to make a noise in my house

[softcat]

Hello

This situation is driving me a bit mad. I live in a semi detached house with DH, DS1 and DS2. Our neighbours moved in a couple of years ago and since then they have not stopped complaining about footfalls, kids "screaming and crying all the time" (I think they seem pretty cheerful but perhaps this is subjective). Doors slamming (again I think this is normal door shutting). We have tried to minimise noise by fitting the thickest underlay possible and fitting soft closers on all doors that we can. I feel that I spend my life telling the kids to be quiet and get really tense if they raise their voices, run or get upset.
They are threatening us with environmental health and solicitors. There is a bit of finger pointing and bosom hoiking. Some pretty heavy insinuation that I am a shit parent and I am aware that she is pretty nasty about me to anyone who will listen.
So… how much noise is acceptable! How quiet are your kids? Do they walk around in the house and do they ever shout or jump? Do they always keep their hands on the door handle and make sure it doesn't bang?

Did they ask you not to have sex? Brilliant! So they basically wanted complete silence!
I am getting really angry about it, I was pissed last night and dh had to work pretty hard to convince me not to put moustaches on their gate post lions, I agreed not to as long as he got me a mcdonalds brekky which is on its way!

Why on earth are you getting your head around losing your house ?? Just ignore them !! Honestly, you've tried to be reasonable, they won't have it, so ignore them. You know your kids are just being kids, they aren't being overly loud, etc. Tell them you've done all you can and you're sorry if it still disturbs them but you won't be doing anything further and that's it, end of discussion. What are you going to do if you move and your next neighbours complain for whatever reason? Will you move for them too ???!?? In the nicest possible way, don't be daft!

Poor you. There is no way you will ever please your NDN by the sound of their unreasonable demands. Your only choice, other than moving which you should not need to do, is to completely disengage. Write them a polite letter saying that you want no further contact from them other than by letter through Royal Mail. Keep a copy. This will probably deter them, and give you a paper trail of unreasonable complaints/requests.

If they do send you a letter, reply as shortly as possible - probably with a simple "we are sorry you are not happy. We disagree with the points in your letter but will not rebut them one by one. Please do not contact us again unless it is with formal notice of legal action. Any other further communication will be regarded as harassment under the Harrassment Act 1997 and we will seek legal advice and may take legal action without further notice."

If they contact you in any other way eg knock on your door, then tell the police, and show them the letter where you tell your NDN not to contact you and get it recorded as harassment. The police should at that point go and have a word with them.

Then put them out of your mind. There is nothing they can do to you. And if they do, then the law is on your side.

Don't tiptoe about in your everyday life. Enjoy your children, enjoy your house. OTOH Don't deliberately provoke the neighbours by getting drums or encouraging door bangs. Hopefully the situation will defuse if you take all those steps.

Good luck

oops, spelling: Harassment Act 1997

I want to leave because it is horrible living next door to them. Yes we could ignore them but they peer into the house, moan, threaten solicitors etc…
I know it seems a bit crazy to move but the thought of them recording me and monitoring me is horrible. This has been going on for two years which is why we bought it to mediation, to try and resolve it, it just made it worse.

If it gets to the point that we accuse them of harassment or they make a proper complaint to environmental health or contact a solicitor then I would have to come clean about it when selling the house so it would lose value or be hard to sell.
it is a really weird kind of stress that stops you from feeling comfortable in your own home, knowing you are being watched and judged and talked about.

why dont you try telling them to piss off (or similar)first? and threatening police is not the same as calling them. you have nothing to lose. it will take ages to sell anyway

bullies back down when challenged robustly

I haven't read the full thread but honestly EH won't take any action against "normal" household living noise.

Give your EH department a call and they will reassure you. Your neighbours sound like a PITA.

See they can threaten all they want but they won't get anywhere with any complaints.

You really need to change the way you react to them.. they're loons. Get some windows coverings that block looking in but not the light.. that'll stop them looking in.

