To be a bit irritated by these church weddings for people who have never ever been in a church? And also the SCALE of these weddings!

[mrsjavierbardem]

AIBU? Really?
I didn't get married in a church because I don't practice my religion any more and my husband isn't a believer.

I just couldn't even though I was brought up in a faith and know all about it and understand the good and bad of it and I feel I could easily have argued for a church wedding because of my history. Still, I would have felt hypocritical I think.

People say to me that these weddings are all about the photographs and the making it feel more special. Those are good reasons but still, I couldn't just do God one day of my life, I just would feel ridiculous.

Also I don't see why some of these couples don't have a more moderate day? I'm about to go to a wedding when I know the couple have barely a few beans to rub together and they are having a serious do. I guess her parents are footing a lot but also the couple must be borrowing too….
it's just such a big expense for all of us going too, the presents, the clothes, the travel, two nights accommodation. I mean it's people with few beans making a lot of people with varying amounts of beans spend hundreds of beans!
I mean I am not crazy about the bride which doesn't help!
Dont' worry I am very nice to her but it all seems a great festival of fakery and vanity!

I mean I wish them well! And I'm glad to be asked! But it's just the splurging of money and the need to make everyone else splurge money that makes me uneasy. Of course one can just say No - but not easy at a family wedding!

Apocalypse, a rehearsal dinner for that purpose is obviously, to me, totally fine. I'm not talking about sensible decisions, I'm talking about when the whole wagon has got out of control and suddenly everything is necessary.
There is a massive industry out there helping women feel they have to splurge all this cash. I do sympathise. I just missed the conditioning somehow.
You must admit that seeing a lovely young woman come down the aisle in pancake layers of make up and so much eyeshadow that she looks like she might be covering bruises and a hairdo that is just unattractive on her, I mean it is possible to have naturalish make up and a calm hairdo isn't ? One that flatters maybe? I think the pressure IS too much but someone needs to say no.

Bridesmaids is funny because it has truth in it.
It is not misogynistic to say our sex can be eejits at times.

Why do we have to be so genuflecting about brides? What is this princess nonsense? It feels infantilised to me, not at all egalitarian or of this century, it is a bit regressive isn't it?
Fine, lovely beautiful, do what pleases you BUT why so me me me about it?
Is it the only day a girl gets her own way? Is that it?

The thing is, though, you don't like this woman so the chances that she's explaining the reasons for her decisions to you are remote. And you're putting the worst possible connotations on to her. But you don't really know why she does what she does.

I personally had all the things you hate, and I loved it. My wedding was the happiest day of my life, I enjoyed every second. The makeup and hair came out great in the photos, my dress was beautiful and fitted to perfection.

The thing is, you do have to have all the trappings. People who come to your wedding have expectations, and if you want them to spend the time and money coming, they better be met. Which costs a fortune. I felt it was worth it (apart, possibly, from the flowers). It wasn't that I have a particular princess complex, but it was the only party we've ever thrown. All our friends came, even from abroad. When people are doing that you have to make sure they're fed and entertained. And it's very easy for the groom to take it all light and breezy, they aren't going to be blamed for whatever goes wrong.

So yeah, I feel a bit sorry for a bride. It's a massive, stressful event and quite hard to organise if you've no experience. Trying to enjoy all the preparation, trying not up stress too much, trying to spend the right amount when nobody really cares but you isn't easy. And I think it probably is the time a woman gets to show her adult self to the world on an occasion where's she's not the support act, for once.

Someone there who can barely conceal their contempt would not be nice.

I go to church and I don't at all mind people marrying in church for show when they don't attend (who am I to say they don't believe?)

Because, whatever their reasons, if there is anything in it at all, then they deserve the blessing of god on their wedding as much as anyone.

Also because it is fun to be asked to sing at them!

I used to be more uptight about things like that because I thought I was being morally upright in being stringent about my own weird and patchy faith, and I missed out on the blessings of being a church goer, and it made me bitter and twisted. but now I have said sod it, my weird and patchy faith is good enough and I'll take what I like, I support others who do the same and feel able to take whatever they need, too. Good luck to them!

Of course the whole attention seeking aspect of showing off for a day is another thing. that I have less sympathy for

I'm with OP, and YANBU. You do NOT have to have all the trappings if you don't want them, and if they become the most important aspect of the day, you are in danger of losing perspective on what it's really about. For example, if the guests coming to my wedding are expecting wedding cake, they are going to be disappointed. But once my fiancé and I realised that neither of us like wedding cake, it was an easy decision to say we won't have one then. We'll put the effort and money to something both of us do want.

We've had all the comments along the lines of "but you've got to have a cake!". Perhaps because I'm a bit stroppy older, I don't find it hard telling people "our day, our way". But we approached it from the perspective of deciding when and where we were getting married, who we wanted there and what bits were important to us, and designed the day accordingly. We want the ceremony to be right and are very lucky to have a friend do it. Then we'll have a DIY knees up afterwards. No doubt there will be snarks and raised eyebrows and things not going to plan, there always are when human beings are involved. Just got to rise above it.

You'll be fine.

