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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Family member committing benefit fraud.

192 replies

Unsure2014 · 10/01/2014 15:35

I have named changed for this post - for obvious reasons. I'm not a troll, been a member for roughly 18 months.

A family member of mine is claiming as a single parent, living in private rented accommodation paid for by Housing Benefit, etc.

Her boyfriend of just over a year has just got a mortgage on a different property close by. She has moved in with both her children but is still claiming benefits as though she is still living alone at her old address. She goes back to the old house regularly (I'm not sure if it's daily) to open curtains, etc.

I don't have a problem with benefit claimants, so this is not a benefit bashing thread, I just think she is being massively out of order.

Her boyfriend earns quite a good wage and I think she is aware that if she told them her new situation all her benefits, except child benefit, would cease.

AIBU to be thinking of reporting her?

First AIBU.

OP posts:
Original poster
Unsure2014 · 10/01/2014 16:32

Sparkly, it does affect me. I feel this is morally wrong. If I report her then my family will hate me and I will get a bucket load of grief. If I don't report her then I'm compromising my own values and morals, basically accepting that I think benefit fraud is okay!

OP posts:
StupidMistakes · 10/01/2014 16:32

I reported my sister, for jointly owning a property with her partner of four years, living with him in a housing association property, not having declared the property they owned, whilst she was still claiming to be living with my mum.

I also informed them that she claimed not to be able to walk to the local shops and back without being bed ridden for days after, however she is more than capable to go and muck out and ride two horses every day, but cant work behind a desk Confused

I believe that if you owned a property then you weren't entitled to a housing association place nor was you entitled to housing benefit, especially as the property is a ground floor property and suitable for them to live in and currently empty.

UncleT · 10/01/2014 16:32

YANBU.

In fact, it would be great if she would stop stealing from all of us who are working our ass off and want our hard-earned to go to those who really have no alternative.

She might want to see how it goes, but when on benefits that's not the deal. You don't get to pick and choose - you should only be claiming if you absolutely, positively NEED to.

WorraLiberty · 10/01/2014 16:34

If you decide to report her, just do it sooner rather than later so she doesn't have as much to pay back.

What would that matter to you?

Sparklysilversequins · 10/01/2014 16:36

Did you warn your sister you'd be doing this stupidmistakes?

Original poster
Unsure2014 · 10/01/2014 16:36

Thank you UncleT.

This is why I feel it's wrong. Because she has a home with her boyfriend who has taken her family on as his own. So she doesn't need to keep claiming.

I'm a bit Hmm at all the people who think it's okay to trial a cohabiting relationship on the country's dime.

OP posts:
IneedAsockamnesty · 10/01/2014 16:36

SoonToBeSix - are you being serious?

Why on earth wouldn't she be serious?

The law allows a HB claimant to be elsewhere for up to 3 months and providing certain steps are taken and you have an intention to return then you are doing nothing wrong and are still resident at the claimed for address.

There may be other benefits claimed that create an issue but none of those prevent you having a sexual relationship they just prevent you residing as a couple with out claiming as one so with two above board normal (none work related and a few other things) address then your not residing as a couple short term.there are many circumstances where this would not be legal but going on the op's brief info it's unlikely the relative meets those conditions.

SPsMrLoverManSHABBA · 10/01/2014 16:37

At least warn her so she has the chance to sort it herself first. Tell her she is doing wrong and that of people find out she will be in the shit.

Original poster
Unsure2014 · 10/01/2014 16:38

Worra - my mistake. I understand what you meant now you've clarified. If I do decide to report her, I won't be dragging it out. I've spent enough time worrying about this.

OP posts:
WorraLiberty · 10/01/2014 16:39

Well good luck OP

As long as it's soon and as long as you're honest about it

HappyMummyOfOne · 10/01/2014 16:40

Unsure, of course it affects you. You have a moral duty to report it and obviously know that.

Its theft if claiming to be single yet actually living with a partner. For all those that say she shouldnt be reported, presumably if your house was robbed you'd be quite happy for witnesses not to report as it doesnt affect them Hmm

AnnabelleLee · 10/01/2014 16:42

Only on mumsnet are fraudsters poor vulnerable persecuted little darlings while those who consider turning in the fraudsters are spiteful nasty mean folk who are delighted to get them into trouble.

Bizarro world.

MeepMeepVrooooom · 10/01/2014 16:47

Unsure

You said, Sparkly, if I did report her I would tell her. I wouldn't want her accusing other family members and them getting the blame.

If you will tell her when you have already reported her why not just tell her you are going to? That way you are giving her the chance to do the right thing without getting her into trouble with the law.

I don't agree with it but I certainly don't agree with you doing this to a family member without actually giving them the option to see that they are wrong and rectify the situation.

Also given this statement, If I were to say something directly to her I would become her worst enemy, which I really don't want. She is the queen of drama and would most likely go round telling all our family what a bitch I am. Which would result in me getting a ton of hassle from several other family members. I actually don't think you will tell her you are going to or that you have. I think you will report and then sit back and watch the fallout.

