To think that Saville was NEVER a "Much loved family favourite"???

[MrsWinnibago]

Sorry to start a thread about this sick, awful animal but they just said on Radio 4 that he was a much loved family favourite.

I CLEARLY remember watching him on Jim'l Fix It and thinking "Oh he's HORRIBLE!"

I hated him...he was frightening and I could see that some children were very scared of him on that show.

Did ANYONE actually enjoy his "performances" and appearances?? I don't think so.

I think the establishment kept him where he was...on TV and in positions of power because he knew too much about THEIR activities.

And it's funny how it all came out once he was dead and couldn't name anyone else.

I challenge anyone to think back and remember how much they "loved" him at the time before his activities were known.

Whenever he was on joking about his 'girls' I always thought he was having a laugh at himself as he was so awful looking and would've smelled like stale cigars. I never thought he was being serious. Makes me feel sick now.

Just because individuals on this thread didn't like him, doesn't mean that the Today programme, and others, aren't justified in referring to Jimmy Savile as a 'much-loved family favourite'.

He was, much like Tony Hart, Rolf Harris and Bruce Forsyth were, and have been referenced as such on this thread - though I think Brucie was referred to at least once pejoratively.

From my childhood memories I liked Jimmy Savile, Tony Hart, Brian Cant, Nancy Kominsky, the Two Ronnies, the entire cast of How and Captain Scarlet.

I have no idea about their personal habits apart from Savile, but I realise now that the last one used to be put back on his shelf at the end of the day.

That's the only thing I can be sure of because I only know them from the telly.

The idea that you know someone is a wrong'un because of a funny feeling is misleading. I've mentioned Christopher Jefferies, but I'm going to chuck him in again. There have been others who looked a bit dodgy.

The suggestion is that people should have known if only their spidey senses were better. That is not only misleading but thoroughly offensive.

"as if you'd wandered into an Hoxton pub and asked the first bloke in there to look after your primary school class for half an hour."

In fact, I don't know why we bother with a judicial system at all. All we need is 12 mumsnetters pointing out who has eyes that are too close together, who "gives them the creeps", who "doesn't sit right", who they have a "feeling about- I said to my Dp I did- I've got one of my feelings about that one and you know I'm never wrong"

I used to watch Stuart Hall on Look North and think he was great! Loved the fact that he collected clocks.

Good job I never met him in real life

"The suggestion is that people should have known if only their spidey senses were better. That is not only misleading but thoroughly offensive."

That is absolutely not the suggestion- nowhere on this thread has anyone even alluded to thinking this.

Had they done so, it would indeed be misleading and offensive, on that we agree; but they have not.

I think Jimmy Saville was a family favourite when I was a kid; everyone loved his shows and all kids my age dreamed of going on Jim'll Fix It.

I met him when I was about 8; he was doing a promotional thing at a hotel in Southampton and my mum took us along as you could win a vacuum cleaner. I have a photo of him grabbing my mum in a hug and grabbing her bottom. Everyone laughed. It was the 1970s.

I have no recollection of being unnerved by him, or of him showing any more than a cursory interest in me or my brothers, thank god. He did give us a giant teddy bear as part of the promotion, but no vacuum cleaner.

But it's a lazy summation isn't it? Britains favourite, the Nations favourite....

And I wonder how much of it is a deflection by the BBC and Media - "well he was your favourite people, so don't blame us for the atrocities" ...rather than "apologies the fecker had us over a barrel for some dark reason we won't admit, so we had to thrust the tracksuit wearing gimp at you in every conceivable opportunity"

An easy get out for them.

And a favourite out of who? Jim Davison, Huey Green, Frank Bough, Jimmy Tarbuck, Bernard Manning, Bruce Forsythe, Stuart Hall...hardly rich pickings on a Saturday night was it.

I only ever saw him in Jim fix it and as a child I always remember thinking he had cold eyes and he didn't seem to actually liked children very much. I just knew I didn't like him and had no desire to be on that show.

I wasn't really aware of the charity and hospital stuff until later. In the 70s and 80s when I was growing up he was a well-known but slightly freaky entertainer, in the 9os onwards when I was an adult he was more famous for doing runs in horrible vests and raising money.

I know the Louis Theroux show is famous but I also remember him being interviewed on the radio by Anthony Clare, In the Psychiatrist's Chair, when I was university age so early 90s. It was TERRIFYING and confirmed him as an utter creep in my mind. Clare asked him if he liked children (I had no idea at the time that this was a loaded question). There was a loooong and very uncomfortable pause and then he said "Couldn't eat a whole one." It was awful. You could just feel Clare thinking "Oh no, this isn't good". I remember discussing it with friends and us agreeing how creepy he came across.

Yes there were all those unsavoury types but Tony Hart was lovely (and by all accounts, including his kids' and colleagues', absolutely lovely in RL too). I ADORED him and he was a beacon of kindness and sweetness for me at a time when my home life was dysfunctional and horrible.

And I wonder how much of it is a deflection by the BBC and Media - "well he was your favourite people, so don't blame us for the atrocities"

Quite.

And Tethers is right. No-one has even remotely alluded to the suggestion that people should have known all along.

But I stand by the fact it's not with hindsight that I can honestly say he gave me the creeps when I was a child. Of course, in saying that, my subtext is clearly that I knew he was a perv and those who didn't only have themselves to blame.

