Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2 3 4 5 6

Original poster

Boys in girls' clothing - how far is too far?

141 replies

lecce · 20/05/2014 20:24

Before I start, I want to make it clear that I am not looking for congratulations for being a 'liberal parent.' This post is a genuine request for advice and, yes, it's here partly for traffic, but I am certainly asking whether I am, or would be, UR to be going as far as I am.

DS2 (nearly 5, YR) has been into the princess dresses, pink accessories etc for a couple of years now. It shows no signs of abating, but shifts focus - has gone through Hello Kitty, female Horrible Histories characters, Frozen, Paloma Faith...

His latest craze is a girls' school uniform summer dress, which we finally gave in and got him at the weekend. He wants to wear it in the evenings and at weekends. We discussed with him the risk of running into classmates, but he insists he doesn't mind if they comment/laugh.

This is what concerns me - the reactions of peers. He is very shy and seems to have only one friend in his class. She was at nursery with him and the friendship has continued, but, other than her, the only people from school he mentions are girls two or three years older than him, who enjoy babying him and find him 'cute' - (he is ). I have taken him to a few parties lately and there was no interaction with anyone other than this girl.

He has his own party in July and envisages himself singing along to Paloma Faith in his best dress while others, I don't know - join in? Watch in admiration? I don't know how to balance giving him a party he actually wants, and ensuring that others enjoy it/ don't spend it laughing at him. I know he has had some comments from people at school, but he has never really seemed upset by them, and, afaik, they haven't come from his classmates.

A big part of me thinks giving him the message that what he likes isn't 'right' will damage his confidence, not improve it, but another part thinks I am just allowing him to make things more difficult for himself. Even my mother (very non-judgey non-interfering) gave an awkward silence when I told her about it on the phone, and I know that when she and my Dad visit next week, there will be comments from him.

DS wears nothing but one of the three dresses he has in his free time. His teachers say he is coming out of his shell, and that they see him as 'quietly confident'. We are trying a variety of things to build confidence, but, overall, WIBU to just continue as we are and see how it develops

OP posts:

MyrtleDove · 20/05/2014 20:30

The thing is though, clothes don't have genders - clothes are just clothes. A boy in a dress is wearing boys' clothing, because he is a boy.

He seems confident enough for it not to be an issue if others comment. Also lots of people just naturally have very small but very close friendship groups - I am the same and have always been this way. He is still very little and I didn't really get the hang of bigger friendship groups until I was in juniors - I was really more interested in independent play until then and it sounds like your DS is the same.

Good luck - I realise it can't be easy to worry about what others will say and if they might be hurtful. However I think to disapprove would do much more damage - from your post he seems very happy and secure in himself, and it would be very sad if that changed.

Piratejones · 20/05/2014 20:39

Please try not to worry.

My 6 year old has a couple of nighties which used to belong to my daughter, he has a few girls shirts which he chose himself because he liked the characters on them.
He also likes to play the part of both wendy and captain hook, with dresses and things.

Clothes are clothes and honestly chidlren are pretty sexless in the first few years, they have no gender dived. So if a child looks up to someone who is female, they are going to want to be just like them, even if it means wearing a crop top as a bra for a week (it's now in the toybox) .

whynowblowwind · 20/05/2014 20:45

Gosh.

I would be concerned if this was my child to be honest and would want him to have counselling to eliminate the possibility go him actually 'being' a girl.

Piratejones · 20/05/2014 20:49

whynowblowwind the kid is 4.

Redcliff · 20/05/2014 20:50

Your son sounds lovely and I totally get your dilemma . My son has 2 friends at school and a lot of the rest if the class can be really mean to him due to him being a bit different so really impressed how cool his classmates are. Could you make his party fancy dress if your worried about kids making fun of a boy in a dress - might blend in a little bit?

Flexibilityiskey · 20/05/2014 20:50

I think the way you are dealing with it so far sounds fine. He needs to find his own way. He sounds like he is very much his own person, and knows what he likes. The liking of dresses etc may or may not continue, but I hope his confidence to be himself does!

noblegiraffe · 20/05/2014 20:51

Has he had any mufti days at school where he has worn a dress?

Sounds a really tricky one. My DS is in reception and I really don't know how he would react if at an e.g. Pirate/princess party one of the boys was a princess. He's not mean or prone to taunting, but he may well make a comment about princesses being for girls, because that's what society presents to him.

Could you fudge it without him knowing with a swimming party? Buy him a Frozen/Paloma Faith t-shirt to try to tempt him away from the dresses? Although if your DS is confident enough to own it, maybe you should be do. But I'd feel horribly awkward if it were me.

TheOneAndOnlyAlpha · 20/05/2014 20:51

whynow I hope hope hope you are not serious.

whynowblowwind · 20/05/2014 20:53

Don't you think people 'know', at 4, what gender they are? Everything I have read suggests they do. I knew a man who was born a woman - he knew before even starting school he was in the wrong body.

If it was my child, it would suggest to me there was a possibility of a problem, and I'd want to identify it sooner rather than later. If it is a boy who likes girls' clothes - ok, but if not, better to know now and decide on a course of action.

Dressing in different clothes like this isn't the norm - that isn't to say its wrong, but it isn't average and I'd be concerned. Just my view, but honestly I would be a bit worried for my son if he'd been insistent about dresses like this.

whois · 20/05/2014 20:54

That is quite different to what the OP is describing.

