To think that pregnant women don't trump everybody else for a seat on the tube?

[dancersdad]

I possibly need some perspective. DW and I were in London today, and unavoidably had to travel on the tube this evening in commuter rush hour. DW has a number of health issues that aren't physically visible, but definitely do impact upon her ability to stand on a crowded tube. When we got on at the start of our journey back the tube was packed with no free seats, so we both stood and I held onto DW as I was worried she was going to fall. The carriage was made up almost entirely of commuters. Two stops into our journey an elderly man got off leaving one of the priority seats free- the only free seat in the carriage. DW went to take the seat and was almost knocked onto the floor by a heavily pregnant woman who tried to slide into the seat alongside DW and beat her to it, as it was DW was already in the seat and the other woman stood up. She then told DW she was so sorry to ask her to move, but she was in a priority seat and as she was sure she knew, priority seats are reserved for those who really need them. DW told her that she had a reason for needing the priority seat too and refused to move when asked again. Cue a whole string of abuse about how no one has any manners nowadays, that she had asked DW to give up her seat for her because as a woman she would expect DW to understand that pregnancy can be hell, the least she could do would be to let her have the seat etc. I stepped in at this point and explained that DW really did need the seat, and loudly suggested to the rest of the carriage that I was sure someone else would be willing to give up a seat for her. Suddenly everyone else was deeply engrossed in their ipads, kindles etc, except for an elderly lady in the other priority seat who clearly needed it too, and offered her seat. The pregnant woman announced loudly that she couldn't possibly ask someone else who needed the seat to give it up, and it was a shame that some people (glaring at DW) had no respect for the priority system, which is in place to ensure those who really need a seat can get one. I pointed out again that DW had a genuine need for the seat too. Cue huffing, eye rolling, and lurching over DW whenever the train changed speed for the rest of her journey.

AIBU to think that although some pregnant women do need a seat on a tube, they shouldn't assume automatic priority over others also in need? There's no priority seat ranking system I don't know about?

Is an eating disorder a disability????????

As the pregnant woman seemed quite vocal it seems reasonable to assume she would cited any disability as additional reason for needing a seat.
Out of all the pregnant women who travel by tube every day and do not get a seat, how many do actually fall and hurt the baby? Yes, it is a risk but is it such a likely outcome from not getting a seat? You be much more likely to fall from being hustled by rush hour crowds or when getting on or off the tube.

Brittle bones are an issue when standing on public transport, Gymboy.

What do you think?
OP did state his DW is recovering from abdominal surgery which almost definitely means she needs a seat.

I dunno, how many people who have hidden disabilities fall, for that matter?

Really, it's probably fairly unlikely that either of them are going to fall, but given that a) the woman was heavily pregnant, and b) that she was travelling alone (or presumably the OP would have said otherwise), and c) the OP's wife had her husband there to physically help hold her up if necessary...I think the pregnant woman was at greater risk.

And yes, I do think it's a much bigger deal for a heavily pregnant woman to fall on the tube, than a non-pregnant adult. I'd rather injure myself than see something happen to a pregnant woman that could put the foetus at risk.

When I had abdominal surgeryi 8ouldn't have dreamt of going on a tube for a good while .
' I think there is a difference between a disability and being ill. If you have a disability then you have to live your life with it. If you are ill, you give yourself time to recover/ feel better before doing things that are physically stressful. So after surgery, I would have found a less stressful/ less taxing way of making the journey.

In one of his updates, the OP said:

Among other health problems, which we were in London for a specialist appointment concerning, DW is in the middle of her second ED relapse in three years. She had abdominal surgery recently she's still recovering from and combined with low blood pressure fainting on a crowded tube is a real possibility. Because she's so underweight it's very likely that if she had fallen she would have broken something because her bones are more vulnerable

I feel very sorry for his wife, as it sounds awful. BUT...if she is so underweight, it shouldn't be difficult for him to physically support her if she starts feeling faint. Why would she have fallen to the ground and broken a bone if he had his arm around her?

For what it's worth, I would feel differently if the OP's wife was also travelling alone.

Lucky you that you had the choice not to use public transport. I didn't. We don't know if OP and his DW had the choice either.
You do realise that not everyone can make the same choices as you? If you need to go to hospital in a different town, can't afford a taxi and your friends are not available then it's public transport or nothing.

Maybe she would have fallen if OP was taken unawares on a crowded tube? Maybe there wasn't room for him to physically ba able to move his arms to reach out and grab her? Maybe suddenly supporting a dead weight would be physically too much for him? There's a myriad if possibilities.

I have had to travel to hospital during peak times, on public transport. Great for all of you who can afford taxis, many of us if we are off work ill, have wages reduced and thus have very little money. If you have a hospital appointment for 9am, you have no choice but to travel during peak times.

The lack of compassion on this thread just astounds me.

He said in the OP that he was physically supporting her while they both stood, so he obviously was capable. And why would it catch him 'unawares' if she fell?

Look, I'll concede that there was no need for the pregnant woman to get rude and huffy. But if the OP really didn't think he could physically handle supporting his wife anymore, he could have handled the original situation better. Something like, 'I'm so sorry, I can see you're heavily pregnant but my wife is recovering from an operation and I've been literally holding her up for the past few stops'. Probably would have gone down a lot better than her just saying 'I have a reason for needing it too', and refusing to move.

Yes, I know people don't have to disclose their medical details, but we live in a society, and if you use public facilities it helps to communicate with other people rather than just insisting on your rights.

(By the way, I don't think that people with physical issues should stay off public transport - at all. I travelled everywhere on the tube on crutches for 5 months, no choice. It was hell. So I really do sympathize with OP's wife. I just think he handled it poorly and there was more than one person being a bit unreasonable.)

I disagree that he was unreasonable. IME people do not believe someone who has invisible disabilities. I have lost count of the number of times I have tried to explain my issues, only for someone to say - Oh I had that too when I had - insert very temporary minor illness.

I think a nonpregnant non disabled person should have stood up and offered their seat rather than 2 people with valid claims for the seat trying to play top trumps.

Yes I think you are right Jaded, that most people who are not personally affected by chronic illness or disability, have no idea of the impact.

And many many people continue to work with serious illnesses or disabilities that mean they have to travel, use the supermarket, etc, at similar times to most other working people.

Most disabilities and chronic illnesses are not visible. That person who looks young and healthy, may be in a lot of pain standing up. Or like my friend with menieres disease that affects your balance, fall over a lot on any moving public transport.

I find that if you trump loudly and malodorously enough you will inevitably get a seat, plus the ones either side.

When OP said his wife had ED, I possibly incorrectly assumed he meant Ehlers Danlos syndrome. I didn't think of eating disorder straight away.

Either way, the woman needed a seat and did not deserve to wrongly accused of trying it on by a ranty and rude pregnant woman who thinks that pregnancy trumps everything.

I think if you're a seasoned commuter with an invisible disability, it would be good to have an option you can have on your tickets that state you need a priority seat. Or some sort of card.

They do this in Paris. A friend with MS has one.

broken eating disorders are all different. Some people function well, some people don't. Some people look well, some people don't. Some need to be hospitalised and have surgery - like the OP's DW.

People keep saying what they should have been doing.

It's easier said that done.

If they were on a train for a long journey I think it's safe to assume they couldn't afford a taxi.

Would you say that if the pregnant woman was in such a state that she needed a seat then she shouldn't be on the tube either? Or is it just disabled people who have to go in taxis?