Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask those of you who are pro life?

999 replies

Anonynony · 21/04/2014 14:49

How do you feel about friends who have had abortions? Can you maintain friendships with people who have had an abortion and no regrets?

One of my friends has stunned me, talking about another friend of ours who had considered an abortion and my friend said I'm so glad she didn't because I wouldn't have been able to stay friends with her Shock
I'm really surprised, I'm extremely pro choice and vocal about it but this doesn't bother my friend.
But what my friend doesn't know is that I also had an abortion and although I have no regrets I feel a bit strange around my friend now?

OP posts:
Redhead4 · 23/04/2014 08:46

I am pro life.

My DB's DF had an abortion- I am very good friends with her.

My 'D'F since school has had 9 abortions, using it as birth control. I wouldn't say hi if I saw her walking down the street.

CaptChaos · 23/04/2014 08:50

Redhead out of interest, at what number of abortions, between 1 and 9, does a woman change from someone you can be good friends with to someone you wouldn't say hi to?

ikeaismylocal · 23/04/2014 08:52

Making abortions illegal or legal has no affect on the number of abortions that are performed each year

This is not true. Many women who choose abortion because it is a safe legal procedure would not choose abortion if it was dangerous and illegal.

A friend who I supported through an abortion was very undecided and said to me that she wished she lived in a country where abortion was illegal as that would be her choice made and society wouldn't expect her to just getan abortion.

Yes some abortions would still happen which is why abortion should be safe and legal but not nearly as many as happen now.

Dawndonnaagain · 23/04/2014 08:54

Yes some abortions would still happen which is why abortion should be safe and legal but not nearly as many as happen now.
Why not? If it is safe and legal what is the problem?

2blackcats2 · 23/04/2014 08:54

Ikea, cost? What do you mean?

MaidOfStars · 23/04/2014 08:56

Ikea I said this regarding very late"theoretical" abortions where the fetus would survive outside the womb with limited medical intervention, if the baby's only option for survival is the umbilical cord ( pre 23 weeks) I am pro-choice.

What are your basic 'survival' criteria?
What do you consider 'limited' medical intervention?
When does a fetus reach the milestone of 'surviv[al] outside the womb with limited medical intervention'?
Why is ability to survive outside the womb an important milestone for you, when it is only dependent on the ability to access good healthcare (and nothing to do with the intrinsic value - or not - of a life)?

Your statement leaves a fair few handful of weeks for which you don't have a policy. I'd say you've failed to cover perhaps 5 weeks (23-28 weeks gestation), and even that's probably generous at the top end. What of abortion at 25 weeks, where survival is unlikely and only possible with intensive treatment which is often resuscitatory?

bumbleymummy · 23/04/2014 08:56

Binky, how many of those women had access to contraception? I think it's tragic that so many unwanted pregnancies result from people not have access to contraception. Do you not think it would make sense to complain about that first rather than focussing on the fact that they don't have abortion available?

Good point about actually taking action ikea.

RonaldMcDonald · 23/04/2014 08:59

These debates on abortion always feel like people poking their noses into other people's businesses and then judging them

I'll warrant that anyone who lives in the UK and has had 9 abortions has a great deal more going on perhaps going wrong than simply the abortions
Have you ever considered being a friend?

Dawndonnaagain · 23/04/2014 09:00

I think it's tragic that so many unwanted pregnancies result from people not have access to contraception.
Fine, we all do, however this does not take into account contraception failures, of which there are many.

RonaldMcDonald · 23/04/2014 09:01

Safe and legal abortion does not encompass Northern and Southern Ireland.
If you need/want an abortion there the options are entirely different

twofingerstoGideon · 23/04/2014 09:01

That's quite a claim, ikea. Do you have any evidence for that because, to be frank, that seems to be pure speculation on your part? In fact, I would say your argument provides a strong case for legalising abortion everywhere. I pasted figures from the World Health Organisation earlier. Despite your claim that 'many women would not choose abortion if it was dangerous and illegal', 42 million women in ONE YEAR chose abortion and 20 MILLION - (in a single year, remember) - chose it, even though it was unsafe and illegal. That's how desperate women are to terminate unwanted pregnancies.

bumbleymummy · 23/04/2014 09:03

"A friend who I supported through an abortion was very undecided and said to me that she wished she lived in a country where abortion was illegal as that would be her choice made and society wouldn't expect her to just getan abortion."