If they mention recording you... tell them to get a sec life of their own. Heighten your fence in some way to stop all of that and do what's been suggested to stop them knocking.

You have to be assertive with these people or it just rumbles on forever but bullies always back down when they get put in their place.

*sex

You would have to mention this to potential buyers anyway (sorry, I suspect you know that really). You can stop the NDNs' moaning, peering in and threatening solicitors' letters by the simple means I suggested of sending them a letter saying any further communication (other than a legal notice) will be regarded as harassment. You will then be able to put it out of your mind. Honestly, it will work - if not the first time then definitely the second time they contact you after the letter. The law is now good in this area. You should not have to live like this.

We once rented a first floor flat. The guy downstairs, who OWNED his flat as he told us many times, complained about every little thing we did. Not to our face, but to the landlord.
I went to the citizens advice once, and he was in there complaining about us, I could hear him through the door! Saying he could hear us weeing in the night (!!) and doors banging,heavy footsteps etc.
He once banged on the ceiling when we had sex!!

He was just a sad crazy man and I think your neighbour is the same. He made our lives a misery for a year, and stopped us enjoying our baby's first year as we were so paranoid. Wish Id just told him to fuck off!

I would do as a pp said and tell her to address any complaints to the EH and that you don't want to know any more.

When they peer over the fence get the kids to play 'ghosts'. Give them white robes and a pointy white hat with eye holes whilst you sit in the nude.
Buy the kids saxaphone, trumpets, electric guitars and show them how to do Jim hendrix style feedback with the amp.
tell your neighbours if they don't like how you live to stop looking in. It's harassment. And whoever you sell the house to they will also harass. They may even put buyers off with their behaviour.
I would attempt to nip them in the bud before you move. Tell them to ring eh, chances are they'll be told to eff off by them and then you can formally tell them to leave you well and truly alone.

My NDN has 4 kids. They regularly kick off (screaming tantrums) before 6am. We wouldn't dream of complaining. She has 4 little ^human> in her home.

Your neighbour is totally barmy. Tell her, in writing, that any future complaints should be directed to council, but, make it clear that two can play that game. Keep a diary.

You might find you lose out if you try to move at the moment as you will have to declare this dispute (as you have been to mediation there is evidence of it). Sounds like you don't want to move, you just want to be allowed to live normally in your house.

Suggestions:

Privacy film for some of your windows
Tall fence/trellis to stop them looking in.
Zero tolerance on this harassment. Don't engage with them. Keep a log of interactions including passive aggressive comments.
Refer them to the police/eh with any complaints.

Once they are stonewalled they will surely either shut up or move.

O god, I don't know…to be honest the thought of moving has really cheered me up over the last few days. It is literally the only thing keeping me going right now. It is hard to explain how down this has got us, yes we could tell them to fuck off but actually I have no way of knowing if it would make things better or worse.

We told them to stop coming round and moaning and to come to mediation to sort it out fully. What they want is for us to shut doors quietly (if he hears a door literally one time then he will come and moan - like when my friend was cat sitting). To stop the kids from running as they can hear the footfalls.

When she is on late shifts she wants to lay in until 9am. Our bedroom adjoins theirs and they want the kids not to come into our bedroom between 8-8.30am Currently our routine is downstairs for brekky then at 8am we all go up and teeth brush and get dressed, the kids come into my room when they are ready as I am usually finishing off my make up/hair. We then go downstairs and leave for school at 8.30am - our neighbour thinks I shut the front door too loudly at this time.

She also wants peace from 2pm when she is on early shifts and would like for us not to have play dates on these days.

At mediation I felt pushed into saying that I would try to be quieter, shut doors quietly, get the kids dressed downstairs etc as we were told that we should try and be solution focused. Now I feel that I have just given them another reason to moan i.e. "I heard the kids upstairs and you said you would keep them downstairs etc.". I also agreed that he could come round and let me know what shifts she was on.

