014 21:15

Yep. Whilst shelling out a grand for her. Whoop.

Expressing (almost) exclusively gives you lots of mn time!

OP posts:
PossumPoo · 24/10/2014 23:21

How do people think its ok for the nanny to be off sick but work somewhere else?Confused

Sometimes I wonder about other posters and their moral compass while being thankful I dont work with people with this shit attitude

PossumPoo · 24/10/2014 23:25

And yes enjoy after reading that delightful post I mean posters like you.

She was "inconsiderate". Well fuck me.

HowDidThatWorkOut · 25/10/2014 01:27

OP, you are clearly not being 'U'. However, I would mention it to her as there might be a bit of a story behind it. It could be she agreed to it ages ago or was called to cover an emergency (Im trying to put a positive slant on this...) also, it would give her a chance to apologise.

It's not a huge major thing but it would bug me.

PowerPants · 25/10/2014 01:50

Hi *pomme8, some very very strange posters on here.

Your problem - you have been too generous. I have had nannies for eight years and started off, like you, paying full sick pay. After getting burned (like you) I started putting SSP only in the contract. Absenteeism dropped by 90%.

It's a funny one nannying - it is very hard to 'discipline' a nanny when you know that as you leave the house (s)he is going to be looking after your children all day!

You have my sympathy and i am really sorry you were given a rough ride on here.

Enjoyingmycoffee1981 · 25/10/2014 06:39

Possum, little bit aggressive there?!

I never said it was okay. It's not. But put it in to perspective, one night of babysitting. It's not right but I would argue it is not worthy of the time and energy the OP has spent stewing on it. I don't expect you to grasp that. Someone who gets as worked up as you in your post is going to get their knickers in a twist about the smallest of misdemeanors. So likewise, pleased I don't work with you! .

number2093847 · 25/10/2014 08:09

does she have a gp letter? Because if she does you could suggest a staggered return after it ends ie)shorter or fewer shifts the first week back

I havent read the thread so it maybe a daft idea

number2093847 · 25/10/2014 08:28

sorry just realised shes not on long term sick but just added a couple of days to the standard 2 weeks she was signed off for. I think thats ok but is a pain from your point of view

Maybe she really thought she was back to normal but wasn't. Lots of people make that mistake and take on too much too early after being under the weather - then they struggle badly. It can come as quite a surprise and can put a spanner in the works for even the most dedicated hard-working employee

She shouldn't have taken on any work during the two weeks she was signed off because she was signed off (with good reason) but i suspect she was over enthusiastic about her recovery and a bit silly and a bit thoughtless.

But yes it must be annoying for you. However it's only a few extra days and most women don't have a nanny while on maternity so you are generally quite fortunate to have the extra support you have

Original poster
pommedeterre · 25/10/2014 09:03

I am fortunate because i work very hard to be able to pay her? I am still working most evenings now.

Not sure fortunate is the right word to be honest, it's not a gift from god or anything.

That's the most riled I've got on this thread!

She will be taking them to the cinema and soft play next week working reduced hours anyway.

OP posts:
number2093847 · 25/10/2014 09:08

Good for you. I know an awful lot of wonderful hard working women but not one has had a nanny during maternity leave. Each to their own though, we all have different needs and life styles

number2093847 · 25/10/2014 09:13

youre working during a maternity leave? I can see that that might be essential if you run youre own business I guess

Original poster
pommedeterre · 25/10/2014 09:18

I am a director in a family business and there are parts of the business that desperately need me to oversee it even on Mat leave. I need to go back 3 days a week from when he's 3/4 months.

I don't need a nanny during mat leave but to keep her etc am paying her full whack and asking her to work part time during it. Most nannies get laid off during a mat leave but she hasn't.

Yes, as in my op, it's a 'version' of mat leave. Ds has been in the Office a good few Times already!

OP posts:
Shopgirl1 · 25/10/2014 09:20

I think you have been far too good to her reducing her hours while you are on maternity leave and maintaining full pay. From the facts here I also think she is taking advantage of this.

I would not pay sick pay after a period of say two weeks. I would also insist on seeing the doctors certs.

On her return I would have her working her normal hours if on full pay with no concession due to your maternity leave.