AIBU to join Hunt Saboteurs?

[DogCalledRudis]

I already support them.
They put links on my facebook and i really really want to be one of them.

Nice

I didn't realise laws were optional.

I did not realise that people were so naive

50 the thread is about hunt saboteurs.

Who's stupid..... ?

You are so busy frantically thrashing around trying to defend the indefensible that not only are you being childishly offensive, you are also somewhat missing the point.

If you're going to post about something mountain perhaps you shoul learn a tiny bit about it. Does the phrase "hunting within the law" not mean anything to you?

Drag hunting isn't the only legal hunting in the UK it's just the most boring

I think it's quite obvious that posters on here do not care about the law. There does not seem to be much "hunting within the law."

Nigella you should be ashamed.

I know the law is being flouted.I have seen it with my own eyes.

The few continue to hold on to their archaic and cruel activities.

You disgust me.

oh boo hoo I am weeping now.
I tell you what disgusts me is factory farming, battery eggs and horse meat in the food chain

They may be wrong, but it doesn't mean that fox hunting is acceptable. They may be far worse, but it still doesn't mean that fox hunting is acceptable.

You can't excuse your actions by saying there are other wrong things going on as well. What you are doing is wrong and possibly illegal.

Although it's obviously naive to think people should obey the law.

no I meant it was naive to think hunting just stopped when the law changed

The op' s question was WAIBU to join hunt saboteurs?
Well, I think yes, YWBU.

As I said earlier on, I'm fairly ambivalent about Fox hunting, seeing both points of view. However, I think there are more worthy causes to join.

I take can'ts point of view on board that some people would rather champion animal rights than human ones, but surely something like dogs home trust, PDSA, or donkey sanctuary would be a better cause.

Dog, in answer to your question "AIBU to join Hunt Saboteurs?" I think you should do what you're passionate about. But I don't think you should join the sabs because I think you would do far better going undercover and covertly filming any illegal activity (if it happens) and going through the proper routes within the law to get it stopped.

Upthehairy mountain

Ermm Last time I looked hunting was not illegal . If practised in the imposed manner .

And to leap back in...

Gamekeepers: yes you do have them by you (Chelsy?). Rurally they are quite obvious, one or two farmers will have that role for an area. Or there may be a game shoot locally, those running it will do so to protect their birds. Urban foxes are also dealt with by urban gamekeepers, usually contracted by the local council. They deal with the pigeons too (or seagulls).

foxes kill for fun Elephants, your friends are ascribing human characteristics to foxes, the description you were given of their actions is true, they are opportunist, larder fillers. The populist views of them killing for fun is a misunderstanding and humanising of their actions.

Legal hunts. Thatbloodywoman is very vociferous on the negativity, based on her living rurally. Well I live rurally too. Over the years I have been utterly anti, fairly pro and am now pissed off that the 'squeakiest wheel' got a law passed. It is not true that the vast majority of people want hunting banned. It is true that the vast majority of people who bothered to stand up and shout and scream wanted hunting banned. And that the government then utterly ignored those who wanted it kept. You can find stats to prove both arguments!

It is true that some hunts do hunt illegally. It is not true that they all set of with the intention to do so. Drag hunting, beagling and clean booting are all par for the course round here.

It is a ridiculously emotive subject, made more so by the fluffy bunny brigade who seem to focus on one aspect of human/animal interaction and ignore just about anything else.

As others have said, there are far more widespread animal concerns to worry about.

Well said Nomama.

Also, hunting is big business in the countryside. Whether you like hunting or not, removing it entirely would affect the rural economy.

I don't like the thought of any animal being ripped to shreds, that's awful.
However, foxes are vermin, hunting contributes to an ever dwindling rural economy, & when done lawfully, brings rural communities together without hurting the Fox.

There are so many other, IMO, more worthwhile causes to spotlight today.

foxes are vermin. And so is the human species.

Nomanna Gamekeepers: yes you do have them by you (Chelsy?). Rurally they are quite obvious, one or two farmers will have that role for an area. Or there may be a game shoot locally, those running it will do so to protect their birds. Urban foxes are also dealt with by urban gamekeepers, usually contracted by the local council. They deal with the pigeons too (or seagulls)

Err no really, we don't have a "local gamekeeper" who will shoot the rogue fox for my neighbour. He simply rents a field off the same landowner as I do for my horse, and he really has been sitting in his field shelter for the past few nights trying to shoot it himself. I'm sure if he lived in the south east of England where there are big estates run by millionaires he could somehow avail himself of the services of one of these magical fantasy gamekeepers, but since that isn't the way things are done round here, he can't.

