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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to feel uncomfortable about my son praying at school?

405 replies

KirjavaTheCat · 20/10/2014 11:53

DS is four and has just started reception. A couple of days ago, we were playing and he said something like "...and then we put our hands together without clapping like this, and shut our eyes and say, 'dear God' and then we say things"

I asked where he learned that and apparently they pray every morning. I find this odd because his class is made up of children from all different religious backgrounds, and it isn't a faith school. Why are they learning to worship?

We're not religious. I don't think I'm comfortable with him praying to 'God' every day. Should I say something? AIBU?

OP posts:
Nomama · 20/10/2014 13:24

weeder - melodramatic as in - if you read it without knowing you wrote it, that first sentence is a proper Call to Arms Smile

catkind · 20/10/2014 13:25

I didn't want my 4 yr old to be told the Easter story because of the torture and death aspect, never mind the rising from the dead aspect. Christmas story - as a story - fine, it has a cute baby in and animals and "fairies" (to quote DS). But the Easter story? No thanks. DS was traumatised by Charlie and the Chocolate factory at Reception age, I don't think he'd get on well with death on the cross.

I always encourage people who don't want their children taught praying to actually stick their necks out and withdraw them from collective worship. The more of us do it, the more mainstream it becomes and the less our children feel singled out.

ConfusedintheNorth · 20/10/2014 13:27

YANBU... opt them out!

weeder · 20/10/2014 13:28

What Nomama? Like the Salvation Army?

Hakluyt · 20/10/2014 13:28

Ok. There are loads of people for whom it's no big deal. Including, it would seem, many Christians. There are a few, me included, that think it is a big deal.

So why don't the people for whom it isn't a big deal just say "Oh, OK, it matters to you and I don't care, so we'll drop it then"?

schoolclosed · 20/10/2014 13:31

catkind I don't disagree - but I just don't feel able to impose on DD in that way. I have a strong political belief that education should be secular and I campaign for it - but I don't want to drag DD into it any further than I already do. I do feel slightly morally bankrupt, if it's any consolation.

ClapHandsIfYouBelieveInFatties · 20/10/2014 13:31

Collective worship is not about indoctrinating children. It's about giving them time to be thankful and to be quiet for a while. Some will directly be addressing God...others won't know who they are talking to.

Fairenuff · 20/10/2014 13:32

In our school, all we ask is that the children are quiet and respectful during prayers so that those who want to pray can. Those who don't want to are encouraged to use the time as a moment of quiet reflection.

Aeroflotgirl · 20/10/2014 13:32

Total overreaction tbh, give your ds the tools to make his own decisions. We used to have collective prayer in my non faith state school over 30 years ago. We had children from mixed religions there, does not mean they will turn into a deeply religious Christian.

Aeroflotgirl · 20/10/2014 13:33

Exactly Fairnough, chikdren don't have to participate, they can just sit quietly.

AMouseLivedinaWindMill · 20/10/2014 13:40

In our school, all we ask is that the children are quiet and respectful during prayers so that those who want to pray can.

I am not sure giving precedence to those who pray is a good thing.

Nomama · 20/10/2014 13:43

So why don't the people for whom it isn't a big deal just say "Oh, OK, it matters to you and I don't care, so we'll drop it then"?

Because that's a shite precedent to set, perhaps. The squeakiest wheel gets to set the pace, change laws determine how we live! Those of us who don't find it to be a big deal, as it stands, may also not feel comfortable in having it removed... so we speak up.

I am atheist myself, but grew up with religion in the extended family. I don't feel I was in any way beset or beleaguered by it, I just listened and chose to reject it.

I couldn't deprive my kids of that choice. It would, to me, seem to be belittling their ability to do as I did. To be forcing my views on them, depriving them of a little bit of knowledge.

Hakluyt · 20/10/2014 13:46

Why are you depriving children of knowledge by not wanting them to pray?

ilovesooty · 20/10/2014 13:48

I'm astonished that pa rents are sending their children to school and seemingly unaware of the required daily act of worship and their right to opt out.

ghostyslovesheep · 20/10/2014 13:49

But teaching people to respect faith and belief is ... By respect I mean tolerance and openness towards others

spidertracker summed it up nicely I think - we are a humanist family and I teach my children to respect others - which includes not belittling their faith

Original poster
KirjavaTheCat · 20/10/2014 13:49

I don't see how I've overreacted, I'll be honest. All I've done is expressed my discomfort. I'm not standing at the school with a placard.

OP posts:
Nomama · 20/10/2014 13:50

Not just the praying though, the whole religious aspect of schooling, small as it is. Religions exist. I wouldn't deprive any kid of the opportunity to learn about them and explore them and then make up their own minds.

I am not biased against religion, not scared of it, don't find it offensive, I simply choose not to believe in any god - well, no more than I do fairies at the bottom of the gardenSmile

Fairenuff · 20/10/2014 13:50

I am not sure giving precedence to those who pray is a good thing.

It's called respect, of course it's a good thing.

We all need to learn to be quiet and respectful at certain times. It's a life skill. No-one wants people chattering over their wedding vows, for example, or taking a phone call during a funeral service.

We need to learn to be considerate of others and to make a small space in our own lives in which we can show tolerance and acceptance of all faiths and in different circumstances.

At age four, the children would be asked to sit quietly for about 30 seconds, less time than it takes to call the register. As part of a daily routine, it is not a lot to ask and is important to others, if not yourself.

Quenelle · 20/10/2014 13:53

Quiet reflection is good. Teaching values is good. Giving congratulations for achievements is good. Celebrating good times is good.

So why can't schools do this without bringing a god into it? Gods are so insignificant to such a large portion of the school that praying to one of them in assembly is just irrelevant. Even the Church of England sees this.

As Hakluyt says, if it matters so little to some of you and had so little effect on you and your children, why can't we just drop it?

Hakluyt · 20/10/2014 13:53

"I wouldn't deprive any kid of the opportunity to learn about them and explore them and then make up their own minds."

Neither would I. What's that got to do with children praying in school?

fatlazymummy · 20/10/2014 13:53

Hakluyt what has praying got to do with learning?

socially · 20/10/2014 13:54

Meh, it's not going to kill him is it?

It's probably a lovely few minutes of peace and quiet for the teacher Smile

Hakluyt · 20/10/2014 13:54

"Hakluyt what has praying got to do with learning?"

Nothing.

HowDyaDo · 20/10/2014 13:56

ClapHandsIfYouBelieveInFatties, Aeroflotgirl, Fairenuff

As a supply teacher (primary), I find that this varies HUGELY in non-church schools. Some do assemblies with non-religious, moral stories and maybe ask the children to close their eyes and reflect on the moral for a while.

Other non-church schools have a visiting church groups and/ or vicars every week who's message is very clearly that these stories are facts, and recite the lords prayer at assembly every.

It really varies according to the leadership of the school. I used to work for an atheist Head and we did the absolute minimum we could get away with. I have also worked for a Catholic head and have felt quite uncomfortable in many of her assemblies at a non-church school.

Original poster
KirjavaTheCat · 20/10/2014 13:57

I was asked, at enrollment, if DS had any religion and we said no. I don't know why we weren't given information then, why is it assumed that because we don't have a religion we'll be comfortable with him praying as a Christian when he isn't one? Hmm.

ilovesooty I was completely unaware! It's been a while since I was at primary school and DS is our first child

OP posts: