to think that Rainbows and Brownies should be scrapped...

[Bardette]

...and all kids can just go to Beavers and Cubs.
In our area there is a long waiting list for Beavers. My son would like to join a colony but we have been told there it will be at least a term until a space will be available.
Girls can go to Rainbows or Beavers, but boys can only go to Beavers. As girls take up half the spaces in Beavers and all the spaces in Rainbows that means three times the number of places available to girls in local clubs.
Surely it would make more sense and be fairer to have two Beaver colonies?

Yabu, however beavers , scouts etc should only take boys.

If I could like posts on MN, I'd like yours, fatowl!

Thinking about the last few years with my Brownie pack, we've done orienteering, taken the older ones camping to a big regional event, Chinese crafts, scavenger hunts, fingerspelling, archery, canoeing, thinking about whether careers should only be for 'boys' or 'girls', Scottish dancing, cooking, a trip to London...

If anyone would like to find out more, either in terms of being a volunteer or for their daughter:

www.girlguiding.org.uk/get_involved/register_your_interest.aspx

What a silly idea. I thought cubs/etc opened up to girls as they were short on leaders and recruits and having girls increased their range?

Brownies and guides have huge waiting lists. No nedd to open up to boys and im ever so glad they don't.

Scout leaders I know say that the guides have a lot more money, the scouts would LOVE the Guides to merge & bring some of that wealth over.

I'll say it again...

It depends on the girls you have

Brownies and rainbows choose their own activities, it is not a case of "adding them to their agenda"

What fatowl said :)

Im very much hopinh my girls will do campomg, abseiling, outdoorsy things , canooing etc just S I did!

lljkk My son's scout group is far wealthier than my brownie unit!

"if girls were wanting more boisterous activities then the Rainbows could add them to their agenda."

They can do! We are "girl led" so are guided by the girls as to what activities we do. If they want to try something, the leaders should at least consider how it could be done. Remember that Rainbows are slightly younger than Beavers (5-7 compared to 6-8) so that does limit what they can manage, but everything is worth considering!

Get rid of rainbows/brownies and beavers and all go to Woodcraft Folk instead?

As for the different wealth of different groups, units are entirely self-funding. We don't get any central funding, although you can apply for specific grants. How much money a unit will have (and I assume this is the same for Scouts as well as Guides) depends on how much they charge and how much they spend. In some less affluent areas, units prefer to charge a low amount, although this might limit some activities, to try to offer everyone the opportunity to join or do lots of fundraising activities.

To anyone reading this thinking about Scouts or Guides at any age for their children, please don't be put off by the cost. If we know, there are always ways that we can find the money elsewhere.

Everyone is different. It depends what is available in your area.
DD loved brownies, was bored rigid at guides, joined explorers (scouts) and has a brilliant time. The leader is an absolute saint and IMO should have several medals and possibly a knighthood.

These groups offer so much to kids who can't necessarily afford to do expensive hobbies and activities.

I don't want them to get government funding because along with that comes interference and incompetence. But if everyone offered a little bit of time/skills or whatever it would really help.

Start a new beaver group.

Fatowl I thought your initial post was spot on.

I volunteer as a Brownie Guider. Dh works away so I have to take my none Brownie dc. The alternative is to close the pack. We try very hard to make our meetings fun and to do activities the girls want to do.

Dh volunteers as a Cub Leader on one of the 3 nights he's home. All of our dc who are old enough attend Beavers/Cubs/Scouts.

Both organisations are 'run' very differently. I am on the Scout Group commitee so see how that is done and I theoretically have a very good idea if how Guiding works.

However I would argue that in both organisations, the day to day activities vary considerably between individual packs/units/groups and it is nigh on impossible to say that Scouting or Guiding is better than the other because of this.

Guides seem pretty outdoorsy to me, mine have done a Gruffalo hunt in a forest, bikes and wheels in parks, canoeing, dry-slope skiing, building a raft and going down the river, outdoor cooking and lots of sports activities. There are crafty things too.

I'm not saying Guides are perfect, some of the leaders in my dd's troupe are a bit brusque but I don't think that's a general thing. I get the impression they are fed up with parents taking advantage and contributing little, including not paying on time/withdrawing them from already paid for activities. It's a shame though, as this does then create a slightly bad atmosphere where parents are viewed negatively, rather than a source of help.

another that gets me when ill-informed people start on Guiding and Scouting... Scouts CHOSE to become mixed. No one made them. Yet it then translates as "Guides should be banned/there is no need for them any more". Thanks a bunch.

That's like saying we should ban netball because you can play football (it's still a sport with a ball, right?)

fatowl now you mention the promise... I'm not impressed by it, explaining the old words was so much easier, I was working with some new rainbows teaching them about the promise the other week and one insists the only things she believes in are fairies and one direction

Anyway, back to te point, OP yabu, If the beavers had my Rainbow waiting list to add to theirs even fewer boys would get places anyway. Many of the volunteers would not start doing cubs/beavers if Guiding stopped, after all if we wanted to be cub/beaver leaders we wouldn't have joined Guiding, they'd simply stop volunteering, so all you'd end up with is even more girls at Beavers and not enough leaders to start up any new colonies.

As for activities this term I've taken my girls to do high ropes, hiking, knot tying, football, a trip to the park and are having a campfire, very little in the way of girly activities because we haven't got a very girly group, the Beavers who meet in the same hall have done cooking, colouring, craft, games in the hall and a trip to build-a-bear.

I think I agree with the comment that those who complain the loudest tend to be the ones who help the least.

Bardette Sat 05-Jul-14 14:59:16
I don't really want to volunteer in a club my child attends, but it's certainly something I would consider once my youngest is a bit older.

Can I suggest you have a word with the leaders of the Scout group you're on the waiting list for?

I say this because unlike Guides, Scouts tends to organise in Groups, so each group would have Beavers, Cubs and Scouts all attached to the same group (at least, in our town it does). If your area is the same, you could possibly help out at say Cubs or Scouts, and maybe free up a leader to swap over to the Beavers Colony, which might increase the numbers of places available.

And as for guides activities, DD's recently been camping as well as attending the Big Gig . She would never do the water sport and other outdoor activities if we offered her a club or something, but in Guides, she's raring to go. It's the mix that attracts her.

I've no doubt that the Girl Guides are an amazing organisation, and will be signing my daughter up for Rainbows when she is old enough. But I don't understand why we have an all girls group, a mixed group, but we're not allowed an all boys group.

YABU

We need more girls only spaces not fewer.

Because Scouting CHOSE to accept girls when they were having a 'recruitment' crisis.

I've no doubt that the Girl Guides are an amazing organisation, and will be signing my daughter up for Rainbows when she is old enough

After you've successfully campaigned for them to be 'scrapped' or...?

The main thing DD likes about Brownies (and liked about Rainbows) is that there are no boys. She has three brothers, including a twin brother. She loves going somewhere where only girls are allowed.

I don't think a question on MN quite counts as a 'campaign'.
It just feels unfair on my son when girls are taking up spaces in the Beavers when they could be going to Rainbows.

Or some could even be doing both . How very unfair.

Bardette- so Scouts should accept girls when they are short on numbers, and now numbers are increased, exclude them again?! The plain fact is more girls than boys in general want to join these organizations, that's perhaps an issue to do with boys, not girls.