Indyref 11. The home of good manners

[grovel]

!0,000 and counting.

They, the majority of voters, voted knowing that a referendum was part of the deal.

Good Google skills btw.

Rita

It's just an MN thread. If you're so upset about it why not hide it and turn your attention elsewhere?

Well how else am I supposed to know the exact numbers? What a stupid comment.

26% is not a majority.

Empowering no!

I have lost faith on Scotland as a stable part of the UK. I want out. I want to live in the pluralistic modern UK and I want my children to have the opportunities that country gives. it isn't perfect that's for sure but I want to be part of making it better.

However it will be hard to do with jobs and house and children! But I have great hope for the future. If I can get out of Scotland.

Could we somehow sneak Carol Craig onto the ballot paper?

They are an elected government, elected by the majority of voters.

Are we really arguing this? Talk about back to basics.

You really believe the SNP won't push again?

I do believe that they wouldn't push again for a reasonable number of years. I think that they are determined, yes, but they are also intelligent enough to realise that having another referendum on the issue too soon would stir up a lot of bad blood, and be likely to result in a resounding defeat.

The arming of police! I cannot believe how little attention this has received by the press and public.

The fear card comes out on a regular basis on these threads because it's impossible to argue against without sounding like a complete cunt

How right you are.

Oh dear!

this will give the 'Nos' a boost I would say. Talk about dragging the debate down to a new low:

*Later, when asked by reporters why she felt Alex Salmond's campaign for an independent Scotland was best for the country, designer Vivienne Westwood said: 'I hate England.'

'I like Scotland because somehow I think they are better than we are. They are more democratic,' she said, later brandishing those voting to stay in the UK in Thursday's vote as 'frightened and stupid'.*

She draped herself in the Saltire and sent her models down the runway at London fashion week wearing 'yes' badges.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2755652/Tartan-loving-designer-Vivienne-Westwood-pledges-support-Yes-campaign-Scottish-independence-slamming-unionists-frightened-stupid.html

Santana, sometimes people have to move with their jobs. It's relatively common. If the company your DH works for has that as it's will, and you are not agreeable, then maybe, even if there's a no vote your DH should think of a move (from that company, not Scotland) anyway.

Rita and I find Salmond and co.'s views selfish in their own way too. We all have different viewpoints.

Yes, he's actually thinking of retraining and becoming the face of the childcare initiative.

It is not relatively common for your job to be voted out of a country, but thank you for the ever so patronising and rather unhelpful advice.

Teamscotland and Rita you are being patronising beyond belief. Thanks for telling us how we should live our lives and you have a hotline to my employer that tells you something different to what I have been told.

Thank you bogqueen for your response. I don't agree with it at all but such is democracy.

A comma would have helped after Rita, -like that!

Several points and then I'm off for the night (probably!!). I feel enormous compassion for those who are worrying about the future in the event of the vote going not their way. Clumsily put, I know, but there are concerns on both sides. Any prospective upheaval is a dreadful thing, and at present, in the last few days, I think the uncertainty is awful. I am a definite Yes. And I have all sorts of fears for the future (for the family as well as me) should Scotland remain part of the UK. I don't really want to go into them as I am afraid it will out me. And it's all quite personal. Also, to a point the bias on this thread means I may well have my remarks analysed and misconstrued. Possibly shouted down. Things will never be the same in Scotland if the majority vote No this week.

Can I also remind you all it was the WM government who refused the third question on the ballot paper. I assume this was cockiness on the part of ShinyDave that No would prevail, and DevoMax was therefore unnecessary. I wonder if some others expected Yes to be so unpopular it would never get this close. I am sure some of you will find lots to blame Alex Salmond for, but that isn't one of them. If you ask the people what they want in a democracy, then you won't always get the answer you wall want. As you were, folks.

Or by Yes voters.

As for building bridges Salmond has just been on television attempting to look presidential flanked by 2 Saltires and saying he will work as hard as he can to reach a settlement.

Ffs we haven't even had the referendum yet. What a vile man he is.

Why would he be voted out?

Has he been issued notice in event of a yes? Has his employer told him officially that's the case and why?

In the industry I work in people move all round the world to stay in work. Not patronising you in any way.

TS, that's disgusting.
You want to disrupt peoples' lives for the sake of a failed strategy that's going to drag down their country. Bugger up your own career if you like, but leave others' alone.

Santana, you have my deepest sympathy.

Because EU fucking law demands that banks must be domiciled in the country where the majority of their customers live.

You are patronising me, TeamScotland, and I don't appreciate it.

And his, pr anyone else claiming they are being forced out, job is safe forever if we say no?

Thanks sallying.

No, his job is not safe forever if there is a no vote. But that is an entirely different creature to a yes vote.

A yes vote takes away the economies of scale which lower prices, creates a smaller economy more susceptible to global fluctuations, and will create a recession.

Don't agree because market forces will still operate and supermarket chains who want to hang on to their market share will need to keep their prices competitive. Aldi and Lidl, who operate across a large area of Europe, don't seem to have a problem keeping prices down regardless of which county they are operating in.

These are real people, with real fears for what will happen to their jobs, marriages, homes & futures should we end up with a 'yes' majority.

I agree and sympathise. Lots of No voters are worried about the implications for them and their families. But there is also a concerted campaign at the moment to make people feel scared.

If you look at the current economic situation of the UK as a whole, it is actually worse than the project starting point for an independent Scotland. No-one is suggesting that the UK can't go it alone, however.

It's not a choice either between independence or the status quo. There is no guarantee of job security or economic prosperity - or even social cohesion - in the UK as a whole - in fact, there are many alarming potential roads which the UK may go down in the not-too-distant future.

I personally think that you have to see through the prophecies of doom to the opportunities. An independent Scotland would be one of the wealthiest countries in the world, and would be able to grow the different sectors of our economy and increase our prosperity through targeted policies meeting our own needs and aspirations. I believe that the opportunities are truly exciting.

This referendum boils down to whether you think what we have is the best we can do (widening inequality, democratic deficit, not being able to make our own decisions) or whether you dare to believe that things could be different and better, and that the people of Scotland are just as able as the people of every other independent country to take over full responsibility for their own lives.