To think that pregnant women don't trump everybody else for a seat on the tube?

[dancersdad]

I possibly need some perspective. DW and I were in London today, and unavoidably had to travel on the tube this evening in commuter rush hour. DW has a number of health issues that aren't physically visible, but definitely do impact upon her ability to stand on a crowded tube. When we got on at the start of our journey back the tube was packed with no free seats, so we both stood and I held onto DW as I was worried she was going to fall. The carriage was made up almost entirely of commuters. Two stops into our journey an elderly man got off leaving one of the priority seats free- the only free seat in the carriage. DW went to take the seat and was almost knocked onto the floor by a heavily pregnant woman who tried to slide into the seat alongside DW and beat her to it, as it was DW was already in the seat and the other woman stood up. She then told DW she was so sorry to ask her to move, but she was in a priority seat and as she was sure she knew, priority seats are reserved for those who really need them. DW told her that she had a reason for needing the priority seat too and refused to move when asked again. Cue a whole string of abuse about how no one has any manners nowadays, that she had asked DW to give up her seat for her because as a woman she would expect DW to understand that pregnancy can be hell, the least she could do would be to let her have the seat etc. I stepped in at this point and explained that DW really did need the seat, and loudly suggested to the rest of the carriage that I was sure someone else would be willing to give up a seat for her. Suddenly everyone else was deeply engrossed in their ipads, kindles etc, except for an elderly lady in the other priority seat who clearly needed it too, and offered her seat. The pregnant woman announced loudly that she couldn't possibly ask someone else who needed the seat to give it up, and it was a shame that some people (glaring at DW) had no respect for the priority system, which is in place to ensure those who really need a seat can get one. I pointed out again that DW had a genuine need for the seat too. Cue huffing, eye rolling, and lurching over DW whenever the train changed speed for the rest of her journey.

AIBU to think that although some pregnant women do need a seat on a tube, they shouldn't assume automatic priority over others also in need? There's no priority seat ranking system I don't know about?

I was pretty shocked that no one offered their seat to the other woman either. However, DW got to the seat first and also needed to sit down. I assumed, perhaps wrongly, that the seat was hers. I didn't have a seat or I would have offered her mine. If the pregnant woman had gotten to the seat first I would never have asked her to give it up for DW, but DW got to the seat first and she had a need for it.

FaFoutis yes, DW teaches dance and drama- she worked in both professionally before she was suffering from any of the health problems she is now. Admittedly she isn't working at the moment because she has been unwell, but when able to do so she will be returning to teaching both. Within the context in which I said she was a dance teacher, on a totally different thread, I don't think I was unreasonable to do so?

'What were the 'unavoidable' reasons you were on a rush hour train OP? I think that a heavily pregnant woman who has been in work all day probably did really need that seat. Maybe you should have organised your day better to avoid rush hour?'

Maybe the pregnant woman could have organised hers to better avoid rush hour. Maybe she was in town for the day, too, not at work.

YANBU.

People really have 'Baby On Board' badges? FFS.

Loudly making passive aggressive comments is embarrassing for everyone but also pointless because you don't get what you want/need.

A quiet "excuse me, would you mind if I sat down? I wouldn't normally ask but I am pregnant/on crutches/can't stand for long/feeling unwell/feeling a bit wobbly/feeling a bit faint" usually does the trick with people falling over themselves to help. Anyone refusing in those circumstances looks like an arse.

If things are really bad you can throw in "I really wouldn't want to hold everyone up if I topple over/pass out." If there is one thing the London commuter hates it's been avoidably delayed and the whole carriage will blame the poor bugger who didn't get up.

A badge doesn't justify a thing.

The baby in board badges don't justify pregnancy or the need for a seat, it doesn't need to be justified.

But it does point out the need, and hopefully makes the selfish twats without a problem think twice about keeping their seats when others are in greater need.

Pregnancy is not always visible. Neither is disability. So I don't see anything wrong with a badge to point out the need for priority seating for all cases. It doesn't have to say disabled on it.

The other people on the tube were the twats & that is where pregnant lady should have aimed her arseyness.

