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Original poster

unwanted houseguests

654 replies

Cuppachaplz · 07/10/2014 15:08

I know that I am probably going to get slated here, but...

About 3 weeks ago, a friend of mine who is semi-retired and lives abroad for the summer, but returns to the UK in the winter to work, messaged me out of the blue to ask if he and his girlfriend could stay for a couple of days at the end of October while the found somewhere to live as he had secured a job close to me and his daughter who he normally stays with in the winter was planning to get lodgers. I am 28 weeks pregnant (or possibly more depending on which scan you believe), having a horrendous pregnancy with a past history of recurrent miscarriage, and working (writing) from home. He is aware of all this, and said it would be 'just a week, two at the absolute most'. I also explained that i had a house full the last week in October (half term, and planning to see as many friends as possible before arrival of baby), and that I am trying to get the house sorted for the baby in addition to an important work deadline in November, but that a few days was fine.

We don't have a lot of space, so they would be on the sofa be on the dining room. Spare room is tiny, and currently waiting for us to decorate for baby, so no good for 2 people even for a couple of days.

I got a call 9 days ago, saying that he was arriving 2 days later, i.e. a month earlier than stated. I was a bit put out, as I had already explained how much i had to get done, but figured I could crack on after the 'few days'.

He rang again the night before saying he assumed that someone would be in all day. Generally no, as we all work, and too late to get time off, but as I am working from home atm, I could be in. Was just irritated that this was assumed, as normally would be a no, and I have had hospital appts at least twice weekly for the last few weeks.

He arrived with a hire car rammed full of tons of stuff, which he proceeded to dump in our garage (my husband's workshop etc), and my dining room. I have had to fold up and move the dining room table, so we all have to eat off the breakfast bar in the kitchen, with my husband and I standing up. He then moaned that I didn't have a car available as he wanted to take his hire car back and have me give him a lift home. I have never owned a car, and drive very infrequently, so odd request. I asked how he was planning to get to work, to find out that the job had fallen through.

Initially he asked if I wanted them to get any shopping, or do anything. As I had just done a full shop, I suggested that if he wanted to, he could maybe get us a takeaway at the weekend instead, as I felt like crap, and had spent the whole day driving him around looking for things. This got me an earful as he claimed to have no money (why offer to buy groceries then? I wasn't suggesting anything elaborate), so I went to bed early and showed him where I keep leftovers on the freezer, while Dh finished jobs in the kitchen. They got said takeaway anyway and then proceeded to put hot contained directly on top of raw meat in the fridge.

I am massively overheating atm, so had asked if windows could be left open to stop the house turning into a sweatbox. This was ignored, and he now walks around behind me shutting them.

He now has a job, but announced yesterday that it will take 'several weeks' to save any deposit for a house...

He has also asked me if he can claim housing benefits at this address, I suspect totally illegally.

When they are in, I cannot work as TV on v loud, and with them in the dining room and sat watching this in living room, is no space left, so I spend my time upstairs.

I am now thoroughly miserable, spending most days half crying, and can't see a way out. I am 29 weeks pregnant, so appreciate that i am being hormonal and may be over-reacting, and probably only have myself to blame, but I am also desperate to get organised before the baby arrives, and can't believe they would take advantage of me like this.

Sorry for very long, whining post, but unsure how to proceed now.

And now, let the 'you've made your bed...' - bashing commence

TIA

OP posts:
YeGodsAndLittleFishes · 12/10/2014 09:45

Hm, thanks for pointing out my error, pedant, you're right that it probably wouldn't put the OP in a good light, thinking about it like that.

Such a shame that some people will take advantage of any remote friendship to the extent that this man and his partner has done.

kiwimumof2boys · 13/10/2014 09:38

Update OP?
Hope you and your DC and baby are OK

TheMaddHugger · 13/10/2014 09:54

Hugs OP. How are You ?

Greenkit · 13/10/2014 10:49

Shocked

CornChips · 13/10/2014 11:14

I have just read this whole thread with my mouth open with shock. Thanks OP- are you better today? Hope all is well.

notinagreatplace · 13/10/2014 11:16

It's an urban myth that opening someone else's post is illegal in the UK. It is illegal to do so "wilfully and maliciously" and to do anything that will delay/prevent delivery but it is not illegal to do per se.

I agree that in the short term you should return to sender "not known at this address" but I would strongly recommend starting to open them if they are still coming in a couple of months time. I kept getting letters for someone who had previously lived in my flat and kept returning them, eventually I opened one to discover that a firm of bailiffs were quite close to coming round to my flat... so I called them and explained and they were fine.

TreadSoftlyOnMyDreams · 13/10/2014 11:55

Definitely open the mail. I had a temp lodger for a month as a favour - he set up his own limited company, opened bank and credit accounts, took out a loan and all kinds, then buggered off overseas leaving me to deal with endless bank letters and debt agencies.

Ellasmum16 · 13/10/2014 14:28

Absolutely shocking! Hope you're ok.

purplemeggie · 13/10/2014 17:59

It's not an urban myth. The offence - Postal Services Act 2000 section 84 (3) is states that a person commits an offence if, "intending to act to a person's detriment and without reasonable excuse, he opens a postal packet which he knows or suspects has been incorrectly delivered to him."

