To credit MN for the way I handled this rude woman at the shops?

[Primafacie]

... When I felt a bit hurt, humiliated and angry at her comments?

I had an encounter this morning which up till now I thought only ever happened on Mumsnet :)

I was food shopping (M&S, not that i think it's relevant but so I am not accused of dripfeeding) with my DCs (aged 2 and almost 5). I always park their scooters by the store entrance (on the inside), which itself leads to the inside of a shopping mall, and is guarded by a staff member. We (and the store) are in a very safe, family friendly area.

As I was heading for the tills, DD nearly 5 asked if she could wait for me by the scooters. I said yes, as she is very sensible, I was only going to be a few minutes, and in my own risk assessment, this is not a risky situation.

Two minutes later, I emerge from the queue with my shopping and DS in tow. A woman (I am guessing around 75, again not really relevant but don't want to DF) is talking to the security guard by the door, pointing to DD who is waiting by the scooters. She sees me and says 'is this your child?' Conversation then goes like this:

Me: 'Yes she is'.
Her: 'I really don't think it is advisable to leave your child here, anyone could have kidnapped her'.
Me: Rrright. Well, I disagree,and I think she is perfectly safe here.
Her: but you are wrong. Anyone could have taken her. This is really dangerous.
Me: Well, that's your view. I happen to think we live in a good society and I don't see abductors and paedos everywhere.
Her: but you are wrong, you see. She could have come to harm.
Me: so you have said, several times. Look, I disagree with you, and I am not interested in your views. I didn't ask for your opinion. When I was her age my mum used to send me to the shops on my own. Now please leave me and my kids alone.
Her: Happy new year.
Me: and happy new year to you. Now please can you stop following me?

All this without raising my voice, or stopping smiling :o

All the while she was trying to get the poor security guy roped in to tell me off - to his credit, he never opened his mouth.

Still feeling a bit offended, but meh - hardly the end of the world.

So, thanks MN. Can I get my shiny badge now?

I probably wouldn't, though might depend on circumstances.

But in this case it was an elderly lady worried about a small child.

Heartbroken, a single use of the emotive word 'kidnapped' is pretty strong by itself!

No-one will change anyone's mind here. From the way the story is told, the lady sounded caring and concerned to some people, and intrusive to others. The OP stood up for herself and I think that's a good thing.

Buttercups - you'd better stay out of any bookshops then. There's a book called 'Kidnapped!'. You might just faint if you see a whole shelf of them.

Won't someone please think of the children!

Sorry, thought it was clear that kidnapped is an emotive word in relation to a specific child and her mother's actions - sorry if you didn't get that, heartbroken.

I live in a "nice" area too. I have several times been at the shops when something has happened that I think would alarm a small child. Twice we have seen a shoplifter being chased, and in one case he was also clearly high on drugs. I was a bit scared actually that time, as we were the only people in the area he was running toward - I don't know how an "almost five" year old on their own would feel. Another time there was a huge fuss and kerfuffle as they all chased and shouted and swore. I have also seen a couple of people collapse while shopping (one old lady, one epileptic), some masonry fall down, twice been in mall-wide fire drills and once in a power cut.

For me, my decision not to allow the children to be alone till older incorporates several "what ifs". I think your child would almost certainly be safe from abduction, but the risk of her feeling very worried indeed and making the wrong call in an unexpected situation would put me off having her out of sight.

For those who say attitudes to risk have changed between generations. I walked to school aged five. Why was that different to how I feel now? It was a quiet area where all the children walked and so the (not very many) cars on the road expected children at school time and drove accordingly. I also walked with the neighbours children, so was not alone and knew the people who lived in at least 50% of the houses en route and had been told to run to one of them if scared.

I was never allowed to cycle on the road in my childhood though, the roads were utterly hopeless for it and too unsafe.

In the same way, I will allow my children to cycle on the road in Holland - where the people and roads are set up for it. I will not in London. Different situations, different choices.

I've read and re-read your OP, OP, and nowhere do I see the woman being rude. Unless you count her insistence on her point of view.

On the other hand you were rude for telling her to stop following you around.

Her age is irrelevant.

caterpillar we are talking about m+s, not tesco.

Heartbroken, you're being so sarcastic and rude - why? Buttercups wasn't rude to you

And - final kidnapping point from me, I promise - if Mrs Lady was so concerned about the child, you'd think she'd avoid making scary suggestions in front of her. My DD at the same age would have wanted to know why she might be kidnapped etc... Not the action of someone who just wants a child to be okay. Much more the action of someone who wants to tick off a younger woman.

Yes, I know it is M&S? All my scenarios happened in or near to an M&S as well. Have I missed a joke or something?

Sorry, just trying to lighten the mood

Onepost - oh, is sarcasm not allowed on MN anymore?

I'm merely pointing out (and I'm not the only one) that people are a touch hysterical about children being kidnapped and strange danger in this country when the evidence points to the contrary.

And we obviously have a different understanding of the word 'rude' too.

Ah Geckos the mood is way past lightening! (You made me laugh, anyway.)

I'd love to shop in a M&S where you can queue, have your shopping put through the till, pack and pay all in two minutes. Was it the M&S branch at Hogwarts?

Lol Geckos just me being dim-witted then. Never could take a joke, etc. I blame not being British for the lack of a sarcasm-via-computer spotter. I do usually manage in everyday life...

Perhaps a name change to 'sarkyrudemum73' would be appropriate!

Sarcasm is fine when it's a) funny and b) called for - neither of which applied to your posts.

The only rude woman in the situation was you.

Gosh, saucer of milk for Onepost - please point out where I was rude in my whole two responses to Buttercup. Sarcastic, yes.

As stated on another thread, humour is subjective. I'm not asking you to laugh at me.

But it's ok for you to be rude to me?

I do find it rather ironic that when called on being sarky and rude you responded by being - sarky and rude!

Anyway I'm not having a daft argument about it: I just can never understand why people have to try to make themselves look cool and clever by sneering - it just isn't cool or clever!

I'm really not trying to make myself look cool and clever. I'm a middle-aged woman, for goodness sake.

And again, where was I rude to begin with?

And again - why is it ok for you to call me on being rude (apparently) but you can call me 'sarkyrudemum' - rude much?

The phrase 'pot kettle black' springs to mind.

And I didn't want an argument with you either, but you felt the need to pull me on my (non existent) rudeness, so...

It certainly isn't my job to teach you manners!

Then why did you start trying to?

No, it's not your job. And despite what you might think, I have lovely manners (sarcasm on the internet not withstanding).

But, again, you can be rude but I can't?

The child was inside, next to a security guard, it's 2 of January in the m and s sales, personally I would have let the kids cue and run for the scooters!
In all seriousness I think children need to be safe in the world but she was!!!! And you cannot hold their hands all the time.

I think she was right. She wasn't rude she was concerned and you shouldn't leave your five year old unattended in a busy shopping area.