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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask all Scottish MNrs to work together 2

999 replies

siiiiiiiiigh · 21/09/2014 14:09

Sorry, filled the last thread with this, thought I'd better be part of Team Scottish MN and work together for those of us on the old thread...

Here's Armando's thoughts. I vote him in for everything.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/sep/21/scottish-referendum-massive-voter-turnout-means-politics-changed-for-ever

OP posts:
claig · 22/09/2014 09:54

It's OK, can't be helped. he was nearly crying when he kept banging on about it.

HappyScotProudBrit · 22/09/2014 09:58

I thought the point of the independence referendum was to trust the people in Scotland to make decisions about the future of Scotland. We made a decision and has not even been respected for a week. Apparently we're too old, too greedy and too stupid to know what we voted for

^ that is just worth repeating. again and again and again

trixymalixy · 22/09/2014 09:58

I thought the point of the independence referendum was to trust the people in Scotland to make decisions about the future of Scotland. We made a decision and has not even been respected for a week. Apparently we're too old, too greedy and too stupid to know what we voted for

^^this

Spiritedwolf · 22/09/2014 10:05

Blush Damn... if I'd typed it on Facebook or Twitter, just think of the likes and RTs it would have gotten... I don't think I've had so many people quote me on MN before. Grin

I thought the point of the independence referendum was to trust the people in Scotland to make decisions about the future of Scotland. We made a decision and has not even been respected for a week. Apparently we're too old, too greedy and too stupid to know what we voted for

Spiritedwolf · 22/09/2014 10:06

^Of course it does mean that my mistake has been copied too. "it has not even been respected for a week"

trixymalixy · 22/09/2014 10:07

I am considering posting it on Facebook.

Secretblackandmidnighthag · 22/09/2014 10:08

Too many characters for twitter wolf! Grin

flippinada · 22/09/2014 10:12

I don't think that middle class yes voters are more important - I was just pointing out that this particular demographic exists.

Some areas that you might have expected to vote yes didn't.

HappyScotProudBrit · 22/09/2014 10:15

I don't think I've had so many people quote me on MN before. Grin

then keep coming out with wee strokes of genius like that and you'll be famous by week's end.

all jokes aside though, you summed up EXACTLY what the issue at hand here is. Either we Scot's can are capable of making our own mind up about what's best for us. In which case, we have, by a 55% majority. If we were incapable last week, because we are too old or greedy or stupid or self-centred or whatever, what difference would any future vote make? Either we are capable or we aren't. It is high time that people ACCEPTED the results their country made.

Behoove · 22/09/2014 10:21

anyway
We've agreed 'the media' didn't please either side
We've agreed (I hope) that everyone voted based on what they thought best

What happens now?

Spiritedwolf · 22/09/2014 10:22

A twitter friendly version?

Point of #indyref was to trust Scots to make decisions about Scotland. We made one. Now told we're too old, greedy & stupid to make it.

Behoove · 22/09/2014 10:27

Wish there was a 'like' button

tabulahrasa · 22/09/2014 10:34

"I don't think that middle class yes voters are more important - I was just pointing out that this particular demographic exists."

So do lots of other demographics, the comments about middle class voters either thinking of others or not thinking of others were patronising voters who had their own opinions and votes, just as older people did.

SirChenjin · 22/09/2014 10:35

Anyone seen today's Telegraph?

"Adam Tomkins, professor of public law at the University of Glasgow, said unilaterally declaring independence was illegal and bonkers.

"If Scotland were oppressed, if Scotland were not free, if Scotland were colonised then it might well be that unilateral declarations of self-determination would be looked up kindly by the international community," he said.

"But none of these circumstances applies. Not only is Scotland completely not a colony it is not a colony of the UK but part of the UK but the UK itself has been, in international terms, extremely generous with Scotland."

The academic said Westminster had given Scotland legal powers to hold a referendum and pledged not to block its departure if the country voted Yes, undermining the idea that Scotland was being held captive by the UK"

Alex Salmond needs to stop stirring the soup pot. A referendum works by democracy, with voters considering the arguments from both sides and voting accordingly. Unless AS is now proposing that everyone has to have the ballot papers okayed by him personally before they can post them into the box, with certain demographics forbidden from voting in case they influence the results? The hypocrisy of the man is breathtaking - quite how he gets away with half of what he says is beyond me. No other PM in the UK would.

