to feel screwed over by our society, can't afford a home, can't afford children, can't afford car

[Lauranda]

I'm in my early 30s, had a great up bringing, do a job I like and got married last year. I do feel very lucky.

However where we live in the south east, all we can afford to rent is a badly converted 1 bed flat with a damp problem. Can't really save much and are very economical with our money so can't see ever affording anything bigger and could never bring up a child here.

My parents managed to get a large 4 bed Edwardian house on one sallery when I was growing up and dads job level was about the same as dh. No way could with double sallarys afford anything near that lifestyle.

Parents keep saying my time will come, but looking at the statistics that seams very wishful thinking. Parents have kindly offered 15k to help get a house but to be any use would need much more than that and to pray interest rates never rose much.

Am I alone in just being unable to afford children even though we both work full time?

its to do with proportions. so assuming you need a 25% deposit. You have 40k.

nice house = 160k, deposit 40k
doer-upper needing 30k renovations = 120k, deposit 30k leaving my enough to make improvements.

A few years ago it would have been relatively easier to keep money out, put down 12k as a deposit leaving you nearly enough to make the improvements.

It makes it tricky for those who are trying to scrape a deposit together to buy a house to do up. Of course you can do it over time but with prices as they are its difficult to save.

If you want a better lifestyle and affordable living you should at least think about relocating to a cheaper area. Or doing a longer commute. I know you shouldn't have to but that's life.

We are crying out for good nurses here in Nottinghamshire. In fact, I could get you an interview next week if you wanted to move away from the city!

Some people really dont get it, that not everyone can just move away at the drop of a hat and not suffer considerably from doing so. Some people really struggle to cope and become depressed at having to move away from family and their support network. No wonder communities have eroded and its an I'm alright Jack, every man for himself culture these days. Some people here are really underestimating how significantly it can affect people to move away from their families and friends.

Why do people think me and DP, who are both on benefits at the moment, can afford (yes we can!) to have children and are happy to be doing so despite not owning our own house and not even having a job at the moment? Because we both have loads of family in the local area. DP's entire family lives on our doorstep and mine are in the next town. They have helped us so much and continue to be right there to provide much needed support both practical and financial, aswell as the fact we have that sense of belonging you only have when you are in a community with people you know, love and trust. I would be seriously lonely, isolated and depressed to move away from our families and the support they will be providing for us. I feel so lucky these days that we are not from London/the South East. I honestly find it inhumane that people are FORCED (yes forced, the fact is some people do want to move away etc and that is fine, but many many more do not) to move away from their support networks and families purely because of money.

As said its no wonder this country has gone to the dogs with no community spirit whatsoever and an I'm alright Jack, lonely culture. No wonder so many people die and no one knows about it for months/years.

My family all moved away from me. In this day and age of technology it's really not so bad.

I think it is hard to understand people on the other side of the divide - the I cannot do anythings and the I can suffer whatever it takes to achieve my objective people. I certainly find it hard and I am trying to understand the position of these - I cannot be moved - people. I think some of us will endure suffering for rewards later and others are not made that way.

I wonder if it's to do with university? Mym parents left home for university in the 1940s. We all did to other cities in the 80s. My own children have. That is a very different culture from working class non university educated lower waged people. However even with those (my own ancestors) they moved countries - Ireland - UK and then in the 20s as there was not enough food UK to Canada/US some of them.

Toby 30 years ago no way ever could we afford a 25% deposit. We were going for 5% or 10% on a first purchase which is why the new help to buy scheme is so good as ti makes the 5% deposit again the thing for some people who want to use that scheme.

22 you're describing many things I've gone through in abundance, but the reality of today's economy very often is that when embarking on a serious, new career (particularly if relatively recently graduated) you have to follow the work. I have spent several years living in places I wasn't necessarily that keen on, but understood perfectly well that the mountain won't always come to Mohammed. If you are prepared to make such initial sacrifices (and yes, of course it's immensely challenging) then generally later on your choices start increasing.

Funkybarn, my dad, the only family member not to live in the country anymore, keeps in touch regularly through technology. It is NOT the same. There is lots of support he cannot provide (atm, he provides financially because its the only way he can support me). For some people this might not be an issue at all but for lots more it is an issue. Talking on the phone and online just does not compare to spending time in someones physical presence.

As I said, a lonely, I'm alright Jack, every man for himself culture. And just because YOU are ok and can cope, doesnt mean everyone else is. I would hate to be a lonely mother with PND alone all day everyday and my mother or sister cant even pop round to help me out around the house, give me a hug or anything similar. This really does matter immensely to a lot of people.

22 that might be true, but neither does it compare to one handwritten letter a month or something, and at least provides a generally free way to talk properly and even see each other. It's not the same as physically being there of course, but it's certainly a big help compared to how things used to be.

