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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to be puzzled when mums suggest they know what it's like to be a SAHM because they were once on mat leave?

999 replies

BarkWorseThanBite · 14/02/2014 18:45

Two really nice mums - I like them both and we usually sit together at toddler group. However, more than a few times both have seemed to imply they know what's it like to be a SAHM because they took mat leave a couplel of years ago (till their babies were 9 months old).

Isn't that a bit like saying you know what's it like to be a single mum (I'm not) because your husband was away playing golf for a week?

Nothing against working mums at all - but the implication that they know what my life is like is a bit irritating.

AIBU?

OP posts:
AnnieLobeseder · 15/02/2014 14:15

capsium, in the case of SN or elderly parents etc you are working as a carer. My scenario was obviously only meant to apply to people who SAH without caring or financial constraints (and that so many women are trapped at home against their will without sufficient or reasonable support for ill/disabled family or exorbitant childcare is a huge bugbear of mine).

tiredbutstillsmiling · 15/02/2014 14:16

Agreed janey.

I spend nearly £400 a month for DD's private nursery - I could use a childminder but every teacher at my school sends their children to the local private nursery as it's so good. Currently they have 7 DC's from our staff. We're all highly educated professionals who love our children. We wouldn't send them anywhere where the care would be less than perfect!

Bonsoir · 15/02/2014 14:18

AnnieLobeseder - how can you claim that being a SAHM is an unnecessary luxury but that being a carer to an elderly relative or DC with SN is work?

Breadrollsbuns · 15/02/2014 14:20

Barkworsethanbite: "I suppose I think being a SAHM is about making a proactive decision to raise your children yourself."

Can you explain who you think is raising my children (I work part time), because in my opinion I am?!

This notion of working mothers "outsourcing" the upbringing of their children angers me. It is provocative, and generally unhelpful in the SAHM / WOHM debate.

RufusTheReindeer · 15/02/2014 14:22

laura My husband had a work wife and I referred to her as such

Then he left his job and so they got a "divorce", it was quite cosy...she took him shopping to update his image!

I think you can use part time for anything really, my children for example are part time angels (trying to lighten the mood and probably failing)

janey68 · 15/02/2014 14:23

Fwiw I actually Chose a cm when I first returned to work, as this was our preferred option (bearing in mind my children were 3 months and 4 months when I returned after my maternity leaves) They then started at a fabulous day nursery from about 15 months and when they started school, returned to the cm for wraparound care. The nursery was more expensive than the cm- if cost alone were the issue we could have done it far more cheaply other ways.

My teenage children still have among their friends, children from that nursery, some of whom went from a few months old and some who went from age 3 or 4 years. Oh and of course some of their friends had parents who stayed at home for years.

Happy to report no discernible differences in well being which are attributable to whether the parents worked full time, part time or not at all!

AnnieLobeseder · 15/02/2014 14:24

I said being a SAHP is a luxury, bonsoir, because there is a sufficiency of perfectly good, if rather over-priced, childcare available. Frequent threads on MN, however, highlight the absolutely appalling state of provision for the disabled and elderly in the UK. If you don't provide the additional care required by your family, no-one else will.

Bonsoir · 15/02/2014 14:25

I don't understand the issue with "outsourcing". It's not a value judgement. There are things I outsource and things I choose not to. All childcare is, by definition, a form of outsourcing.

AnnieLobeseder · 15/02/2014 14:25

And I didn't say that being a SAHP isn't work, just that is has little benefit to anyone outside yout immediate family.

capsium · 15/02/2014 14:25

Annie I don't get paid though and never wished to claim any payment though.

It has been my choice, I don't view my type of caring as work as such just an extension of my role as a mother. I know this is a luxury as some people have to claim benefits to live. I do not begrudge them claiming benefits but do not envy them at all. The whole process is so adversarial I am glad I've avoided it. I would rather move to be nearer family support than seek help from the State, because of the way our current system is.

Bonsoir · 15/02/2014 14:28

That is a value judgement, AnnieLobeseder. Many people judge the childcare provision in the UK to be patchy, overpriced and very poor quality.

