To have said no?

[Tiggywinklespinny]

We have just had dinner, chicken veggies and baby new potatoes.

Dsd (10) can barely use a knife and was asked to cut her chicken not eat it off the fork in a great lump. Instead she said she didn't want it and left it. Too full she said.

She's now on meltdown because I've said no to ice-cream. AIBU??

I'm more puzzled than ever.

If the child can use a knife but is too lazy to, wants ice cream and slams a door, breaking glass when told she can't have it, and there is no reason whatsoever other than she is "pushing boundaries" "a brat" or "a madam," what is there to ask about?

There isn't a person on earth that would say not giving her ice cream is unreasonable.

So, er...what on earth was the point?

theRealAmandaClarke I agree.

I think any derision and judgement from the OP was levelled at other posters, not her DSD.

I assume OP asked the question to reassure herself in the face of all the stress being caused by a stropping 10 year old DSD. Or for a little light hearted banter, as evidenced by the 'need gin' comments, which are typical mumsnet venting tropes.

Her mistake, IMO was that a) AIBU wasn't the best place to post if she wanted to vent and get reassurance and b) times that last comment by 10 because she's posting as a stepmother.

I do actually feel silly going into this level of analysis now. I think this thread is more interesting because it typifies some of the issues in the wider debate of whether stepmums get short shrift on mumsnet, rather than because it in itself is a particularly controversial or even interesting AIBU.

Don't know if that was aimed at me or not?

I obviously think step-families can have different problems to regular families.

I also think there are lots of problems that overlap in both types of family.

I'm not at all convinced this AIBU hangs on a step-issue.

I guess I don't see why people should respond differently, no. When the issue at stake is to do with step dynamics, of course. But not with every day stuff where a stepmum is asking a question that any parent or guardian might ask, or when they're having a little vent/moan about the normal ups and downs of living with and raising children. Also I think the reason I am defensive about this is that the 'differently' you refer to often seems to mean 'more suspiciously and less empathetically'.

I get what you're saying, that step families have a whole heap of special issues and I wouldn't try to deny that. But it's hard seeing stepmothers come in for criticism on here that regular mothers don't, just because people make a whole load of assumptions about those special issues as soon as they read the word 'step'. It's hard to see MN offering so much support to mums and so much less to stepmums. I suppose it's inevitable given the nature of the site, but sometimes it really does seem to go too far.

Anyway, I know some people will continue to see this AIBU as being rooted in a step-issue, and who knows it could be, I don't think so but I certainly don't have enough information to claim to really know. I don't think I can analyse this thread any more!

I think that if the op had just stuck to saying AIBU for not letting my child have ice cream after refusing to eat all her chicken dinner, the thread would have gone ok.

But the op volunteered the DSD stuff, including family background information, which lead to all the enquires and comments.
If that bit was never mentioned by the op, the thread would have been much shorter!

But don't you understand that the dynamics of a family can influence that childs day-to-day behaviour, especially if the dynamic includes an uncaring mother and a step family?

I think the thread would have gone the same way if any stressful family dynamic was mentioned, OP just happened to bring up that she is a stepmother and the biomother doesn't care much for her daughter.

Agreed if she negated to mention that it would have been much shorter, but I think it would have gone the same way if OP was the biomother and the child had an uncaring father, for example.

(In fact, I think if this issue were applied to a non-step family, the daughter would be getting more empathy and a bit of slack).

Sort of. First I'd forget the chicken, it's done. Then I'd offer fruit if she was hungry. No ice cream, not as punishment for not eating chicken but because she hardly are anything and if she's hungry fruit has better nutrition than ice cream.

Then if she pitched a fit or refused fruit, then she's not really hungry anyway. I'm kind of a sucker when I think dc is hungry as he's slight but I'm not going to let him get away with just eating desserts either.

Then before next chicken dinner I'd make sure she knew how to cut it or I'd cut it myself.

Sorry should have read whole thread. Yelling and banging is Not what gets one what they want at this house. Surely you know that saying no was not not unreasonable OP?

riverboat no, I disagree that the derision and judgement was at posters, rather than the DSD (although it certainly came later of course)
The judgmental comment "can barely use a knife" was used to describe the DSD.
Besides, the "meltdown" came after the ice cream refusal. So they scene, as described by Tiggy went like this:
DSD (eating lump of chicken from her fork)
DF "please use your knife rather than eating that chicken in one great lump"
DSD (puts down fork, perhaps somewhat sulkily?) I'm not hungry (we acknowledge the huffiness of this action/ statement)
DSM "well you won't want ice cream then as you're not hungry" (wording extrapolated from OPs description of events)
DSD (has tantrum, storms upstairs, slams a door -glass breaks-, phones her DM)
DF (upset at scene)
DSM (stressed, reaches for gin)

The next day:
DSD "can I have ice cream"
Non specific DP/ DSP "no, it's before 8am"
DSD (helps herself to ice cream)

It reads like a farce.
I think it escalated unneccessarily.
I think it's likely the DSD was already upset/ in a mood and that the atmosphere of the meal and the tone of her DF asking her to eat "properly" and the OP's reaction are all possible contributors to the tantrum. Also. None of this was effective because this 10 yo awoke freshly pissed off and helped herself to ice cream.

I often handle things less well than I wanted to. But I can generally admit when I'm wrong.
But the op is resolute. No compromising. No acknowledgement that this girl might be suffering (although the point about h DM having a lack of interest was made by the op) no, we're not allowed to mention that lest we be critical of step parents.

Well, I'm off to work.
It has been interesting because it's been so full of ppl slating parents who don't want to argue about food as not caring about manners/ being responsible for the demise of manners in our society/ being happy for their DCs to eat of the floor.
This is a household that has a strict view of table manners and the DSD can barely use a knife, lays about waiting form her breakfast and helps herself to ice cream before breakfast.
I think I'll stick to my softer approach thanks.
No ones eaten off the floor yet.
The tone with which the op spoke about her dsd was not warm. It just wasn't. I'm not inferring that because she is a sm. it leaped from the screen.

Its possible they have a great relationship. But for me, that didn't come across here.
Besides, the incident also involved the DF, and he was just as "culpable" in this debacle. I'm not "blaming" a sm here. Just answering that I think it was unreasonable, in response to being asked the question "aibu"

I agree with everylong way back.

Also plenty of people use a fork only in a 'smart restaurant'

Knives are overrated...

knives are overrated

AmandaClarke's post is an excellent summary of the thread (are you a barrister by any chance?)

I can't abide it when people jump on the "the OP is getting these responses becasue she's a SM". It's lazy and untrue. The OP would be getting exactly the same responses if she wasnt a SM.

If that was the case, why was OP's post about loving her DSD ignored? Why was she jumped on for being 'horrible' when it was her husband (the child's father) who triggered the tantrum? Why did a poster feel the need to ask another poster if they were a step parent?

Selective reading?

(I am more surprised that a child putting a whole chicken breast on a fork to chew at is deemed acceptable, than I am at the way this thread has gone)

What wider picture? Child has tantrum, parent doesn't give in to tantrum. Where's the wider picture?

My child had a tantrum at the weekend. She's in a stable box standard family. Does that mean there is a wider picture there? Am I 'horrible', 'uncaring', 'dismissive'. Should my husband be rounded on, as it was me that triggered DDs tantrum and sent her to bed early? Does my love for my child jump out, or am I 'cruel', forceful, 'them and us', 'need to win', 'believe all children are born evil'?

Being a stepchild is pretty shit all round even if the step parent is Mary Poppins ime.

again, I agree with everlong

I definitely think the op loves her DSD.
She wouldnt bother to help discipline her if she didnt.