In my experience DIY weddings are very much given the MN seal of approval, it's the more lavish affairs that receive all the snark.

Oh shoot me then as I'm not girly at all but like to dress up for the odd occasion. looked the best I've looked on my wedding day - I truly felt beautiful for a change and did for once feel special and hell yeah - like a princess. No packed on make up, hair natural - loved my cream dress and veil.

I get what you are saying about some of the palaver but you really are coming over as a misery.

YABU OP. You don't like big, church weddings and you are being fairly unpleasant about this bride because you don't like her and you don't like the type of wedding that her parents are giving her.

Tomorrow you will be wishing her and the groom well, but really you will be annoyed, irritated and judgy. You talk about her hypocrisy and her spending too much money. You talk about conditioning. You are not happy that she is marrying your family member. You are not happy at the splurging that you are choosing to do. You are conditioned to attend because it is a family wedding.

You are guilty of everything that you are blaming the bride for. As for being selfish, you are the one who wants this couple to have the wedding you want.

The thing is, you do have to have all the trappings.

No. You really don't. If you WANT to have them and can afford them, that's fine. But don't do it because it's "the done thing" or "everyone does it" or blame it on guest expectations. People who are going to judge your wedding on the "trappings" alone must be pretty shallow, TBH.

It's a massive, stressful event But it doesn't have to be! It's self-inflicted stress because you're buying into the Wedding-with-a-capital-W, fairytale-princess-everything-has-to-be-perfect hype. My wedding preparation wasn't stressful at all.

I think it probably is the time a woman gets to show her adult self to the world on an occasion where's she's not the support act, for once

I find this a very odd comment. My wedding wasn't about "showing my adult self to the world". It was about me and my DH standing up in front of a small group of our close family and friends and promising to love each other for always. I have plenty of opportunities in my professional life to present myself in a leading role, as it were; I didn't need to use my wedding for that. In fact, given the amount of fakery that goes into most wedding preparation - the fake tan, the professional make-up, the one-time-only hairdo, the support underwear, the smiling through gritted teeth at the family members you don't like much but had to invite - it's probably the day that most adult females look and act least like their actual adult self.

What confuses me about this thread is that I don't see any relationship between getting married in church and having a lavish, elaborate wedding. You can have a very modest church wedding, you know! Also I am not sure how the lavishness/expense of the wedding impacts the guests. You don't HAVE to buy a new outfit, for instance. And you may have to travel and pay for accommodation even for a modest wedding- couples don't necessarily come from the same area and live near friends and family anymore. So many different issues seem to be conflated here.

Bloody hell OP, now your moaning about brides that wear too much make-up and have unattractive hair!

You would probably have approved of my wedding. Registry office (we're athiests), two guests, told no-one else until afterwards. I did have a wedding dress though, and we had a small wedding cake. Can't say my hair was particularly over-done - I collected ivy the night before to weave into it myself. I'm not someone who particularly enjoys being the centre of attention. At the time we upset some family members, but most are over it by now, almost twenty-five years later .

I hope your bride goes easy on the make-up. I can almost see you hoiking your judgy pants up already.

you're, not your

ok, for the sake of argument, I am being unkind about the bride, you are quite right to say so, and I do regret that. and on the day I will be lovely to her, I really will, she is not bad hearted, and I really wish her well deep down, her husband is a total sweetheart and I have to always be lovely to her for his sake. But I still have to say that I don't think this wedding is really about the couple it is about her, I am not having a go, I am trying to be honest. I do think it is worth discussing. It is such a big thing these days. A dear friend has been to four weddings this year and is finding it very tough financially, they have all been ones she couldn't miss but you they do cost a lot to go to.

It's just no one is making a moral defence for the fact that a wedding can be a financial strain on the guests. That is an ethical issue, surely. We can discuss ethics here can't we?

I hear what everyone is saying very articulately about the wedding they want but 'my day' still gets mentioned far more than 'our day'.

I just wanted one of those mumsnetters who come on and sum up how we are all a bit sheep-like in wanting this 'special day'. I don't mean to be contemptuous, I am trying to understand what these increasingly extravagant days are really about. And I am not being horrible i just want someone to explain why so many otherwise perfectly rational women (who never say me me me me me me MY DAY ME SPECIAL) suddenly get so Violet Beauregarde up in everyone's face. Please, let us be in agreement, the wedding can be a great festival of ego can't it? I mean honestly I am not being mean, I'm asking a sensible question about this cultural phenomenon.

I think it must have something to do with the death of feminism! Someone on here will know!
The party and the gathering: I understand.
A lot of expense: I understand.
I do understand the church wedding a bit better now, you have all helped me here and I never minded much, it's just an irritant (hardly asking for anyone to be publicly executed!)

I understand the bride wanting to look lovely and the place to be nice and special etc.

But I don't understand that one often hears a distant sound of a beautifully pedicured foot in an extremely beautiful shoe stamping in the distance and a sobbing voice saying "ME ME ME ME MY SPECIAL DAY!"

I will lovely on the day, I promise, she will love me, I am a consummate actress, I will probably love her on the day and weep at the vows, I'm a sucker for all of it. But surely I'm allowed to say that deep down it seems all a bit mad.

