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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

*SENSITIVE* AIBU to think some people come across as ignorant nobs about suicide? *TRIGGERS*

290 replies

SelectAUserName · 19/02/2014 07:58

FB (sorry!) friend posted a status update complaining about being late home last night because someone threw themselves under their train. She and one of her FB friends (who I don't know) swapped several comments which included the phrases "selfish", "inconsiderate", "I would quite like to get home and enjoy my life thank you very much" etc.

I posted fairly mildly saying that it must have been frustrating but at least it was a minor inconvenience for her in the scheme of things and it was safe to say the other person, not to mention the driver, had had a far worse day. FB friend then claimed it was "light-hearted" and said they could post what they liked on their own news feed. I said that for some people, there is nothing "light-hearted" about suicide and they couldn't guarantee some of those people wouldn't be using social media; if they chose to post about a sensitive subject they could expect to get pulled up on it.

It wasn't long before I was accused (by FB friend's friend IYSWIM) of being "PC" (oh, how original) and of "attacking" my friend. I reiterated that this was an emotive subject and that maybe they should step back, re-read with an open mind and see that they weren't coming across as very empathic. And then I left it as it was starting to get to me.

AIBU to think that a woman in her 30s should have a bit more compassion about someone in the absolute depths of despair? Or am I being a sanctimonious old trout and "dictating" (that word was used too) what people can and can't say on their FB timeline?

I think if she'd said "sorry, I know I came across as a bit me me me - I was just letting off steam" it wouldn't have bothered me, but to use the word "light-hearted" as self-justification (there was nothing inherently humorous, OTT-for-effect or anything else to suggest light-heartedness about her OP - just a straight rant at have her evening plans disrupted) seemed totally inappropriate.

OP posts:
Gruntfuttock · 19/02/2014 13:04

I meant to add that it is natural to greatly fear being in extreme pain, physical or mental, particularly if you have experienced it before. All sentient beings have that fear.

CouthyMow · 19/02/2014 13:19

Last post, then the thread is free to those who wish to continue to discuss this.

I have pointed out in a previous post that everyone's experience of suicide is different. My feelings about it are just as valid as anyone else's, despite being different. I posted that above.

I have NOT personally insulted anyone on this thread, that isn't my MO on Mumsnet or in life.

My feel is might be insulting to some, but they are still valid feelings. I don't go into the MH section on here, I daren't, as my feel is are so different to those of most people who have lived through the suicide of a loved one.

It closes off an avenue of support for me, but I do that.

HOWEVER. This is an AIBU thread. In a totally different section of MN. I felt like for once, I was able to express how I feel about suicide.

And yes, I DO find it slightly insulting to have my feelings on this denied and decried. NOT ONCE on this thread have I said anything personally insulting about any other poster, all I have done is express MY feelings about suicide, having lived through it.

Why are MY feelings less valid than anyone else's just because they are different? How does the fact that I have a different view on this make me insulting?

All this has served to do is to remind me that my feelings are obviously odd on this, and that I must remember not to express those feelings, because people think my feelings are wrong somehow, and that I'm not meant to feel like that because they don't.

It's very difficult to have to keep things like this inside all the time, feeling like you are the 'odd one out' or that there's something wring with you for feeling differently about this to the majority of people.

I'll leave you to the thread now, and I'm sorry if my feel is have caused any offence.

scottishmummy · 19/02/2014 13:22

I've read whole thread,your posts are your own narrative.they are genuine to you
Equally,others have their experience and knowledge.and that's genuine to them
I think suicide is a deep and personal and resonates differently for us all

falulahthecat · 19/02/2014 13:27

frogslegs35

This happened in the UK too, it seems Poland is still a bit behind.

A couple hundred years ago if a man committed suicide all his belongings belonged to the crown - the wife and any family or kids were left with nothing.
The only way you could get round it is by saying they were a 'lunatic' at the time, which a lot of people didn't want to do because of the stigma.

I believe the North Side of many churches (where it's in shade Sad) was also often reserved for unbaptised babies and people who'd committed suicide.
Some were also buried at cross roads, something about tormented souls not finding their way home etc.

I also came across the most horrific news report from the 1860's where an 11 year old girl was being charged in court for repeatedly trying to drown herself in the Thames. They fined her father a couple of shillings for being neglectful and sent her on her way. :(

NinjaCow · 19/02/2014 13:28

One of my sisters committed suicide aged 15. I was 10 and discovered her. She hadn't planned it to be me- I was meant to be going round a friwnd's house, so our neighbour (who was a nurse) should have found her, hours afterwards, instead of us- instead I walked home by myself and saw her.

She wasn't selfish at all, she was broken, terrified and honestly thought people would be better off without her. She stayed as long as she could and therefore I don't consider her selfish at all. What she did has affected me for the rest of my life and I have gone to counselling as a result and it has seriously affected my MH, but that wasn't her fault whatsoever. I see suicide as a kind of natural end to severe depression iyswim, if not treated or not treated correctly- just like any other disease.

I have had suicidal feelings, it started off not wanting to exist, then a vague hopeful feeling that I would quite like to not wake up, then to planning all the ways to do it. I didn't (obviously) but I'd stocked up on pills by the time I actually called for help, so I don't exactly have experience as there was still a part of me that was desperate to live, ultimately. Of at least, not die painfully. Confused

falulahthecat · 19/02/2014 13:29

*would just like to add appearing in court for attempted suicide was by no means uncommon. I can't think of anything worse than being hauled up in front of strangers to be judged for feeling like you didn't want to live Sad

scottishmummy · 19/02/2014 13:29

I want to acknowledge the losses people are discussing,how v harrowing it is

everlong · 19/02/2014 13:30

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NinjaCow · 19/02/2014 13:32

And although I am desperate to see her again, to get her help, to do something or anything to change it, I know every single day leading up to her suicide was a living hell. I don't want to put her through that and make her keep going.