I wish I had never gone to mediation, I wish I had told them to fuck off when they first moaned about the noise. Don't know if it would have made a difference though. The people who lived in their house before them were lovely and she said we were the quietest people to live there in recent years!!

You've tried mediation, it hasn't worked, I would go back to the fuck off route

It doesn't really matter what has been said before in mediation etc. They are being fucking outrageous. It is harassment and completely unacceptable.

Why not plan to move in say 6 months, but meantime try the suggestions people have made here. Then in 6 months you can say whether you still want to move or you are happier. It could cost you thousands (many thousands!) to move. Loss of house value due to current situ, legal fees, stamp duty, movers, estate agent fees... Would you hand these people twenty or thirty thousand pounds?

Softcat, it sounds horrendous and I really do have sympathy, but you will already have to declare this dispute if you sell so frankly you have nothing to lose by being tougher with them.

You keep saying things like 'she wants', 'they want'. They can want all they like frankly !!! She has no right to insist on times your children can be in your bedroom just because she wants a lie in As I said before they want the life of a detached house, well they should have bloody well bought a detached house then. They didn't so tough ...

I feel for you. They are totally unreasonable. Nobody should have to live like that. I would be tempted to move also, in your shoes. Something like that must be so bloody wearing, day in, day out. They have no right, IMO, to dictate times that you can be upstairs/ downstairs etc, in your own home, or any of the other nonsense.
If it is the case that for example, you will incur huge costs in moving, have to change schools for your kids, or really like the area you are in, are near family etc, then I would consider, as others have recommended here, a formal, solicitor's letter telling them to back off, and that you want no further communication with them.

Honestly, you might find it bearable if they have no contact with you. You might even be able to forget about them. Try it. I do speak from experience. I feel for you atm but honestly you have it in your power to ameliorate the situation if you can muster the courage to do it. If they cannot contact you, then you will gradually not feel stressed about it. Harassment would also include peering in your windows btw - in fact, when you say no communication, you should spell it out that they are not to even enter your front garden either (hence the Royal Mail delivery).

Oh, and send the letter recorded delivery so that you can prove receipt.

Repost in Legal Op, the more you post the more it sounds like harassment.

We have noisy neighbours, but as far as I'm concerned anything between 8am and 8pm is tough luck.

softcat the more you post the more irrational your neighbour sounds.

I think you have given this woman an inch and she has taken a mile... With hindsight it was a mistake to attempt mediation with someone with such unrealistic expectations.

Time to reverse this process now and ask them to stop coming round. Tell them to fuck off if necessary. But if you'd prefer not to say this try something like.

"Tip toeing around isn't working for us, I'm afraid you'll just have to try and ignore us just as we try to ignore your arguing and dog".

"I'm sorry you can hear us but we feel the noise we make is perfectly reasonable. Please don't come round again, you're disturbing us but feel free to ring the police or contact the council".

"Please stop coming round your behaviour amounts to harassment and we will contact a solicitor if it continues".

You keep mentioning the fear that she will contact a solicitor. What do you imagine will happen if she does?

How on earth can you stop kids being kids!!????

Pathetic, stupid people!!!

If your neighbours are so sensitive noise why don't they 1) wear earplugs when sleeping; and 2) live in a detached house? They sound like unreasonable arses.

Please hold your nerve, they will either give in or move. This happened to us (not noise related admittedly) and the relief when we saw the sale board was immeasurable! I well remember the feeling of being uncomfortable in my own home and the stress that that can cause, but even though I am the most anxious, passive person going, I refused to be hounded out of my home.

Please do as others have said and stop thinking about moving. The associated costs of moving alone should deter you. It may help to imagine you handing over that amount of money to your NDN. Would you? No of course not!

Start practising responding to them so the next time they complain in person you'll be ready. Be ultra polite but assertive (fake it if necessary).