to think that women like this give the rest of us a bad name in the workplace

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I'm currently expecting my first child in the early summer. One of my team at work is expecting hers about a week before mine. And I'm really about to really lose my temper with her. She's resident in a different country where she gets two months of fully paid antenatal leave before starting her maternity leave so she's going off in about a month.

However, what's making me really cross is that she's obviously mentally checked out already. We work in a really high-pressure environment (city job) and she's one of the more senior members in my team of 17. She just sent me back her appraisal form (late) in preparation for her review later on this week, along with an email that says she doesn't see why she's been asked to do this review as she's leaving in a month. She's also started arriving late to meetings, delaying delivery of tasks, taking extra long lunch hours etc.

The review covers the whole of the previous year and although yes, she is starting her maternity leave soon, we're still paying her salary and will be obliged to do so for her antenatal lead and for a full year after her baby is born. So it really makes me cross that with all of this fully paid time off ahead of her, she's already trying to get out of doing her normal day-to-day job whilst she's still in the office. Why is it a one-way street with her doing all the taking?

This woman and her behaviour are why other women in our largely male industry office (myself included) are completely passed over for promotion once they're pregnant / have children because our male colleagues assume we'll all take this kind of approach. When I mentioned to our global head that this kind of attitude really makes me cross, he actually shrugged and said "That's just what happens. Women get pregnant and lose all interest in their job". She's ruining it for the rest of us. AIBU to want to mark her down in her review for this awful attitude? (Obviously I won't…but dear God I'm tempted!)

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Have you read the posts. No-one is making excuses for her

Actually I don't think the op is being unreasonable.

Yes, this woman is not responsible for institutionalised sexism. But it's ridiculous to say that in a male dominated industry her behaviour won't make a lot of the senior men think less of women of child bearing age. Of course their attitude is the real problem but women like this make them feel justified in this stories because they can point to a specific example to justify their prejudice.

If she was a nurse, or a primary school teacher, or anything other female dominated profession, it wouldn't make a difference because then she'd be just one person being less than professional and no one would specifically link this to her sex. But in this specific case it is absolutely true to say that her unprofessional aptitude is contributing to the myth that women with families check out.

And it would fuck me off that because she was behaving like this, my male colleagues might presume I was going to too. Never mind the fact that she's not doing her job.

I think you should bring this up in her review. But talk to hr to ensure that you do so in a way that means she can't accuse you of discrimination

Yellow, your post reads as if you are saying that all women must be better than every man, lest they are discriminated against... Or have I misunderstood you?

If your male colleagues are judging every woman on the behaviour of one or two, are those one or two women really the problem?

As someone up thread said, substitute black or disabled people for women, and the discrimination would perhaps be much more clear-cut.

If I was at work and a black person junior to me complained about another junior black person doing X because it would give them all a bad name... oh hang on, I can't even imagine because it would never happen.

OP you really don't get it do you.

It's not about denying that there is institutionalised sexism, it's questioning your response to it.

If you had asked: AIBU to be annoyed that my male managers are judging all pregnant women on the basis of my ill-performing colleague? We would say YANBU. Because you are recognising the sexism and not colluding in it.

But that's not what you asked. You have virtually the same attitude as your sexist managers. So YABU. And again, I say that as someone who completely understands working in a male-dominated environment.

Tethersend I'm not saying that all women must be better than every man. But in male dominated industries you are more conspicuous so I think people notice more of you are a shirker or a bit crap than of you were a man. I also specifically said 'of course their (the men) attitude is the real problem...' so I'm not disagreeing with youabout the real cause of the problem but while we are where we are I can understand the op being pissed off. Because despite working as hard as she always does she is being tarred by the same brush by her colleague.

Oh, absolutely Yellow- she should be pissed off. She should be pissed off with the other woman for being a crap employee AND she should be pissed off at a system which judges her for the other woman's actions.

However, what she is doing instead is accepting the status quo and directing her ire at the woman, which is VERY convenient for the men who run things, as it means they get to carry on unchallenged.

The reason that women are passed over for promotion or not recruited to your workplace is that your managers are sexist arseholes. It has nothing to do with one individual woman's supposed failings. If they stopped recruiting people because a member of the same gender behaved badly, why are there any men at all left working in the city?

You seem to fail at causal analysis. I suppose it goes some way towards explaining why capitalism is so fucked.

Why does one woman give all women a bad name?

*Does bad behaviour from one man in the workplace mean that all men in the workplace are seen the same way? No. Because a man is a man, not all men and nobody would pass over all men for promotion because of the actions of one man, would they? When has that ever ever happened?

So challenge that, because that is the problem. Not one woman behaving in a particular way*

This OP. The woman is out of order pull her up on her behaviour and don't buy into the male inspired rhetoric that one woman's actions reflect the entire gender.

OP, I get where you're coming from. It may be an uncomfortable truth, but (speaking as someone who has managed many people in a professional environment) the number of women who basically shift down a gear (if not two or three) the moment they announce a pregnancy is astonishing. I've managed others (male and female) who are the sort of lazy employees who do something similar once they resign and are working out their notice. Difference is they're gone in a month, rather than 4 or 5.

