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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

To have used the disabled loo today :(

335 replies

peking · 02/01/2014 19:57

An embarrassing moment.

Was in our public library when suddenly overcome with an urgent need to go (Crohn's - thought it was under control but I guess Christmas has messed things up).

There were two toilets - one disabled which also held the only nappy-changing facility there, and one toilet on its own. The single toilet was engaged so I dashed into the disabled. I took some time as I felt really shaky and couldn't stand up for a few minutes.

About halfway through I could hear a toddler crying on the other side and the father trying to placate him as he needed his nappy changed. The toddler probably had to wait about 5 mins.

When I finally got out the father shouted after me "you're out of order, you're not even disabled!"

How mortifying. I just had to ignore him but felt awful for the toddler. As many MN'ers have probably come across people taking up the disabled/nappy-changing facilities before, AIBU?

OP posts:
SpikeyTree · 02/01/2014 22:29

"You are perfectly entitled to use an accessible toilet, with or without good reason." So said one poster on this thread.

DoYouLikeMyBaubles · 02/01/2014 22:32

The sad thing about this is it is completely down to people's morals. It can't really be policed because like we've mentioned, disabilities that aren't visible.

Put some people don't have, what I think to be, the right morals.

PenguinsDontEatStollen · 02/01/2014 22:37

Peking - Glad you are feeling a bit better. And are armed with comments for any next time.

FWIW, if the child was old enough to get upset about waiting and ask questions, I think he was plenty old enough to have been changed standing up or on a handy bit of floor in the other cubicle. It's not that hard. So I still think it was the dad's choice to let him be upset whilst waiting to do it the easy way.

JugglingIntoANewYear · 02/01/2014 22:37

Just for the record though there are also a lot of people, especially women who've had children, who can be pretty desperate for a wee all of a sudden too Spikey ?

SpikeyTree · 02/01/2014 22:39

Yes, so I understand Juggling. If they cannot wait for a normal cubicle to become available then I personally think they are entitled to use the disabled facilities as incontinence is a disability. Others may have different opinions, but I think the real issue on the thread has not been people in desperate need using the facilities, but those with no need other than a massive sense of entitlement which they drag around with them.

DoYouLikeMyBaubles · 02/01/2014 22:41

I remember a topic the same as this about two years ago. It resulted in some posters saying they'd rather the people soil themselves than make a disabled person wait. It got quite heated.

manicinsomniac · 02/01/2014 22:42

Oh, for God's sake, how can this thread possibly be going this way after the thread about TIMC the other day? Do people really not learn or at least understand that other posters have been seriously hurt? (and no, I'm not on mn 24/7 and I don't have a disability or a disabled child, I'm just here once or twice a day for a few minutes and have learned just how tough life is for a lot of posters here.)

OP - YANBU, you have a disability.

Other posters are BVU to suggest that a disabled toilet should be usable by all.

lougle · 02/01/2014 22:43

"I do think there are some slightly grey areas though Spikey - like the weird motorway services I was in with a young ds which was unfamiliar and we couldn't easily find the regular toilets. So we went in the "disabled"/accessible one which we'd come across, which also had baby changing facilities (which he might have needed but probably didn't) - and when we came out got a bit of a bollocking from a mother who was now waiting with her disabled child (but for a very short time)"

See, I don't think that is a grey area at all. If you had only come across the Men's toilets, you would have searched further, or asked a member of staff 'Where are the Ladies' toilets, please?' But, because you found the disabled toilet, you felt that your convenience justified your use of the toilet.

I don't think any disabled person would begrude anyone with acute illness, disablement, baby if that is the only designated changing space, using the toilet. It's when able-bodied, not otherwise disabled, NT people come on to these threads and say that their convenience and their 'rights' are more important than the people who are greatly disadvantaged if they can't access these toilets, that people get upset.

DD1 is disabled, we use the disabled loo if she's in a hurry, or there is a long queue because she can't queue easily and by the time she gets to the front of the queue she's in a bit of a state. If DD2 or DD3 need to use the toilet, we still have to use the disabled loo because we have DD1 with us, who can't queue easily....but if I only had DD2&3 with me, then I wouldn't dream of using it.

JugglingIntoANewYear · 02/01/2014 22:44

I think facilities could be improved so that hopefully there could be ample suitable provision for all Spikey
Meanwhile I agree people should show as much consideration to one another as possible.

manicinsomniac · 02/01/2014 22:45

oh and obviously is someone was really about to have an accident then they should do whatever it takes to stop that happening but, come on, that is almost never going to happen. Most healthy people may experience a sudden urge due to illness once or twice in public in their entire lives. Maybe. Even that is probably an exaggeration as the majority of illnesses will start coming on while a person is still at home or can go home before it gets bad. Not once have I ever seen or heard of a healthy adult wetting or soiling themselves in public.

DoYouLikeMyBaubles · 02/01/2014 22:47

Anyone saying anyone should use them should really go to an exhibit like KidzUpNorth or DownSouth. Take a look at all the equipment some people need to make their lives easier. Some things you just couldn't possibly the imagine. Meet some of the people who need these facilities. Who need that one disabled toilet.