Secretblackandmidnighthag · 22/09/2014 10:37

behoove ^We've agreed 'the media' didn't please either side
We've agreed (I hope) that everyone voted based on what they thought best^

That there are greedy, auld, stupit people on both sides of the vote? Grin

Right, joking aside, perhaps lets say - it's Monday now. The dust has settled a bit. None of us are going to change our minds about the vote we cast right at this minute (I am still disappointed and emotional about it, but not quite as extreme as I was at 4am on Friday morning!). Can we draw a line under the way both campaigns were run, because that's over. We can't change it, and hashing it out over and over is doing my head in. Lets ignore bad behaviour on twitter/FB etc because that really doesn't represent the majority of Scottish people in either camp that I know.

Just suggestions of course. It's early days so maybe folk still want to debate more about both campaigns and find it beneficial and interesting. I meant for purposes of this thread - Scottish people coming together.

What else do we all want? Westminster to follow up on their promises.

Behoove · 22/09/2014 10:38

Agree, that whole idea is bonkers. He was rabble rousing. Maybe he should try having some dignity in defeat.

HappyScotProudBrit · 22/09/2014 10:39

We've agreed (I hope) that everyone voted based on what they thought best

that's the issue though, too many people STILL don't think that NO voters voted based on what they thought was best. Far too many STILL think NO voters were greedy or stupid or too old to know better. Until YES voters get that chip off their shoulder, and judging by posts made just this very morning, then I don't think we can move forward. To be able to move forward then the YES side are going to have to admit that the NO side was every bit as educated, clever, socially aware, caring and brave as they were. But they (too many of them) can't or won't admit that.

I keep wanting to join this debate and move on from the referendum, but I keep being put off by posts like those earlier this morning blaming scared/selfish oldies for the no result. I for one find discussion quite difficult when there are so many chips on so many shoulders.

Behoove · 22/09/2014 10:43

What else do we all want? Westminster to follow up on their promises
This, and more.

Like a lot of people I didn't vote based on the promises, they are a bonus. I want more now. Whether that is full devo-max in a federal system? I don't know enough about it yet. Hoping someone who does can explain it and what it would mean to our fellow nations.

Secretblackandmidnighthag · 22/09/2014 10:43

Happy but surely we can try and move the discussion on without waiting for EVERYONE to agree? I mean you must know that will never happen.

SirChenjin · 22/09/2014 10:44

What else do we all want? Westminster to follow up on their promises

...and Alex Salmond et al to stop banging on about alternative routes to independence and certain demographics 'letting Scotland down' (I paraphrase, obv, but you know what I mean)

Behoove · 22/09/2014 10:44

happy
Ignore the chips - what would you want to happen now?

Secretblackandmidnighthag · 22/09/2014 10:46

SirChenjin well mumsnet is powerful but it ain't powerful enough to silence Eck! Think you might have to put something else on your wishlist.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 22/09/2014 10:48

I keep wanting to join this debate and move on from the referendum, but I keep being put off by posts like those earlier this morning blaming scared/selfish oldies for the no result. I for one find discussion quite difficult when there are so many chips on so many shoulders.

I just wanted to say, that while I don't condone negativity towards No voters, it is understandable. A lot of people are genuinely grieving, and anger and lashing out is part of the process.

What is absolutely bonkers is the amount of vitriol shown towards Yes voters - the Nos won - why the need to give Yessers an absolute kicking?

ChelsyHandy · 22/09/2014 10:50

I'm guessing I'm probably not welcome on this thread because I don't really want to "work together" with people to make Devo Max or Scotland or whatever work. That's the job of the government - I pay taxes - they run the country. I don't expect to pay taxes and to have to work out the running of the country as well.

I'm utterly fed up of all the carry on going on in Scotland and not knowing what will happen from one day to the next, what rate of tax I will be paying next year and the year after, whether my property is going to be devalued or not, whether DH's job will still exist.

As I've said before, DH has a job interview at the beginning of next week in Holland, I've worked in Brussels before and will be able to get another job if I'm located there, we are planning to sell up and leave because we are just sick of it. The megalomaniac out of control Salmond and his awful behaviour is just another nail in the coffin. He is a dreadful leader, with all sorts of issues and problems which are manifesting himself in his creation of division and unrest.

Can always move back if Scotland settles down again, but you only have one life, there are plenty of nice countries to live it in.

By the way, I do come on here to relax away from work, not to have my posts scrutinised for ideological flaws.

SirChenjin · 22/09/2014 10:50

The Grim Reaper is the only person who will silence Wee Eck....and even then he'll still be arguing as he goes over Grin

Joking aside - it's not a one way street. WM has to deliver, but just as importantly (if not more so), AS has to accept that he lost. The people of Scotland chose unity over division, and to threaten to overrule that is utterly contemptible.