Gruntfuttock · 19/02/2014 13:32

everlong I didn't choose to be suicidal.

Gruntfuttock · 19/02/2014 13:34

NinjaCoW I am so sorry.

Your empathy, compassion, love and understanding are deeply moving.

Original poster
SelectAUserName · 19/02/2014 13:35

CM, your feelings are your feelings. There is no 'wrong' about how you feel. They are a product of your personal experience and as valid as anyone else's. TBH I don't see where anyone has 'denied' them or that fact.

My issue, as I tried (probably clumsily) to express above, is not the fact that you feel how you feel, but in the way you expressed those feelings. It did read, particularly in your earlier posts, as though your feelings should be the ONLY way to feel. Pronouncements such as "If you don't do that [seek help], then you're being selfish" read as though you are trying to tell people how it is, not how it is for you.

I have a lot of respect for your openness and honesty on this thread. Your experience is not my experience, and your feelings are not my feelings, but that doesn't mean I can't recognise something of what you have gone through. I hope you find whatever support you feel you would benefit from, for you and your daughter.

OP posts:
falulahthecat · 19/02/2014 13:36

CouthyMow
No one is saying you shouldn't feel like this, I think it's just that if you read the tone of your posts you make what seem like sweeping generalisations about all people who commit suicide based on your one, truly awful experience.
I don't think anyone is saying your feelings are less valid, I think they are trying to point out that you are making strongly worded generalisations that imply their feelings and opinions are less valid than yours, or imply certain things about close loved ones of theirs who have also committed suicide, which some may find insulting. I'm sure this was not intentional, but 'talking' on a forum is very different talking face to face and without being very careful you can easily be misunderstood.
Don't be sorry, you have been through more than a lot of people will go through in a life time, of course you'll have strong feelings about it. Thanks

everlong · 19/02/2014 13:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

expatinscotland · 19/02/2014 13:40

Some people on this thread dare incredibly self-absorbed.

Gruntfuttock · 19/02/2014 13:41

everlong I wrote that because it wasn't clear to whom you were referring when you said "I suppose people have the right to feel how they like, it doesn't mean what they are feeling is right but it's their choice to feel like they do." and so as far as I knew you were referring to people who feel suicidal or people who feel that those who commit suicide are selfish or neither or both. So I said what I said. Just a simple statement really. Smile

Original poster
SelectAUserName · 19/02/2014 13:41

everlong are you referring to people's feelings about how suicide has affected them, or about feeling suicidal in the first place? Your post is a little ambiguous and could suggest you think that feeling suicidal is a choice.

OP posts:
takingsmallsteps · 19/02/2014 13:48

When my PND was at its peak and social services got involved, there was the possibility of my son being taken into care. My husband refused to leave my side.

I wasn't the most rational person at the time but for me, committing suicide would have meant my son could stay with his dad and not be thrown to strangers. I felt I was a shit mum anyway and I didn't want my husband and son separated because of me. I wasn't worth it. Removing myself from the picture permanently seemed the only solution.

I don't know if I was selfish but it was the only way I felt I could protect my son. Thankfully my husband came home from work earlier than usual and I got help.

I imagine suicide is a 'solution' to a problem for most people. And in that haze you can't see any other solutions.

everlong · 19/02/2014 13:50

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

runnermum1974 · 19/02/2014 13:52

It is ironic this post has come up because I am considering suicide at the moment. Maybe I am selfish, I don't know, but I can't see a way out of my horrible situation.

I am really in despair, I have no hope left and I have lost everything I valued through being depressed. I feel like a sad case and just rubbish and ashamed.

People on here who are criticising suicide are clueless because they are lucky enough to not have experienced extreme pain, loss and disability. If they were in my position, they would be thinking about suicide too - we all have the potential.

scottishmummy · 19/02/2014 13:55

Runnermum,can you call someone?you can go to a&e ask to see psychiatric team
Who can you talk to?
there is support if you let people know

Original poster
SelectAUserName · 19/02/2014 13:56

everlong Thank you for clarifying.

runnermum, you have nothing to be ashamed of. NOTHING. You have the rotten bad luck to have been inflicted with one of the most insidious serious illnesses there is.

Please seek help. If you are in the UK, ring this number now: 08457 90 90 90. They will listen, and not judge. There is nothing to judge. You are not a bad person. You are not rubbish. You are desperately ill.

I hope you get through this.

OP posts:
falulahthecat · 19/02/2014 13:57

runnermum1974
Do not feel ashamed. You should never feel like it's not ok to feel depressed, it's not your fault.
Are you receiving any help? Is there anything any of us can help you with? Anything in particular that's happening right now to make you feel like suicide is your only way out?
It's never the only way out, I'm sure if you told people around you that you felt this way they would all do their best to help you feel loved Thanks

expatinscotland · 19/02/2014 13:58

I would block this 'friend', too, OP.

falulahthecat · 19/02/2014 13:58

And yes do call. When I did I put the phone down on them as they picked up 5 times in a row because I was so nervous Blush but there is always someone who can help you piece things back together.