I forgot about Stuart Hall. I loved It's A Knockout because I was a child. I also loved Carry On films - most of whose cast members were what would be described as 'troubled' in various degrees .

I was a little bit too old for Mike Reid's Runarrarrrnd. I didn't detect any paedophilia there but he wasn't the kind of person my parents would have wanted to know for other reasons. No doubt they would be condemned as snobs. No doubt they wouldn't care.

But my point is that these were mainstream TV stars promoted on the BBC and ITV and in some cases feted by major Establishment figures.

In the face of that, and in the more trusting climate of at least 40 years ago, what chance did ordinary people have?

In fact, I'd say there is a problem that people are more suspicious now than they ought to be. But I don't know where the balance should lie.

It's the line between being aware and waving a pitchfork.

But call me judgemental but I do judge people who claim: 'I always knew he was a wrong'un'.

Way back in the day he was a family favourite and people would organise their Saturday afternoon/evening around his TV programmes.

I loved his shows and thought he looked scary but not in the sense of what we now know about him. It was more of a 'funny' scary.

Ive loads of happy memories from the days when we'd be at home having our tea, enjoying time with each other whilst watching JS on TV.

it was different in those days however, if there were rumours we didn't have the internet etc to help expose people, and the press would not have touched the story with a barge pole. Those kind of crimes were well and truly hushed up and brushed under the carpet.

The idea that you know someone is a wrong'un because of a funny feeling is misleading.

But this can be the case for individuals. And why should they be denied expressing their experiences? Or accused of victim blaming when they do?

It certainly was the case for me in my life. I know for a fact that the person I instinctively and pretty much on first sight hated, disliked, made me feel extremely uncomfortable and was extremely distrustful of as 12 year old, who was forced into my life, WAS an active pedophile. They guy who all the adults around me told me was a fabulous marvelous wonderful guy and who was "so great with children".

He had previous convictions which he hid, he groomed everyone around him, and when I responded to him based entirely on my instincts I was told i was selfish, a troublemaker, wrong, should just shut up, etc etc etc etc and eventually I was pretty much forced out of my home as I refused to live with him.

I didn't know what a pedophile was at the time - I had no idea people like this existed. I had a pure gut instinctive reaction. And I had the same feeling when I saw JS on TV or in the papers after I came to the UK.

And you are saying I'm victim blaming by honoring my instincts and talking about them here? Not that far off what all the adults did to me when I was 12. You are saying my experience, my instincts are unimportant or invalid and the other side of the coin of expressing them must be blaming others for "not knowing better". It is not the case.

My experience is valid - and me expressing this is not blaming victims for not having the same experience or reaction as I did. Of course I have probably crossed paths with many other dodgy people since then and not had the same reaction. I can express the above without at all thinking or implying that others "should know because i did" once or twice.

Please don't misinterpret I haven't said Mike Reid was a paedophile - there is nothing remotely related to him that I know of.

I'm just saying that these big characters weren't really the reference point for many children watching, but rather the program content itself.

But looking back with the marvel of hindsight these people just look so out of place in children's entertainment. But that's probably because what children should watch was defined and decided by a completely out of touch generation.

yabu
people are re writing history
he was a family favourite.
you can't decide that because he is now know to be a vile creature, that every one always knew.

I loved the show but disliked Savill. Like you OP, he scared me. I never want to go on the show because you'd have to meet him. I also have vivid memories of feeling sorry for the children who used to sit on the arm of his big chair.

I know it's unavoidable but I HATE the fact they keep putting his disgusting face on the TV news. You walk on a room and its there. I feel so sorry for his victims, coping with that and even having to hear his name.

I remember at the time the allegations were starting to become very public, a friend being outraged that people were making up such lies about him -her words not mine

I met him a few times when he came shopping where I used to work and he used to give me the creeps -I was 18 at the time and a lot of my colleagues used to look forward to him coming in, they really had him high up on a pedestal

Johnny Rotten and Jerry Sadowitz are both on the record about his behaviour 10 + years ago

he was a family favourite. In some families.

you can't decide that because he is now know to be a vile creature, that every one always knew.

Perhaps. But I can in all honesty say he was never a family favourite nor loved in my house.

BeeBlanket... "... couldn't eat a whole one".

I think this is something that many, many people say. Cringey, yes Indicative of something 'strange', no. I think it's human nature to apply fixed feelings in hindsight that were never there.

As a society, we've evolved to not accept the various modes of behaviour that - if not exactly deemed acceptable - were not deemed to be the criminal acts they were. We as a society have to accept best knowledge at the time, not blame the victims and set our standards higher but set them across the board, irrespective of level of fame.

I agree with ViviPru's posts throughout, amongst others.

"I could never eat a whole one" is not a Jimmy Saville original. I can't remember who first said it. But it certainly predates Saville.

As I said, hindsight is a wonderful thing.

There is no doubt the rumours were very open around the BBC and looking back now a lot of very heavy hints and accusations were in the air.

I've linked this before but listen to the telephone conversation on Early Doors between Jean and Winnie...the penny only dropped for me when I rewatched this last year.

Interesting who's mentioned. Still waiting on that one.

Early Doors

ViviPru true but he as in a lot
the same way ant and dec and cheryl cole are sold these days, they are not favourites in our house, but lots of people chose to watch them.
(not linking them with JS in that way)
Back in the day JS was on, GG was top of the pops and we watched its a knock out. you can't change history