YANBU - I have a strong faith, I am very involved in Church life but I chose to have a very small, registrar office wedding. I personally (and DH ) couldn't bear all the pomp and ceremony, let alone the expense of a big fancy wedding. I believe a marriage is about what happens after the wedding day, not the big dress, millions of bridesmaids, guests lists, presents, photography, angst etc etc. We've been married nearly 30 years and I never regret having a small cheap wedding.

Bue - I agree with you that it is perfectly possible to have a modest church wedding, some of the nicest weddings I have been to have been very simple ceremonies, followed by a bring and share lunch or similar.

I live in dread that my DS would want a big fancy wedding

Is it okay to ask you Ragwort, why ... given both your strong faith and involvement in Church life ... you opted to have a registrar office wedding?

I completely understand you not wanting the pomp and expense of a big fancy wedding, but ... as you said ... it is perfectly possible to have a modest church wedding with a very simple ceremony

Brides (and grooms) are not "a bit sheeplike" in wanting their wedding day to be special.

Feminism is not dead.
I have never heard a bride sobbing "Me me me" on her wedding day.

As for the ethics of costs to guests, it really is simple: invitees should go if they can afford it or send a lovely message and meet up before/afterwards if they can't. The B&G should not have to phone round to discover the financial affairs of everyone on the guest list before they organize their wedding.

I said about my traditional biggish church wedding. You know what - it was lovely on the day but wasn't what we wanted at all. We wanted to go off somewhere like Rome for a really small casual wedding with just close family and a few friends. A service somewhere, a meal at a family restaurant and just to have fun. No one was interested (fair enough). We actually only had the big traditional wedding through circumstance because having certain folk there was more important at than doing what we actually wanted. So basically, we gave everyone else the wedding they wanted and approved of (not bitter at all).

Strangely the church part was actually the best bit even though we are not religious or even believers.

Surely the cost to the guests is the same whether the wedding is small and simple or large and extravagant. The biggest cost is in travel and hotel rooms.

I agree with you OP. Of our group of friends, the ones who got married first soon after graduation tended to have sweet, simple weddings which were lots of fun. The showy-offiness tended to escalate a little as we got older and just lately it's been cringeworthy. DP and I have 2 more of these spectacles to endure this Summer and at the last one, the bride did what my DM would call a "turn" i.e. she actually dressed up and sang a song with her stepdaughter.....

It was painful, DP and I sat there with our toes curling in embarrassment and every one of the other guests felt the same. Even the groom looked embarrassed! just think people have gone slightly round the bend about weddings. I don't really care about the church/non church thing but for heavens' sake, spending all that money on a vanity circus seems bloody insane to me!

DP and I are getting married in September with only immediate family and very dear friends. However, it's not cheap because we are paying for everyone's travel and accommodation as well as food and booze and I will be drinking vintage champagne all day A local dressmaker is making me a frock and DP is wearing a suit he bought last year for a friend's wedding (although he has made the momentous decision to buy a waistcoat!)

Each to their own, but like you I question those who have a circus-wedding that they can't really afford, much better to have a few butties down the pub and save for a house deposit IMHO!

Weddings are more expensive for guests at Country Pile Golf Club thanSthe Spade and Fork Arms unless there's a free bar. Of course it makes a difference.

For me a wedding at a golf club would cost the same as a wedding at a pub. I have to travel, book a room and buy present for both of them.

Yes, many factors are the same - petrol/train to the general area, cheap hotel eso if part of a big chain, present, frock, etc. But factors such as bar prices, taxis between hotel/hegemony fucfucking phone ceremony / venue (sorry my delete key isn't working) are significantand vvary widely.

We went to a wedding last weekend where the cheap hotels, ceremony venue and reception venue were all within about a mile of each other. Taxis were about a fiver but we'd have walked if it hadn't pissed it down. At previous weddings we've had a half-hour drive to the arse end of nowhere. Very pretty, but logistically and financially significant.

And it has been pretty galling to pay £3 for a cup of juice for each DC in naice venues, or £8 for a G&T. If it isn't a free bar then it's another way of getting guests topay for your choice of venue.

FatalCabbage - friends of ours came up with a brill idea for getting round extortionate bar prices at hotel weddings out in the sticks. They gift wrapped a wine box to look like a wedding gift and drank from that. I was so impressed .

I must be lucky as I have never been to a wedding where you have to pay for your own drinks - if I did I would definitely be pinching AgathaF's trick!!

SignYourName, people make choices. Mine included understanding that if I wanted guests to enjoy my wedding, they'd need to be entertained, fed and watered to the standard they expect on these occasions. It certainly was my choice to go with the conventions. My guests were also kind enough to return the favour by fulfilling the usual guest protocol. They were on time, beautifully dressed, full of congratulations and in the mood to celebrate, just as I have been at their weddings. It's a quid pro quo in my book, and I think it works well when everyone knows what to expect and what is expected if them.

Love it, Agatha!

And I think I've only been to one wedding wwhere we idnt FUCK SAKE PHONE G didn't^ have to buy our own drinks beyond the toast and a couple of glasses with dinner.