If you were prosecuted, you would have to argue that you had a "reasonable excuse". Now, whilst, in the circumstances, it might seem reasonable to open the letters to find out what your "friend" did whilst at your address, the law would probably consider that you could prevent the harm that you are trying to avoid (him carrying out fraud/crimes at your address) by returning the mail to sender marked "never resident at this address" at which point the sender would have a duty to deal with the matter.

You're definitely on safer ground if you return post unopened.

DadDadDad · 13/10/2014 19:55

But there's an "and" in that legal clause, so to be prosecuted you would have to be shown to have acted to person's detriment AND have no reasonable excuse.

Original poster
Cuppachaplz · 13/10/2014 20:42

Thanks for ongoing messages.
Mail has all been returned unopened, and I have logged this with police.

I have accidentally opened wrong house mail before on the not unreasonable assumption that I am the only adult in the house so it was for me (pre DH moving in), had to return with 'opened in error' in addition to 'unknown at this address'. I suppose it could conceivably happen again if mail persists? ;)

I think DH wants to move stuff into shed as weather has turned and he wants his garage back. I'm not getting involved there, but once it's out it will be easier for me to ignore/forget.

The baby and I are fine - thanks everyone, but I feel I have gone back to square 1, if not worse, with regards to panic and nerves about the attack I suffered previously, but that's another story...

Here's hoping for restful end yo the last trimester, and baby cooking for a good while yet :) thanks again for all your support xx

OP posts:
TheMaddHugger · 14/10/2014 01:30

((((((Hugs)))) and glad you are still 'cooking that baby'

sprinkles baby sticky dust all around you

When you feel up to it, find a therapist or counselor group.

Rainbunny · 14/10/2014 01:55

OP - I've been lurking but I just wanted to ask, is there anything in your previous interaction with this person that gave you a hint that he could act so outrageously? (Genuine question, no criticism implied at all). It's just insane how quickly he did certain things - made keys, arranged for mail to arrive. I definitely think he has been through before and you mentioned his DD seems familiar with his behaviour. He's clearly a desperate man willing to do desperate things, not to excuse him in anyway.

Hope it's all done.

Original poster
Cuppachaplz · 14/10/2014 08:48

rainbunny not really.
As I have said, he was the estranged dad of one of my uni flat mates, who I did a work placement with in my 2nd year (so getting on for 20 years ago), stayed vaguely in touch since..
I have always been aware that he falls out with families for a pastime, but they seemed to be one of those families; hot blooded and reactionary IYKWIM. Given that both DH and I are pretty calm and even tempered, I had never had any reason to lock horns I guess. I had commented to DH when they first met that he would notice that nothing was never his fault, and to take what he said with a pinch of salt. Stories which had to be substantially elaborated, or even I/we had been there and the details had been expanded to provoke mire of a response etc, but nothing seemed sinister.
Painful lesson learned I guess.
I do wonder now though, how hard it would have been to shift things on if I hadn't have totally panicked... Ie if I wasn't already neurotic following previous encounter and reacted in a manner which I assume he thought was a total over reaction (and totally unlike me)...

OP posts:
Rainbunny · 14/10/2014 17:54

Thanks for the update. Honestly I wouldn't worry about whether you overreacted - he'd clearly have still been living with you 6 months on if you hadn't acted so quickly. He deliberately ignored your polite requests and trampled all over your hospitality (he was obviously setting up for a very long stay with you). He would not have left on his own steam so you did what you had to do.

MexicanSpringtime · 14/10/2014 18:45

Ie if I wasn't already neurotic

Of course you are totally neurotic, OP, you have a delicate pregnancy. Maybe if you hadn't been told that you should avoid stress you wouldn't stress so much, but fortunately you are none the worse for this awful experience, no thanks to your dodgy lodger.

ChasedByBees · 14/10/2014 20:53

I'm with your DH - get his stuff into the shed!

Pumpkinification · 14/10/2014 23:15

How awful, bless you!

I'd speak to CAB or similar to check your legal position regarding storing their belongings, ie how long do you need to, does this create any obligation on you, what if the ex-friend doesn't return? I would assume you can't sell the stuff as that would be theft, can you give it to charity, or tip it & get a receipt? How much of a problem would it be if it stayed in your shed for ages, would you be liable if it got damp, or stolen, for example?

mimishimmi · 15/10/2014 01:28

You weren't being neurotic at all. You had to act fast because he was certainly planning on staying with you for the long term ....

missnevermind · 15/10/2014 06:13

So there has been post for him Shock

Was it official looking?
He was intending to stay long enough to have let people know his change of address.

TheMaddHugger · 15/10/2014 06:27

seriously, I've been re routing my DD's mail that comes here instead, to her house.

Every frickin week.

how did this ?? Bozo manage to get his mail to go to YOUR house so quick

TheMaddHugger · 15/10/2014 06:29

?? why did :o Shock become a grinning smiley WTF ????????????

Sorry OP, it was NOT a grinning smiley I intended

Original poster
Cuppachaplz · 15/10/2014 16:30

F**k knows, but it's all going straight back where it came from!

DH pointed out that while he accepts he required payslips etc from work to go somewhere, but that should have been recorded as a temporary address or marked c/o, both of which should be visible on the address label.

Wondering how the shed roof is holding up in this weather... Hmm

OP posts:
Hissy · 15/10/2014 16:42

I'd open it up and return it 'opened in error' not at this address - you need to know what he has perpetrated under your address - what if he takes out credit?

ZuluBob · 15/10/2014 16:54

I'd 'accidently' open it too.

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