If your wife cannot be guaranteed a seat as her condition renders her to be so ill, then why is she taking the tube in the first place.

Good grief. You do realise that seriously ill and disabled people will often have to take public transport (including for hospital visits) because they can't afford anything else, don't you? there isn't the funds for patient transport for everyone who needs it. And guess what - lots of disabled people like to try to lead "normal" lives, just like everyone else.

Using your logic, if so many people apparently lie about being disabled just to get a seat, then how many of these supposedly pregnant women are just wearing false bumps to get a seat?

Gobblino Why should the OP's wife be grumbled at by pregnant lady when it's not her fault that commuters are selfish?!

Yanbu at all. Your poor wife.
I have spinal damage and joint problems. I struggle on public transport. Im only in my twenties but have had these problems for last nine years. Its horrible hearing people saying horrible things about me, like i should be giving my seat up for the elderly. I cant stand up for a long time as it makes the pain even worse and I'm on enough pain killers as it is!I cant give my seat as id end up collapsing. Its really hard having problems that people cant see.
Someone should have given up a seat for the pregnant woman, but that woman should not of been the op's wife, nor should she have kept on at op's wide.

Wife*

The packed carriage didn't respond,or offer a seat.that is their responsibility

The pregnant ladies responsibility is to her un born child, its her responsibility to get a seat if she can for comfort and safety.

If she occasional has to get aggressive over it to selfish arse people on the tube...so be it.

She wasnt such a bitch to take the seat off an elderly person.

I go by the rule whoever gets there first gets the seat and there should be no ousting of others as you don't know if they have hidden problems.

In this situation if the woman was really scared about getting bumped ect. she wouldn't have tried to slide into the seat at same time as OP's DW or kept lurching over her.

I do have some sympathy for pregnant lady though.

While not condoning her behaviour in the slightest, and making massive assumptions, I have been there.

Heavily pregnant, low BP, terrible spd, feeling like I was going to faint, and just desperate for a seat. Not on public transport luckily. I sat I the floor in the end as I just couldn't cope and then had to be yanked to my feet, that was embarrassing

I think if I had been on public transport, I would have cried.

I'm just appalled (but not particularly surprised) that no-one else offered their seat. People are so inconsiderate and selfish. They are the ones at fault here.

For what it's worth I also don't get the don't travel in rush hour comments, things happen things go wrong, and heaven forbid some disabled people also work.... Yes it's better if your disabled to avoid it, it's better if you pregnant to avoid it, and better if we all avoid it. However many pregnant employees request and get as part of risk assessment, but why should the disabled woman be criticised for travelling at that time when a pregnant person is not.

I am now imagining the op's wife sprinting to the seat after that last post... past the pregnant woman, round one of those men with unfeasibly large bollocks who can't put his legs together, hurdling a wheely trolley bag...

Ops wife should have been grumbled at but over all pregnant lady should not have to grumble at anyone for a seat.

someone should have jumped up and offered her a seat.

See, this is why a priority seating badge might be helpful, it would help prevent nasty comment and looks towards those with hidden needs.

Ops wife should not have been grumbled at.

Sorry get different hours

Anyway, good thread op, nice triangle set up, its going to be a go er isn't it...will go down in MN law..

Why should those with health needs wear a badge declaring it.its intrusive and stigmatising

Yanbu

The pregnant woman was incredibly rude. Unreasonably so.

The rest of the carriage was very unreasonable.

The op's wife told the pregnant woman she needed the seat. Given the woman had already tried to humiliate her out of it, it would take some brass neck to then lie about needing it wouldn't it.

However long and shit the pregnant woman's day had been, that kind of behaviour is unreasonable. And she was certainly directing her "lacking manners" comment at the wrong person.

But why, slithytove, should someone with a hidden condition be forced to 'out' themselves and wear a degrading badge?!

DW got to the seat first and also needed to sit down

So it's just survival of the fittest?
Pretty ironic given the nature of the discussion

As intrusive as it would be i wouldn't be against the badge.
I hate the looks and the comments i get because i look young and healthy. I would rather the badge than having to tell everybody my rather long complete medical history