AnnieLobeseder · 15/02/2014 14:30

Work isn't about getting paid, capsium, though sadly society judges jobs by their financial worth. I prefer to judge jobs in terms of their benefit to society. As much, I value carers, dustmen, healthcare professionals, teachers, builders etc etc far more than I do investment banker and corporate CEOs.

capsium · 15/02/2014 14:32

Annie well, then by your definition SAHPs work. Smile

janey68 · 15/02/2014 14:33

Keep up bonsoir! The comment about outsourcing was about people who refer, incorrectly and provocatively, about outsourcing raising children. They don't seem to understand the difference between outsourcing certain aspects of childcare, and parenting, which is a far bigger, life long role, and is about installing values and aspirations as well as many other things.

As a WOHP I have no problem with saying that we outsourced some aspects of childcare. I paid for my children to be looked after some of the time, fed, played with, nappy changed etc. DH and I have never outsourced parenting. (Though occasionally we think it would be a nice idea Grin )

Bonsoir · 15/02/2014 14:34

Where, AnnieLobeseder, do you think society gets the money to pay for public services like healthcare, dustbin men etc?

AnnieLobeseder · 15/02/2014 14:35

If a family find childcare to be lacking, bonsoir, and choose not to avail themselves of it, then that is their choice. The same applies to choosing to opt out of the education system and home school their children. If you have the resources to do so, why not? That is everyone's perogative. It's odd to assume that you deserve any kind of special recognition for doing so, though.

brokenhearted55a · 15/02/2014 14:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AnnieLobeseder · 15/02/2014 14:37

See my post of 14.25, capsium. At no point have I said that SAHPing isn't work.

Bonsoir · 15/02/2014 14:38

No-one is asking for special recognition but it is a gross distortion of the facts to claim that quality childcare is readily available all across the UK, let alone at an affordable price.

kungfupannda · 15/02/2014 14:39

It's a shame that the people who are probably hurt by some of the comments on threads like this, are the people who are right in the thick of trying to make the sometimes difficult decisions about work/childcare/finances etc.

With DS1 at school and DS2 old enough to make his feelings about nursery abundantly clear, I find myself able to not give a shit about all the hand-wringing and veiled/open judgement of others. They're happy, I'm happy. If someone else wants to get all Sad about our choices, then that's a waste of that person's time and energy, not mine.

AnnieLobeseder · 15/02/2014 14:40

bonsoir, I can't help but think you're being deliberately obtuse. I did say in my entended post of 13.45 that I recognise that every job has value in purely economic terms. Hmm

janey68 · 15/02/2014 14:44

I don't think anyone is arguing with a parent saying 'I am a SAHP because I can't find or afford good quality childcare.'

But this thread (and others similar to it) don't start like that . They are started by people who tell us they love being a SAHM, they prefer it to being a WOHM... Yet strangely don't feel able to rest until they've banged on about how it would therefore be better for everyone else's children too, and imply that those of us who have used childcare very happily and successfully are somehow kidding ourselves. Very odd...

AnnieLobeseder · 15/02/2014 14:46

*extended, not entended. Sorry.

And I think it's a similar distortion of facts to claim that childcare provision in the UK is universally poor. Of course it's not fantastic absolutely everywhere, but for the most part, working parents seem to be able to find an option that they are happy with from the provisions available (except the ridiculous price).

Bonsoir · 15/02/2014 14:50

I think that this thread has amply provided evidence of the OP's point that WOHMs don't understand why and how the lifestyle of a SAHM is wildly different from their own!

capsium · 15/02/2014 14:53

The thing is, being a SAHP is an unnecessary luxury borne of privelege in the developed world and it's disingenuous to suggest otherwise. ...

It's the same with being a long-term SAHP - fine if you have the resources, but don't pretend it's anything other than a luxury that you personally choose to indulge in.

I think it was these kind of statements that you made, Annie , that were more contentious.

Oh yes I had the choice, at one point - to claim benefits or say I had decided to be a SAHP. Or I could have chosen to have my child truly struggle in the care which was available and lose a succession of jobs by having to attend appointments or pick up early from school. A luxury of sorts I guess, as not all can afford the choice to simply not work outside the home.

Not luxury in the classic sense though.