To wonder if a lot of people who are Christians have had a rather nice life?

[stilllivingbythesea14]

I know I phrased that clumsily but I know a few Christians. They are nice people but very devout and pretty much always have been.

They are all white, middle class, privately educated, university graduates, plenty of money, nice jobs, one SAHM.

It must be easier to have faith in God if you've had a nice life?

I'd like to believe but I'm not sure I can.

Waves to Zing

I have had a huge amount of unhappiness in my life. My mother was unstable alcoholic, I never knew my biological father, my stepfather was violence and committed suicide in my teens....I'll stop there because I realise I'm beginning to sound like an Eastenders plotline . I became a Christian when I was in my early twenties from an atheist / lapsed Catholic agnostic background. In my experience people become Christians from all sorts of the backgrounds. For obvious reasons I had to work through the 'Why does God allow suffering' stuff very early on. I actually think suffering is a bigger issue for atheism than Christianity. According to an atheist worldview this life is it. This life is all there is - if life deals you a terrible hand then tough - there is no afterlife in which wrongs can be righted. I think this is why there's actually a more noticeable correlation between atheism and affluence. Atheism is very much a modern western phenomenon.

For what its worth, I don't claim there is a tidy Christian answer to why people suffer. But Christianity does assume that God has given us to ability to chose, and to make choices which hurt ourselves and others. It also says that God hasn't left alone in our suffering - God became man in the person of Jesus and experienced the full range of human suffering - betrayal, torture, false accusations, death, even the sense of Godforsakeness. Also in my experience God can bring good out of bad if we work with him (I fully appreciate it doesn't always feel like that though). Personally I'm also not someone who feels the need to restrict the afterlife to people who die with 'Christian' stamped on their foreheads, because God is both merciful and just. I think there's hope for everyone.

Historically (puts history PhD hat on), there has been a tendency for practising Christians to move higher up the social scale. In the 19th century participation in any movement which denounced drinking, smoking and gambling and emphasised literacy (in order to read Bible) was not unlikely to move people up the social scale somewhat.

waves back to mdh

you know I keep skimming the prayer thread, but I just can't bring myself to say "I'll pray for this or that". not yet.
it would feel insincere.

it is sad really
not being able to pray how I used to is unsettling.
like a wedge is driven between God and me, bit like a communication breakdown in any relationship.

Funny thing is that a lot of great things happened since and I have no problem giving thanks and being grategul for the help and the prayers that were answered.
is that weird?

I hadn't read the whole thread, didn't know the op had a hard time, I just thought what she said was ignorant. Will have to look back now and find out what made people so angry. Irritated maybe and this is Aibu but on the other hand it's hardly a cat shit in the garden thread.

Oh zing - you don't have to pray to be on the payer thread - we're there through the good and bad and it can be a lovely place to simply offload, so please do feel welcome to. Go easy on yourself - you feel hurt and bewildered, and need to heal. Don't beat yourself up for not feeling able to pray - and remember prayer isn't always sitting down intentionally saying words. It can be a thought, prayer can be a song or tears or a rant. Prayer is what your spirit is doing, and takes different forms for different times.

[Thanks]

prayer and

YANBU.

Dear tunnocks. Have been wondering how you are getting on.

Tunnocks, so sorry.

Tunnocks, will light candles in my mind for you.

Op,

Whatever you do, or don't do, don't be scared of Hell. If there is a God, Islam recognises him as the compassionate, the merciful, Jesus told us to ask for mercy, the Psalms compare him to a mother hen with her brood under her wings. If we forgive our children if they do something silly, how much more would a God of that sort understand us.

And if you can't believe in God, believe in love. If you believe that there is nothing more important, deep down , than love, and you train yourself to act accordingly even when you don't feel like it, then you are doing the most Christ like thing you can do.

Don't forget also that to work is to pray, if you are doing your best. Prayer doesn't come in one form but many, and you can find the way that's best for you and discover you were praying all along.

I've been impressed by your responses, you have not got cross despite considerable opportunity.

And don't worry about feeling suicidal. Sounds an odd thing to say, but lots of us do. Go to see the doctor. And look after yourself.

But yes, religion can be seen as the opium of the people, used by oppressors to keep people down, used by serfs not to demand their rights in this life. There is s dash of truth if course in it.

Lovely response ancient and from Mr Wallet a page or two ago as well

There are some vile responses from so-called Christians on this thread.

All the best tunnocks.

Ancient, I don't know - the major religions are all pretty clear about Hell.

What a lovely response ancient.

Agree Genz, lots of nasty responses here but I would expect no less sadly. The church was just full of nastiness in my experience.

I hope you are ok OP.

The church is full of human beings, in my experience.

If you are flawed and struggling, you'd be made very welcome

Those of us who are perfect probably don't need it . Jesus said that he came for the imperfect, not the righteous

I have the same fears about hell hanging over my head after my church experiences, it is very hard to shake, I try not to think about it. I was told I had demons, was lovely.

Oh and many of those demons were there because I had the audacity to be struggling after they had prayed for me.

plot your experience sounds awful. im sorry you went through that. it isn't a true reflection of the many genuine caring churches out there - its a shame some people use and abuse christianity to get on like this and have a devastating effect on peoples lives. but many churches and christians genuinely care and want to pray and help and understand struggles are ongoing. i myself have struggled for years and have had so many prayers for healing, and yet still struggle. ive just become closer to God through it and grown stronger in a lot of different ways, but have met a few misinformed christians along the way who think they can pray for me and i should be 'fixed' instantly. we can't judge God by a few christians who think they know best.

How are you today op? You've been in my thoughts. I love ancients response because that is so very right - to pursue love is to pursue God because God is love.

plot I am so sad to hear of your nasty experiences. People are flawed and get it wrong. No excuse, but you don't have to live in the shadow of those words said over you or in the shadow of a fear about hell. If you can imagine God as the most loving parent, besotted by her beautiful baby, that's how God feels about you, and that's the truth you can live in the shadow of, as it were. I can understand if after that you never want anything to do with church again, but I still hope you are able to be set free from those words.