AIBU to wonder why the feck teacher training days can't be delivered in the holidays.

[Billynomates71]

Anyone?

They actually are in the teachers holidays. Teachers have 5 days less holiday a year pre training days but kids have the same

Teachers are only paid for 195 days a year......

My dd is now in Y11 and doing very well (thanks largely to the fabulous teacher she had for Y3 and Y4, who protected her from the class bully, inspired her in her work ethic and gave her self-confidence). This year dd can attend school until 5pm every day if she wants to, to do extra work in any GCSE subject she feels she needs a bit of help or practise on, or just wants to spend a bit of extra time on because she likes it.

Every GCSE subject has at least one teacher teaching until 5pm; there are also extra sessions at lunchtimes. This is in case a pupil wants some extra help. The teachers don't have to do it, I'm sure it's not in their contracts that they have to do extra teaching every week for Y11s. They do it because they want their pupils to achieve the best they can.

They're not doing it this year only, either. Last year they did it for those Y11s, and next year, they'll do it for those Y11s, and at some point they'll do it for your child, so every single year they are teaching until 5pm despite school finishing at 3:40. As someone said upthread, these are the people who are enabling your child to become a doctor, or a lawyer, or a vet or a nurse or even a teacher!

Yes, teachers are bloody marvellous.

It won't happen. Teachers are not paid for holidays therefore they would need to pay a lot more if they were taken away.

I would love that to be the case, however, I can just see the government changing the terms and conditions!

Then some ofthe unions will organise strikes against it and the media will slam lazy teachers, saying things like, 'why can't you do a full time job for your pay like the rest of us?!'

The profession would collapse-it's on the verge of it now, anyway.

I know that's very negative-I'm feeling glass half empty today

The OP might have left (under this name anyway) but there will doubtless be a similar goady thread soon. I give it a week.

Many years ago, more than I care to remember, I suggested on a thread that MNHQ should put up a sticky saying that INSET days are not taken from term time, but from teachers' holidays

Mumsnet hq-this is a brilliant idea-can't this be put at the top of the primary education forum?

All I have to say is that I can see why billynomates has got no mates!

My son's teacher last year ran a homework club (p4) which was a lifesaver. Twice a week an extra 45 minutes of her time was spent with the children giving the a snack then letting them get their homework done.

For my son who has dyslexia and dyspraxia homework is a meltdown littered battle ground at home. She showed him another way of tackling it. His p5 teacher doesn't do this (he does run a football team for the school outwith teaching hours) but the homework nut has been cracked. My life is easier, our evenings less stressful which benefits my whole family.

I know teachers and I know how hard they work. I wouldn't do it for £100k a year. I think some people think teachers work 9 until 3:30 then that's it! Add on marking time, lesson prep time, extra curricular activities etc. Also, most teachers I know spend a proportion of their holidays preparing for the next term.

"The reality is that you as teachers are paid on average a sum equivalent to many others working a 48week year, less public/bank holidays."

My CEO is paid on average a sum equivalent to my working a 100+ hours a week. I am paid on average a sum equivalent to the office cleaner working a 60+ hours a week... probably.

Some people earn more per hour and take home more pay at the end of the month than others. It's not a revelation is it?

As I understand it Children have always had 190 days in School.

After 1998 teachers lost 5 days Holiday and are now contracted to work 195 days a year and children are still in School for 190, the remaining 5 days allocated to training in what is commonly known as Inset Days, so children would still be off school irrespective of Training days.

What happened prior to 1998 when teachers had the extra week holiday and were contracted for 190 days and children had 190 school days, when did training happen?

