To not want to see SIL ever again!!!

[han3459]

My SIL and I have always differed completely on how we raise our DDs. Both of our eldest girls are 12 and it's become a constant issue between us.

Whilst SIL is a controlling psycho stricter parent (in my opinion), I am much more relaxed with my DD. For example, I let my DD wear some make up, paint her nails, has two ear piercings and occasionally will go on trips to town with her friends. I try to let my DD have some independence by letting her make decisions such as what to wear (within reason), choosing the activities she wants to participate in, and how to spend her pocket money.

SIL totally disagrees with most of these and has made this known on many occasions. She refuses to let DD go anywhere without adult supervision, won't let her wear anything she doesn't like and is totally anti any kind of make up/hair straightening etc. I do feel sorry for my DN as she is constantly not allowed to do things my DD can do, which must be hard for her.

I totally understand people have different ways of raising their children and DD is respectful of different rules in other people's houses. However, my SIL is constantly criticizing me and my DD in front of us about parenting which drives me insane.

Lately things have got much worse. A few weeks ago, SIL and BIL took DN and DD out for the day. When they stopped at a restaurant, SIL repeatedly told off DD for eating with her cutlery the wrong way round and forced her to use them the other way. I could not care less which way she uses them as long as she doesn't use her fingers and was furious as DD said she struggled to eat her meal. When I rang SIL about this, she said it was my fault for not teaching her proper social etiquette.

The last straw was a few days ago. SIL and DN came over as we were planning a family trip out. My DD was wearing a knee length dress with some mid calf length boots. It was a very cute little outfit in my opinion. However, SIL instantly made her opinion that it was inappropriate and asked my DD to change because she didn't want her daughter to thing it was an acceptable way to dress.

This led to an absolutely huge row, with SIL storming out after I refused to tell DD to change. I am so sick of having to put up with the constant judgement from her and don't think it's fair on my DD to be criticized all the time. I do feel for my DN but AIBU to stop seeing SIL so often??? All it causes is stress

sorry "loudly" not "poudly"!

Seriously out of everything the cutlery thing is the most shocking thing?? Some people are so fucking sneery, jeez you do you think you are?! It's cutlery, the hand in which I hold my knife and fork share no deeper insight into my personality/upbringing than whether my postman is French.

I love the (probably apocryphal) story of the queen drinking the hot lemon water so that a guest wasn't embarrassed. Now thats table manners.

All the fork angst.

Bit petite bourgeoisie innit?

Table manners and politeness - good

Getting all bent out of shape about the 'correct' way to hold a bit of cutlery - wank

Moreis - I think the most shocking thing about the cutlery thing is that the SIL felt the need to make the OP's DD change her usual way of eating for that one meal out! How dare she? What an appalling hostess she must be! Especially as it clearly caused the DD problems while eating. :(

She sounds too much. Insisting your daughter goes to change because she doesn't like her outfit? Er no. I find that excessive.

I have a five year old and have already found she is very insistent on what she wears. I will probably let her choose her own clothes soon as it's not wirth the arguments. Ear piercing at 12 is fine. They have them at borth where I live! It is rude and mean to invite someone to lunch then consistently pick at their table manners.

YANBU.

devere they will be the MIL being complained about by the next generation on MNers

At the risk of being absolutely flamed being snobby about cutlery is a bit Mrs Bucket (aka "Keeping up appearances" tv show). People who are very upper class generally do not care as long as there is no infringement on their own personal enjoyment. In fact many upper class people embrace the eccentricities of each other and so it may be mentioned in passing but certainly not in a derogatory way.

I have been at an extremely upper class dinner party (think long table, extremely wealthy and royal people, huge stately home) and lo and behold we had some sort of miniature brussel sprouts as part of the meal and oh the shame of it as I tried to "spear" some on my fork they shot away from me and rolled a good few foot along the table. I was absolutely dying of embarrassment but thankfully everyone began to chortle and a member of the waiting staff came along with a miniature silver dustpan and brush and brushed them up :)

I will never forget that :)

For the record I am left handed and use my fork etc the "right" way but I honestly can't say I noticed what others did and I don't think they would have noticed either.

Yabu

I think you are prematurely sexualising your dd.

Oh ffs.

Can't believe the fuss people are making over ear piercings. She is twelve! They are in her ears! Babies get their ears pierced where I live. You would implode!