WilsonFrickett · 02/01/2014 22:48

It really hacks me off that so many disabled toilets are also the baby change. I think it sets up the expectation that the two needs are equal, and they are not.

Someone bought a radar key on eBay? Shock

Finally, mnhq are on the ball tonight. Good to see.

RosebudTheCat · 02/01/2014 22:52

OP, YANBU at all. You had to use the toilet urgently.

The problem here really is lack of / not enough of certain facilities. Accessible toilets and baby changing facilities should be separate.

Also, I felt I had to use an accessible toilet recently as had my two DC in a double pushchair and ladies' loos were down a narrow flight of stairs. No lift, couldn't get pushchair down, couldn't carry baby and restrain toddler while trying to use the loo, was on my own with the kids, didn't know where any other toilets were. That could have been avoided if the other toilets weren't quite so inaccessible, iyswim.

SpikeyTree · 02/01/2014 22:52

Juggling, the facilities people with disabilities have now only came about as a result of concerted effort and campaigning. I vividly remember there being one public toilet my father could access in the whole of our very large town. It was locked at 5.30 pm. God, for a time he couldn't even access the toilet in our own house, we had to wait 3 years for adaptations. Having to queue for a loo when you are able to do so is so insignificant compared to the abject humiliation of those years that I find it incomprehensible that some people would like to see people with disabilities forced back to that time.

JugglingIntoANewYear · 02/01/2014 22:53

Interesting lougle but I mildly defend the choice I made in the situation as I perceived it - I still think the mother was probably slightly unreasonable to be so angry with me - we were all traveling with our young children and making use of the facilities in unfamiliar surroundings.
There was no sign as to where any other toilets might be located.

Original poster
peking · 02/01/2014 22:54

I like to think it's the disabled nature of the situation that enables you to use a disabled/accessible toilet - it is a very grey area e.g. the nature of my condition means I'm not even sure whether I should be classed as "disabled" or not as it can come on very suddenly, without warning, and as I mentioned before I thought of myself as quite healthy for the last few months until today. Certainly I wouldn't have described myself as a disabled person because it hadn't impacted on my lifestyle for a while...but the situation put me in a very compromised position. I was a disabled person for a few hours, as it were. I think anyone in a compromised situation should be able to use the facilities, permanently disabled or not.

OP posts:
ProudAS · 02/01/2014 22:54

Problem is nobody knows how common soiling/wetting oneself in public is as most people keep quiet about it.

Disabled facilities are there for a reason but I can't believe it was suggested on a previous thread that a non disabled person should soil themselves rather than use one.

DalmationDots · 02/01/2014 22:56

YANBU, you have a health condition meaning when you need to go, you had to go.

And anyway, what does that guy know, not all disabilities (even ones which mean you need to use a disabled loo) are visible.

ProudAS · 02/01/2014 22:58

Peking - don't feel guilty

You don't deserve to soil yourself.

Crohns is a disability and that doesn't change when it is well controlled

JugglingIntoANewYear · 02/01/2014 23:00

X post with you there Spikey.

I'm sorry for your Dad's experiences and your memories of those times in your childhood Spikey.

I don't think anyone wants to go back to that time - just that I think further improvements could improve facilities for all, and also reduce tensions between different groups such as parents and those with disabilities - like you say putting the changing surface/mat in a designated disabled toilet probably doesn't help situations (and may have been an additional factor making me feel it was OK to use that facility with my small child)

SpikeyTree · 02/01/2014 23:03

People on here who think they are entitled to use the toilets when they have no genuine need are sending us forever backwards I'm afraid.

A campaign for better toilets for parents is great - when is it happening? Or is it like the campaign for buggy spaces on buses, something people think should happen but can't be arsed to organise?

lougle · 02/01/2014 23:04

"Interesting lougle but I mildly defend the choice I made in the situation as I perceived it ....There was no sign as to where any other toilets might be located."

Again, I think it's a question of choices and awareness.

At that moment, you had a choice. You could do the convenient thing and use the toilet (probably thinking 'no harm done, we'll only be quick') or you could put up with a little more inconvenience and ask someone where the toilets are.

Looking at it with a different minority group in mind:

If there were 15 toilets for 'white people' and 1 toilet for 'non-white persons', would you think it perfectly acceptable that a 'white person' went in and used the only toilet that the 'non-white persons' could use? I doubt it...

ProudAS · 02/01/2014 23:05

I seem to remember that baby changing facilities were once in the ladies loo which caused problems if fathers were caring for babies. Possibly we've gone from the frying pan to the fire.

ProudAS · 02/01/2014 23:07

Lougle I wouldn't begrudge a white person who was about to soil themselves. Can't be bothered is another thing though.

JugglingIntoANewYear · 02/01/2014 23:09

Heaven forbid lougle - toilets designated on racial grounds

Perhaps it is somewhat to do with awareness, but it can also be bloody difficult traveling with small children.