22, I and my husband have lived away from family since 18 (husband 17) - we moved to get work as there was nothing where we lived (he was Wales, I was Scotland).

You make new friends when you move, and family are no longer than a day's drive away if you stay in UK.

You say others don't understand why it so hard for people to move, it's because we've done it, and it wasn't the end of the world.

This isn't a perfect world, life isn't fair and we live in a one party state run by idiots masquerading as a democracy. We can all winge, roll over and become the perpetual kidult victims our Lords and Masters would prefer; or we can roll up our sleeves, look at the limited resources we DO have and do our best to disrupt their plans to see us all ground under the Orwellian boot, by exercising the limited control over our own lives we do still have available to us.

I prefer the proactive option, partly because it is the only way left to rebel against the unfairness of it all, and try and create a better future our kids. When there are no skilled workers left in London and the SE, and no binmen, nannies or people to clean the bottoms of the aging fat cats perhaps our clueless government will get a clue. Unfortunately I predict financial collapse and civil disorder before that happens as slow on the uptake doesn't begin to describe the numpties running the show at the moment.

It's a valid choice to stay near family if that's what you want, but it's just not reality in the global era to expect the same opportunities if you're not prepared to compromise. This acceptance doesn't amount to 'I'm alright Jack' (like we don't all struggle....) or being 'screwed over'.

Some people really dont get it, that not everyone can just move away at the drop of a hat and not suffer considerably from doing so. Some people really struggle to cope and become depressed at having to move away from family and their support network.

I do get it as I have done it as have most of my friends, colleagues and family at some time or other in lives. Most people do not "suffer considerably" as result and see it as one of those things. It's certainly not the worse thing that you can go through particularly today when technology makes it very easy to stay in touch. We are talking about moving a couple of hours drive away not to the end of the earth.

Uncle T, not everyone is interested in embarking on a serious new career, and consider their family life to be more important. The economy changing isnt going to change many people's core values.

The problem isn't really about having to go elsewhere to have the career you want, its about people having to uproot and leave their whole family and community behind when they don't actually want to, and not for any particularly great career opportunity either, often just so they can afford a basic house to live in. I do not believe that is right although I do accept theres little anyone can do about it, I dont think its nice to belittle other people's feelings on this, as I know myself faced with such a situation I would be very very distressed and worried.

whatever5, how do you know most people wouldn't suffer considerably? You can't apply your personal feelings to everyone else, people have stated on here that it would affect their lives negatively. It might be just one of those things to you, but with someone who has different life circumstances it might be the straw that breaks the camels back.

There is no way that my parents had a better standard of living then me. They may have had cheaper house prices, but they also had 15% interest rates. My grandparents may also have had cheaper house prices, but they also had a world war to contend with.

The privileged of both of their generations may of had it easy, but you certainly can't say that everyone did.

22, it's not always about moving for a career - it's sometimes about moving for the work.

Completely hypothetically (not directing this at you specifically, just general 'you')
If there are no jobs in the area you grew up, but there is work available 60 miles away - why would you not move? This is what I don't understand.

Scarlett, not everyone can afford a car to drive and see family. All your points often do not apply to working class people, and people who actually need their families support in their lives. Why do you apply YOUR personal situation to everyone else? I have friends who have moved away for their partners work and have been fine, and other people who have no coped at all. I think it should be an option and not something anyone has to do.

As people say, on mental health etc threads it so often starts with the fact the person suffering lives nowhere near any family or support. You make new friends? Some people really struggle making new friends and a lot likely will not succeed in doing so. A new friend isn't going to replace my mother or sisters tbh, either.

Who's belittling what and who now??

You lost me at 'he provides financially as that's the only way he can support me'.

And I am someone who suffered massively when DD was born from loneliness as we have no family in this country nor at that time any friends.

I think what people are saying is you can have the family support you need or a house but it doesn't seem like you can have both at the moment, but that is just life.

FWIW I have a home in London, but no family support. It is shit but I'm actually here until we can save enough to return home.

Making assumptions about 'class' really isn't helpful. Having grown up washing my clothes in the bath every day, no car, no phone, no heating, I can personally attest that presenting a contrary point of view does not mean that people aren't 'working class'.

Scarlett, for me it depends on earning potential. If such a job was considerably better paying than one I could get in my local area, I (hypothetically) would definately consider moving for it. If it was an option of being on benefits as I am at the moment and living near family, I would take that option rather than take a low paying job elsewhere where I would be on the same money I am on benefits. If I was to do such a thing, I would struggle more than needs be because I'd have no family support near me and would not be getting any extra money to make up for this fact.

As it is, the only thing that would have me leaving my local area would be a great career opportunity with a great wage.