This is a genuine question unless I have missed something and have to join the thick class…

A teacher does get 6 weeks paid annual leave though don't they? obviously this is not A/L that they can pick dates for but even so they're paid for it.
personally I wouldn't want to be a teacher, couldn't think of anything worse.
Teachers though need to appreciate that they do think they've got it hard. yes their pay is spread throughout the year but they do get a salary which is very good (as they should). I am a social worker average working hours for social workers are ridiculous, but this is part of the job and unofficially expected, if a child protection incident comes in it has to be dealt with so the worker cannot go home until the child is safe this may be 2 in the morning!
so in regards to teaching yes its not the 9-3 that the public assume but you are paid the same as for example a social worker who is contracted to 37 hours per week for46 weeks of the year.

I work in finance in the private sector. My husband is a teacher. I get only a third of the holidays he gets and he gets home earlier than me. But I earn almost twice as much as him and my job is less stressful. I wouldn't be a teacher for all any amount of holidays.

My DH school does traing in the evening every month......

So the whole school can get 3 extra days off!! :-)

the economy is rubbish quite frankly, and I do believe teachers on the whole do a fantastic job and understand that they work more hours than the 9-3 that many people think. The part that makes me cross is that many public sector workers think they have it so bad compared to private sector workers.

Its not a bed of roses anywhere for most people. I've not had a pay rise for a fair few years now, I don't have a union that can organise a strike for unfair working conditions. Many private sector workers have annual leave restrictions and can only go out of school holidays or certain weeks. Private sector workers have nowhere to complain, no organisation that can back them up in disputes.

A lot of the population are struggling with longer and longer unpaid hours in order to keep their jobs and incomes. I'm not saying that its right, but I am saying that perhaps teachers could feel a little bit more empathy to other workers and parents. Some schools are good at communicating when there will be inset days but other schools are shockingly bad, the same way that some employers are good when it comes to needing family leave at short notice and others are awful and won't allow short notice leave.

Maybe teachers do feel plenty of empathy, Help. But parenting forums don't tend to host weekly attacks on the working patterns of private sector workers.

but I am saying that perhaps teachers could feel a little bit more empathy to other workers and parents.

Teachers do not, generally, start conversations or threads saying things like-we work harder than everyone else/yay-inset today to piss off the working parents!/home at 3pm today-my life is so cushdy etc

What does tend to happen, is that some ill-informed person starts a conversation like

Why can't inset days be held during the holiday
Why can't the holidays be longer
Why can't the school day be longer
Why can't teachers appreciate that other jobs are harder.

To which teachers reply. Usually with empathy. Sometimes with anger-if it's a particularly vicious attack. But teachers are criticised a lot and it's hard to swallow sometimes.

I've seen the odd post on here moaning about social workers or health visitors. Not many, but a few. I've rarely seen others. There is usually a teacher bashing thread must weeks. Why is that?

"so in regards to teaching yes its not the 9-3 that the public assume but you are paid the same as for example a social worker who is contracted to 37 hours per week for 46 weeks of the year."

37 x 48 = 1776 hours

46 x 39 = 1794 hours

Many many teachers would work 46 hours + during term time weeks so are easily working the same amount as a social worker, just in more concentrated blocks. this is essentially the same argument I was trying to make re nurses.

Social workers typically work over and above the 37 hours they're contracted for - they couldn't manage their caseload in just 37 hours a week! Typically take home work typically work weekends.

For the same starting salary as a teacher.

Social workers typically work over and above the 37 hours they're contracted for - they couldn't manage their caseload in just 37 hours a week! Typically take home work typically work weekends.

Though social workers aren't criticised on a daily basis. Occasionally, but not because they're lazy and workshy.

Id disagree with you there! If any profession gets criticised heavily it's social work!

More than teachers? Really?!

Do you watch the news, read the press, read Mumsnet?

I think I've seen as many posts on here criticising social workers as teachers only no one jumps to their defence in the same way as teachers

It's been said that, if someone needs - say - a doctor's care they're usually grateful and pretty impressed as they don't really understand the complexities of what the doctor does

With teachers, however, everyone's been to school so everyone's an expert

Does that resonate with any other posters, I wonder??

Private sector workers have nowhere to complain, no organisation that can back them up in disputes.
I don't understand this. Unions are not just for public sector workers!