Personally I can't abide laziness, or a lack of conscientiousness in colleagues, male or female.

Tethersend I totally agree with you

I can't believe the hard time you're getting on this thread.

I would be extremely pissed off in your shoes. If the woman in question is finding work too difficult, she needs to officially opt out.

I would tell her that she does need to undergo the previous year's review - why wouldn't she; it's a backward-looking review, not a forward-looking objective-setting?! - and use the opportunity to tell her to cop into herself.

Plenty of women work in the lead-up to their maternity lead, and pull their weight. I have every sympathy with her if she is suffering. If that is the case, she needs to take steps to mitigate it.

There are no other circumstances where an employee would be able to just drag their heels because they can't be bothered.

Why are people defending this?

P.S. I think you made a BIG mistake saying that this woman is ruining it for all women, as now people are blinded by that statement, and totally overlooking the issue that you have to deal with on a daily basis.

Other than some people suggesting the woman may be struggling with her pregnancy, who has defended laziness?? No-one has done this.

i think you made a BIG mistake saying that this woman is ruining it for all women, as now people are blinded by that statement, and totally overlooking the issue that you have to deal with on a daily basis

You answered your own question there about why the OP is getting a hard time.

On the radio today in Ireland there has been a lot of talk about how a rugby commentator made a whole pile of sweeping generalisations about gay men and his sport. One of his most inspired comments was about how they weren't into rugby just like he wasn't into ballet or words to that effect. The OPs comment really reminds me of the shit he was spouting.

As a working woman I am offended by her buying into the ridiculous generalisations about women checking out. I know plenty of women who didn't. Target the issue which is a person not doing their job and leave out the sweeping generalisations.

I see several posts defending the woman's actual behaviour.

By all means criticise the institutionalised sexism in the OP's OP, but I'm completely bemused but the several posts defending the woman's actual entitled behaviour and attitude.

I don't think you are being unreasonable in some ways, it sounds like on occasion she is completely taking the mick. If she is genuinely off sick then it needs to be logged and treated fairly. Though whether It really gives the rest of us a bad name in the workplace I am not certain. OP I know exactly how you feel and what you mean by trying to lead by good example. Ensure your review of her performance is fairly based on the period in question and give her no reason to complain it is unfair.

I can't help but wonder if this pregnant lady in your team has almost preempted the attitudes around her and thought "fuck it". Maybe she wonders what difference it will really make whether she works her butt off till she drops or starts to gradually check out? People under perform for a variety of reasons. Not feeling valued is often the main cause. Perhaps she no longer values her own contribution, knowing she isn't going to be around for a while or has felt (indirectly or directly) undervalued by those around her.

Do you think you might be projecting a bit of your own fears of the future onto her? Who knows how you will feel at 8 months pregnant. Hopefully, full of beans and firing on cylinders. But, you just don't know do you?

I'm not condoning your team member's behaviour. But beware of who and what you judge OP when it comes to pregnancy, giving birth, motherhood, and combining small children with work. The one thing motherhood has taught me is that when you judge, you are often judging yourself 6 months to a year down the line.

KingRollo I think we're in the same country. I couldn't agree with you more.

YANBU but for the sake of another month, let it be. When she's back, find out what's going on. I also work in a high-stress job and during pregnancy was unable to keep pace. There IS such a thing as pregnancy brain...perhaps it's sleep exhaustion. If she still can't cope when she's back, change the scope of her role so that she can do a great job. She might be very thankful for the opportunity to do that. (obviously this is a HR thing but as her manager it's for you to initiate).

And I agree it's giving pregnant women a bad name, but she probably isn't doing it on purpose. I sure as heck wasn't, but that doesn't matter. I got a horrible job performance review, and now (1 year after giving birth) am FINALLY back up to full speed. The impact of having a pregnancy/child on my work performance was as much a surprise to me as it was to my manager.

I think my boss would have postponed my review, in discussion with me, if it happened a month before my maternity leave, as one of the goals of a review is to set objectives for the year ahead. He may have done a "split" review (historic, not forward looking) instead. I know I had a review shortly after returning from maternity leave once as I was on leave for the normal review timetable.

She may see it as sensible not as "shirking"!

Talk to her about timekeeping by all means. How often do you see her face to face if she is in a different country?

If that were the case, Doctrine, then she's handled it badly.

Instead of filling out the review and handing it back saying she doesn't know why she has to do it, she could have been much more professional and proactive.

On receiving it, she could have asked for a chat with the OP/HR, maybe suggesting it be postponed until her return, but then been open to going ahead with the review, even if the objective-setting was done on her return.

The ways she's handling it makes her seem like a truculent teenager who isn't bothering her arse. Which is deeply annoying for the person managing her, and her wider colleagues.

I wouldn't dream of behaving like this, pregnant or not. I didn't behave like this. I can't imagine any self-respecting person on this thread would either, so why make excuses for this woman?

If she's having a hard time, if she's struggling or feeling unwell, then what is wrong with handling that in an amenable manner, like a professional adult?

She isn't giving women a bad name. She is giving pregnant employees a bad name, though.