He says lambs nearly always die after fox bites, even when they have had vet treatment and see to be getting better.

uptheairymountain which hunts do you ride with Chelsy? Frankly, I think they need to be investigated?

Do you think I'm stupid? tbh we have no antis up here, but you would be very welcome to come up and express your views. The law depends on which side of the border you are on, but they're a tough lot up here. Since we have more than a few lawyers and police officers who hunt, perhaps you could be more specific as to why "they need to be investigated" and I could pass on your concerns to them?

Certainly in Scotland hunts tend to be way more organised than before the ban, because now other hunters are attracted to them, as they can go around in quad bikes with guns and walky talkies, making sure they stay within the law and shooting the foxes instead. Its massively popular now, but I really have never seen any antis out, so how would you know? Its a shame, because far more foxes are killed now, but its even more distant to the mounted field than before. tbh we're usually miles behind when it happens, thankfully, as I'd far rather see a fox have a chance to escape as before. But it still provides the opportunity to ride around the countryside over varied terrain in a large group, which is something horses really enjoy and a great education for a young horse.

Sorry, Chelsy?

I live in a rural area, arable and pastoral. Not in the South East. They are not rich, they also rent off the landowner. There is a partially established game shoot now, so they take care of the vermin, But prior to that they had a nominated person, usually son of one or two farmers, who undertook the job.

The sheep farmer at the top of the village used to be one, as his lambs were predated, but that is just normal practice for many pastoral farmers. It has become more of a problem since hunting foxes was banned.

I am not sure why you thought I was talking about big estates run by millionaires, that is a stereotypical view that ignores the vast majority of shoots, run by local farmers trying to make the land pay a decent living.

Ah! I just read your last post... Scotland would definitely fit the rich landowner scenario far more than down here does

I see the OP has pissed off after poking round with a stick. Must have gone to a lecture or something

They are not rich, they also rent off the landowner. There is a partially established game shoot now, so they take care of the vermin, But prior to that they had a nominated person, usually son of one or two farmers, who undertook the job

Ah! I just read your last post... Scotland would definitely fit the rich landowner scenario far more than down here does

Errm, ok, anyway, without giving away too many details, forget the rich landowner assumption. This is commuter belt land to a big city I'm talking about and the landowner in question who rents to both of us has a total of 12 acres. The landowner in question used to be a university professor? I think the neighbour one is a surgeon? That would be one of the bigger landholdings around here, except actual farms. None of them are landed gentry. And honestly, there is no "local gamekeeper" or several. Theres certainly no game shoots.

I have to travel far to whichever of the hunts I hunt with. Quite possibly they have this local gamekeeper. Or not. All I know is my neighbour is sitting out each night to try and shoot it himself and there is no one person you can contact to do that. I hope he gets a clean shot.

It is a ridiculously emotive subject, made more so by the fluffy bunny brigade who seem to focus on one aspect of human/animal interaction and ignore just about anything else..

Oh the fucking arrogance and sheer mind numbing stupidity of this comment. A lot has been posted on this thread and this is perhaps the only one that has really fucked me off. Those posters who support hunting have at least made an effort to post reasonable dialogue. You can always rely on one ignorant arsehole to display their inability for original thought. Seriously

There are probably better avenues to register your dislike, from the sometimes poor transportation of the dogs, to the unnecessary killing of other animals, the class issues of why one person on horseback with a pack of hounds can run amok in the forest yet you are expected to put yours on a leash, clear up its poo etc.

Maybe try the League against cruel sports?

Dog I think Livid is right.

If you aren't known as an anti, get known as a follower.

Then expose any illegal hunting going on, with solid evidence, to back you up.

There's a LOT of ill informed sh*t being talked on this thread.

All of you lot who have never been on a hunt, I suggest you contact your local one, explain that you're unsure of what you think of hunting , have never been on one etc.. and can you come along. You don't need a horse, there are lots of foot followers who get involved in the day too.

When you've been on one then come back here and tell me that hunters mistreat their animals or that sabs keep to the law and I will show you a liar!

Whether you agree with the killing of foxes or not, it has to be done as they are responsible for a lot of losses of livestock.
If the general public were prepared to pay a reasonable price for their food rather than expecting a whole chicken for a fiver from asda then we might not need to kill so many foxes as farmers could absorb the losses from predation because they receive enough income from the animals that do survive and make it to the supermarket shelves.

So OP yes yabvvu UNTIL you've been on a hunt. If you still don't like it then fine, at least you've made an INFORMED decision, not one based on thirdhand accounts pedalled by left wing prejudiced townies who are only up for a fight. Just make sure YOU stay within the law if you do join up.