I have no idea what I would do. You want to protect him from the big bad world and from being teased, but also let him know he can be anyone he wants to be!

There must be some resources out there with advice? Maybe someone can point you in the right direction.

TimeForAnotherNameChange · 20/05/2014 20:54

I'd be concerned too, not that what he wants to do is somehow wrong (it isn't) but that there may be something deeper underlying it as whynow suggests. This sounds like more than just a fondness for pink and a bit of dressing up here and there. How does he identify, have you ever explored his feelings about clothes/toys/identity further? If it's nothing of the sort then I'm not sure what I'd do. In all honesty I think I'd probably discourage the wearing of dresses when in public because it just puts him at such risk of ridicule. Yes I know that's supposed to be other people's problem not his, but it's he who will suffer if he's picked on and taunted. And as for the party that's another minefield too. Chances are that it won't be as utopian as he's hoping, and I can't imagine a group of five year olds not commenting about 'the boy in the dress'. They're brutally honest at that age and I'm not sure I would put my children through it if I could avoid it.

Itisafact · 20/05/2014 20:55

I think your ds sounds lovely and you sound like a really considerate parent. While I don't like the blue for boys pink for girls crap tbh at your ds age I would be trying to gently steer him towards more typical boy wear. Kids can be so cruel and I think that bullying can be very damaging.

In a perfect world children would be able to wear what they like and act how they like but unfortunately this world is far from perfect

NitramAtTheKrap · 20/05/2014 20:56

I have a similar issue. DS s 3 and all he wants to wear are summer dresses. I would happily let him but I don't want people to make him feel bad about his choices. Tough one. I think your DS sounds cool, anyway.

Ploppy16 · 20/05/2014 20:57

He is obviously a wonderfully confident boy and you're all doing fine as far as I can see. Fancy dress for his party is a great idea if you want him to blend in a bit.
At the nursery I worked at for a while I saw most of the boys (including DS) become very fond of 'girls' toys and clothes, for many of them it carried on on some ways till around 6. They're teens now and the ones I still see are very well adjusted lads, wearing the odd dress and heels didn't seem to leave any lasting issues!

whois · 20/05/2014 20:57

whynowblowwind the kid is 4

Doesn't matter. Some people feel they are in the 'wrong' body from as long as they can remember! It's worth considering rather than minimise his feelings and tell him not to dress like a girl in public because everyone will laugh at him.

Piratejones · 20/05/2014 20:58

Don't you think people 'know', at 4, what gender they are? Everything I have read suggests they do. I knew a man who was born a woman - he knew before even starting school he was in the wrong body.

No, i think they are sexless.

JonesRipley · 20/05/2014 20:58

Whynow

Counselling could not eliminate the possibility of him "being a girl".

I think I would make it a fancy dress party with a flamboyant theme. I think you can ameliorate the risk of people laughing by choosing your guests wisely, maybe in consultation with trusted parent friends and the teacher, but this may well be less of a problem than you think.

MyrtleDove · 20/05/2014 21:00

Pirate no child is sexless - sex is biological eg xx is female. Gender and sex are two different things. Some children may not feel they are a particular gender at 5, but plenty do.

NeedsAsockamnesty · 20/05/2014 21:00

whynow

Seriously? Because a small child likes dresses.

If that's the bar for therapy most small boys would be having it.

op you know him better than anybody else so you will have a better understanding of his resilience. And the fancy dress idea is brilliant.

Fwiw I was dealing with a inconsolable 2yo yesterday because his grandmother said he had to have blue converse summer shoes and not twinkly purple lelli kellies. I wish I had argued his corner but she was paying for the shoes as a gift so I didn't feel able to.

whynowblowwind · 20/05/2014 21:02

Of course not jones but it would, hopefully, help us understand as a family if this was indeed the case and how best to go forwards. I definitely don't think children are sexless. I once did voluntary work and a big part of that was talking to those who identified as the opposite sex to the one they were born as - they all 'knew' from a very young age.

The suicide rate is horrendously high for that group of people and as such I'd want to get help and support early.

Of course, it might just be a boy who likes dresses but I have to be honest and say it sounds a little more than that to me.

Back2Two · 20/05/2014 21:04

This reply has been withdrawn

This post has been withdrawn due to privacy concerns

Piratejones · 20/05/2014 21:05

Pirate no child is sexless - sex is biological eg xx is female. Gender and sex are two different things. Some children may not feel they are a particular gender at 5, but plenty do.

The word Sex is interchangeable with "gender", and by the way you can be born physically sexless, that is what Ambiguous genitalia is.

NeedsAsockamnesty · 20/05/2014 21:07

I apologise I misread your post as

'To stop him being' instead of 'check out' as I've now realised you meant

revealall · 20/05/2014 21:08

I don't think 5 year olds are going to laugh at him. Most of them still dress up at every opportunity. Perhaps some might ask why he's in a dress but I don't think the negative connotations of being male but not manly kick in till later.
Just invite other kind gentle souls?

TimeForAnotherNameChange · 20/05/2014 21:09

In ordinary speak maybe Pirate, but in terms of science and academic disciplines they really are not. I'm sorry but Myrtle, whois and whynow are right.

Flip

1 2 3 4 5 6