...to take a break from family following horrific Christmas?

[newyeartempname]

I've name changed for this, partly because I'm usually preaching family tolerance at Christmas, but Godalmighty, I'm now eating my words!

I hosted Christmas this year. Parents (late 70s), sister (single mum of 2 and 3 year old), aunt, uncle and cousin, in our house. DH finds some of my family members a little trying. We have no children of our own, but we have the biggest house.

So as not to drip feed: my mum, as much as I love her, is a terrible control freak and sulker. Those tactics haven't worked on me for a long time, but she will persist with them! My dad just goes along with her to keep the peace. My sister is exactly like my mum, only more so; she could sulk for England, and is rather spiteful with it - any tiny slight, real or imagined, leads to the perpetrator being ruthlessly punished.

Because of my sister's situation, my parents help her loads. She's at their house every weekend, and the kids basically wreck it, drawing on the walls etc. My sister has resisted any kind of discipline and routine, which means that the kids take no notice of her. My mum refuses to say "no" to the children because, she says, "your father and I will be dead soon and we want them to have happy memories of us" and "I just need to nurse [DS] through this".

I've always been generous with my sister. I took her, my parents and the kids on holiday twice this year, since money is a little tight for her and they need an extra able bodied person to run after the kids and take them swimming, etc. Both holidays were trying; whenever I asked the children not to do something, or said, e.g., "no, you can't have any more sweets until you've had lunch", my mum would countermand me in front of them and my sister would sulk and say horrible things. The second occasion was just awful, so I resolved not to do it again.

Anyway, fast forward to Christmas. My sister arrives with a face like a stopped clock and sulks until they left on Boxing day, making a great show of packing the car as early as possible that morning to show that she can't wait to leave. Doesn't lift a finger the entire time, didn't say thank you once despite DH and I having made big breakfasts and lovely Christmas lunch and gone out of our way to make everybody welcome etc. On departure, she said, "well, see you" and stalked out.

My mum was even worse. On Christmas morning she got up and complained bitterly to me about the heating in their bedroom (which they could have altered; the radiator isn't hidden), the fact that the bed was too hard and that the room I'd suggested the children sleep in contained a computer and wireless router "so how can you expect them to sleep with all those flashing lights?"

At Christmas dinner she started telling my husband that there was something wrong with his family because they weren't as close as hers. DH was furious but choked it back.

On Boxing day morning, my mum brought in the kids' new bikes (which DH had spent three hours building on Christmas eve, for no thanks) from the garage, dirty wheels and all from being ridden outside, and let the kids ride them around the house. Cream carpets. DH asked the kids nicely to get off and told them that he was putting the bikes outside, and why. My mum ordered him to bring them back in again! Which he did, after saying that he wasn't used to being ordered around in his own house. I told the kids that they could sit on their bikes in the conservatory, but they couldn't ride them; my mum said, "Oh, let them ride their bikes". I said no, it was my house.

Cue horrendous sulks from my mother, who then deliberately called DH by the wrong name when leaving!

I've just had enough of them. They expect me to go and visit them for a few days over the holidays, which I normally would, but when my dad called I told him that I wouldn't be coming and why.

I feel like my dad is suffering as a consequence, but my mum and sister need to learn that their behaviour is unacceptable.

Am I being unreasonable? Sorry this is so long. It just came spilling out!!

BTW - I've tried sensible discussions with both mum and sister in the past. No go - waterworks, hysteria, I'm going to be dead soon so you must do what I want etc etc.

I think people underestimate the power shift that happens when you give. And how strong (and basty) resentment is as an emotion.

After bringing you up to be a perpetual parent to the whole family, you behave like a very kind and generous parent... Only to be told nothing you do is good enough and you must try harder. So you try harder, and make them feel bitter and wormy with resentment inside. So they push your buttons to make sure you are punished for making them feel bad, so you try and make it up to them... Nice vicious circle going on there.

You can't control their behaviour, you can control yours, so try and break this unhealthy circle of childishness and resentment. It's actually disgusting, a mother forcing her own daughter to be the parent.