WhenWhyWhere · 10/01/2014 16:51

I would anonymously report her andi wouldn't ever tell her OR anyone else that I had done so. I wouldn't give it anymore thought.

It's stealing and the money that she 'steals' should be available for other people who actually need the money.

There is not enough money to go around. It needs to go to people who really need need it.

IneedAsockamnesty · 10/01/2014 16:56

Actually reporting benefit fraud is often next to useless unless you just want to cause maximum destruction obviously with some of the frauds committed that's not a bad thing (the destruction) a reported allegation may take longer to investigate than a more usual computer generated one.

About 96% of reports made by members of the public are not actually fraud and no claw back or charges are made.

Lone parent changing to a cohabitation relationship is one of the easiest frauds to detect from afar,if she steps over (or already has) into the committing fraud actions they will know very quickly.

However, if you genuinely know her intentions as well as knowing she has not stayed within the law and know it's been longer than the notification time allowed then you do have a duty to report.

ColdTeaAgain · 10/01/2014 16:58

soontobesix - mind your own business , she needs to see if the relationship is stable for her dc before giving up her home.

Oh well how convenient for her that she has a nice little house waiting for her and paid for by public money in case it all goes tits up!!

I think in this situation I would tell her that I've heard about someone who recently ended up in court for doing similar and that I thought she should sign off in case she gets into trouble. If she ignores the advice then I'd report her. Sorry if that seems harsh but what she's doing is a total piss take.

DontmindifIdo · 10/01/2014 16:59

I would talk to her, say that what she is doing is wrong, and if she thinks popping over once a day to open the curtains will be enough to stop her nieghbours realising what she's doing, then she's underestimating people's nosiness. That she can't say noone will report her, and is she aware of the sort of trouble she'd be in if they did? That she's not in the house would be clear.

Suggest she talks to her DP about money and him supporting her, if he's not prepared to do that, then they should go back to living separately. There's nothing wrong with dating a wealthy man, but sharing his home is only possible if he's perpared to fund her lifestyle.

It might be worth a small white lie that you bumped into one of her neighbours who mentioned that she'd moved out of the road, you told them she hadn't but are worried that if someone else reported her and the neighbours were asked by investigators, they'd say she doesn't live there anymore, and might even report her themselves if htey realise she's commiting benefit fraud (actually use the phrase benefit fraud, don't say things like "keeping claiming", it will help her realise that actually what she's doing is illegal, even if she doesn't think it's wrong).

If after that she doesn't bother stopping, then you might want to move on to telling her you are going to report in 1 month's time, and if that doesn't stop her, then you'll have to make the decision if you do it or not. I'm not sure I could report a family member, but I'd be prepared to use every threat, lie and bribery I could to try to stop them.

TheVeryBusySpider · 10/01/2014 17:02

I agree with others who have suggested talking to her before you do anything. I appreciate this probably won't be easy though.

Ultimately, she is taking a huge risk by doing this and could be landed with a massive overpayment, maybe a civil penalty on top of that and worst case scenario a criminal record, I would tell her this. You may not be the only one who knows, someone else may report her or she may slip up. Would it help also to voice your concerns to other family members as well, on the basis that you're concerned she may get pulled up for benefit fraud? This might increase the pressure on her to do the right thing.

Hopefully she'll see sense and you won't have to report her or face the fallout from the rest of your family

handcream · 10/01/2014 17:08

I am getting heartily sick of people who use public money meant for the most vunerable claiming benefits they arent entilted to. Of course she cannot carry on claiming benefits whilst she sees whether it works with with this man.

THAT IS NOT WHAT BENEFITS ARE FOR!

IneedAsockamnesty · 10/01/2014 17:10

She may very well still be entitled to it

handcream · 10/01/2014 17:12

The 13 weeek rule is if you intend to come back to your old home. Not to try out a pontential new boyfriend!

bluestar2 · 10/01/2014 17:14

People ignoring wrongdoing and looking the other way is how things got so bad in the first place. I am shocked at the amount of people who think its ok to claim wrongfully while others have to go to work to pay for them trialling a new relationship. Disgraceful.

Op you know you are doing the right thing by reporting. As for telling her first that's for you to decide how much being 'upfront' will affect you. It's not cowardly. You didn't cchoose this or choose to know and your not the one fraudulently taking benefits so if you decide not to tell her and do it anonymously then don't feel guilt about it. Good luck however you decide to deal with it.

handcream · 10/01/2014 17:15

I worked with the Benefits Offices a few years ago and it was staggering that the people reporting other people for benefit fraud were 90% of the time 'friends and relatives' of the potential fraudster.

Apparently people do tend to start boasting and showing off 'saying that everyone is doing it etc etc' to family and friends and those are the people reporting the fraud. Not the rich lady down the road......