That's a very interesting point. There does seem to be societal influence and perhaps even pressure. "Why would you continue with this pregnancy when there is a 'safe and legal' option?/ I have aborted/would abort if I was in your situation" etc.

Dawndonnaagain · 23/04/2014 09:05

There does seem to be societal influence and perhaps even pressure.
Absolute Bunkum. The only pressure comes from the pro life brigade standing outside clinics with placards.

bumbleymummy · 23/04/2014 09:05

How many of those desperate woman had the option of preventing their pregnancies in the first place?

ikeaismylocal · 23/04/2014 09:06

Ikea, cost? What do you mean? we live in a country where international adoption is the only real option, Swedish babies are very rarely adopted, it would cost a huge amount to adopt internationally.

dawn there is no problem, but the fact stated that just as many abortions would happen if abortion were illegal is wrong.

I'm not sure why the ability to survive outside the wombis important to me, I guess I believe everyone deserves a chance and if the mother doesn't want to continue her pregnancy I don't think that should take away the fetus' chance even if it's chance is 1%

I'm not sure of the law if a woman who was 26 weeks pregnant with no health problems in either mother or fetus said she wanted an abortion/induction, I suspect she would be made to carry the baby to term.

Dawndonnaagain · 23/04/2014 09:07

How many of those desperate women had contraception failures?

gordyslovesheep · 23/04/2014 09:07

Ikea I worked for many years supporting women travelling from Ireland to the UK for terminations, I worked with Rape Crisis for 10+ years which involved helping women access sexual health services and abortion services

I have campaigned actively against changes to the abortion act - and continue to do so.

I have been driven at, spat at, verbally and physically abused by 'pro-lifers' in the process

what have you been doing to support women?

Dawndonnaagain · 23/04/2014 09:07

dawn there is no problem, but the fact stated that just as many abortions would happen if abortion were illegal is wrong.
Looking at the WHO figures, that seems a bit of leap.

saintlyjimjams · 23/04/2014 09:08

There's often a lot of pressure from the medical profession to terminate babies with DS. I have friends who have had to very firmly stand their ground & refuse a termination. Not an easy thing to do. One friend was even told by a nurse she was 'selfish' for not terminating her child with DS.

Wtf do medics know about learning disabilities anyway? (Often bugger all ime).

twofingerstoGideon · 23/04/2014 09:10

I think it's tragic that so many unwanted pregnancies result from people not have access to contraception.
So do I. But let's not pretend that the majority of unwanted pregnancies are a result of poor access to contraceptives. If that were the case, abortion would barely exist in the UK where birth control is freely accessible. I think a lot of forced birthers like to suggest that unwanted pregnancies are largely a result of 'carelessness' (stupid, irresponsible women!), rather than acknowledge that a pregnancy may be unwanted for a whole raft of reasons, some of which I mentioned in an earlier post.

Dawndonnaagain · 23/04/2014 09:10

The point is saintly your friend had a choice that others do not.

Dawndonnaagain · 23/04/2014 09:11

That belief is so clearly a result of the fact that only women can get pregnant and only women would ever have to carry an unwanted fetus to term that I find it laughable that anyone claims being anti-choice has anything to do with concern for potential life. Can anyone really believe that abortion would even be an issue if men had to face the possibility of giving birth to and raising a child because of one night of failed contraception?
MiT student.

ikeaismylocal · 23/04/2014 09:13

Do you believe that 1 in 4 pregnancies in Sweden wouldend in abortion if it was illegal or do you think people would use double contraception and deal with the pregnancy and resulting child more often?

I don't think the abortion rate is a problem, I think women should have that choice up to a point, I would consider a very early abortion myself but I do not believe that there would be so many abortions if abortion was illegal yes there would be some but in countries where there is free contraception and a good support system for families I don't think as many people would choose abortion.

bumbleymummy · 23/04/2014 09:18

Very true saintly.

two fingers, "But let's not pretend that the majority of unwanted pregnancies are a result of poor access to contraceptives."

In those countries they are. How many more abortions do you think there would be if we didn't have contraception in the UK.

LadyOlivier · 23/04/2014 09:22

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.