Yes its well know that the incorrect use of a fork induces puberty.

True fact.

Heres the thing,yiure not super cool mum because you allow fashionable clothes,piercing
Nor is she draconian mum for not choosing that style
This isnt about the kids,at all.its two adults who cant keep it cordial.and enact gripes via their kids

Oh the ridiculous snobbery regarding the "correct" way to use cutlery really is quite breathtaking in its own, special little cuntish way

And the irony, as pp have pointed out, is that it is the height of bad manners to pick up and pass comment on other peoples dining habits.

Are Americans all staggeringly crass because they dare to hold their fork in the wrong hand??

Typically absurd that a thread would be derailed by such an insignificant point.

Your SIL was very rude to say anything about the cutlery and the outfit. The bulk of the population would never dream of being so rude as to say that your dd has bad table manners or that she dresses inappropriately for her age, however that doesn't mean they don't think it.

I had parents who were far too right on to care about such bourgeoise nonsense as table manners, which meant as an adult I had a steep learning curve, because in a professional world, it matters. (And the learning curve was harder, because as discussed, most adults would consider it the height of rudeness to point out someone else's lack of manners, meaning those lacking manners don't always realise others do think they are being uncouth). You aren't doing your dd any favours by not teaching the basics, she's old enough to learn.

I can't see it holding her back professionally, I have to say.

devere you made me chortle.

I honestly don't think I have ever been judged for my poor cutlery skills, and I probably would seriously change my opinion of someone who did. Maybe I have been silently judged and found wanting?

I must admit I thought the ear piercings would make man froth. You live and learn hey?

I didn't see dh's SIL for 5 years because I'd had enough of being yelled at by someone who wanted everything her way and because of something my dh put a stop to, she took it out on my dd and I said "don't ever speak to me again!"

We've met for coffee and had a few texts recently as our ds's are the same age and leaving primary.

I don't regret breaking contact at all but I am taking every thing very slowly at the moment. We're going to visit them in August as they've moved away. I think the break did us good but I know she and BIL think I am too strict and don't give my children room to breathe but they have learned not to comment on the way I parent as I have never commented on their parenting.

Yanbu, she sounds very controlling. I wouldn't be surprised if she is getting a few "but minihan does it" from her dd.

Fwiw. Not that it matters. But I got my second ear piercings at 11, courtesy of Nana, who then got hers done.

First hair dye at 12, belly piercing at 12. Little bits of make up since I was 5/6, bought proper make up around 11/12.

Travelled to school alone from 11, took around 2 hours including a schoolbus, walk, public bus, tram, and another walk.

I'm not in prison, I'm not a hooker, I value myself, I have a decent education, and I still have my piercings and dyed hair!

She has the basics. She can hold a knife and fork and feed herself in an appropriate manner.

Not wanting to insist on someone else's idea of the 'right' way to hold a knife and fork is a different matter.

What SIL decrees is right might be considered the height of vulgarity by someone else.

Ive never been impeded in my professional career by knowledge/ familiarity of cutlery

AllThatGilstens - I worked for a large multinational before becoming a sahm, they would put together guides for people going to do business in other countries and I was asked to look at one for American colleagues coming to the UK for meetings. The correct way to use cutlery in the UK was mentioned.

Am I one of the few who has actually read the OP's posts?

Just because her dd holds her knife and fork in the opposite hands does not mean she lacks table manners. It's not as if she was chewing with her mouth open and farting at the table is it? Ffs

And as for 'sexualising' a 12 year old? Really? By wearing a knee length dress? Then we're all doomed.

Me neither.

And i be been to functions with our directions and the like and the behaviour of a 12 year old would out them to shame.

Providing a guide to other countries cultures is not the same thing, no one lost a job over a knife and fork alone I would say.

And even if it was really important - there was a guide!

Maybe she will be big in the USA then it won't matter.

I was taught to hold my cutterly 'the right way round' but I thought it was because I was right handed, so therefore it's easier for me, not because it's actually the 'correct' way

OP when I was twelve, I sometimes wore make up, nail varnish and had my ears pierced. I also used to get a bus in to town every Saturday with my friends. I don't think my Mum would appreciate anyone telling her that I shouldn't be wearing a particular outfit either.