And I'm sorry to be the voice of dissent, but really? Your father? He may be outwardly nicer but he's not exactly the nice guy in this is he? If he was truly a good person then why hasn't he put a stop to this dynamic years ago?

Why does he get to have all the 'oh poor him' sentimentality? when he is your father, your parent, the actual bonefide grown up, yet by his inaction has colluded in creating this situation.

very well put, double.

Thanks ladies. And I agree, Double, my dad should have stuck up for me. The furthest he ever goes is asking for arguments to stop when my mum gets hysterical. Once I rang home and only my dad was in, at which point he told me that I was a fantastic daughter and a person to be proud of, and that I shouldn't allow my mum to domineer over me. He'd never do that in front of her.

Sideburns, I very seldom get thanks. I think they have come to expect that I'll just do things for them.

Vicar, thanks, I think I am striving for their approval. It's been really bad this year, nothing ever good enough. Not the holidays, not Christmas, not the big birthday party I arranged for my mum. My sister actually said, on the second holiday, that my paying for things didn't make up for my being horrible to her and my mum, thinking they were stupid (I never said this, ever) and the fact that, according to her, I hate my nephew (which I don't. I love both children to bits).

So I think that Crapbag may be correct about the putdowns.

Send them all a Letter/e mail.
Point out that as everything you do for them is such a let down/not enough that you will no longer be doing it.
Please listen to vicar.
See them when YOU want to, on YOUR terms or not at all.

I agree. You all sound overenmeshed and far too involved in each other's lives and being overinvolved in their lives isn't even doing any good as they don't appreciate your efforts.
Find nice people to spend time with. Yes your relatives might drop down dead tomorrow but so might you, or your husband. Life is too short to spend it with people who are unpleasant to you.
I wouldn't completely break contact but I wouldn't go on holiday with them all again and would cut down the frequency and length of visits and try and emotionally untangle yourself from them.
Your sister sounds really nasty.

There is no respect for you OP from your family.

You need to start 2014 by respecting your self and your DH and changing your role of 'rescuer' in the family dynamics; become the 'unable to help' one instead and watch things change!

Happy 2014

Can we go back to the letter please?

The receipt for the pjs your parents told your sister to buy you.

Do you need to take them back? Was there a problem with them? Did she get the wrong size?

crapbag I think inadvertently you may have given ME the key to why my mother and sister don't like me at all very much, and why they worked so hard to keep me in the DV relationship I was in.

Thank you!

When asked to help your sister - point out she an adult and that long term her sorting out her own mess will only help her self worth. Any negative comments say your just thinking about her long term well being and repeat that every time.

When told to your regret not doing things when they're gone - say they have years left so you'll not worry about that yet - say it very breezily and change subject it worked for my parents with my GP.

I'd also think about booking holidays without them now - for Christmas and summer so you know it taken care of and you can't weaken later on. It also stops the practice of doing stuff with them and gives you something to look forward to.

I would suggest you don't offer money or to buy things for the DC in future - saving in quiet would be better for them long term anyway.

Good luck - and I hope you have a better year.

I think you need to accept that nothing will ever be enough. You could sign over everything you own, empty your bank accounts to them and become their slave and they would STILL hate you for it.

In fact, they may hate you more.

Oddly enough, helping people too much can actually cause them to resent you for it. I think it is feeling like they 'owe' you, or you 'lord it over them' (I know you don't, but it may be their perception of it!). Or cause them to feel like you have an obligation to give them everything you have, like they have a right to it.

You see the latter all the time re: inheritance. So many people think their parents' money is theirs by right. This is along the same sort of line. People feeling that what you have belongs to them.

The best thing you can do is to step back. Stop stepping in with cash and holidays and problem solving. It's not down to you to sort out their lives. Let them do it... sink or swim.

Thanks!

You sound like a thoughtful, kind, and lovely person. If you can step away from the role of parenting them while allowing them to behave as spoiled under-10s your life should become even better.

One thing though. If the OP had been a wife reporting that her husband does this kind of enabling, he would be getting a very rough ride on here with lots of calls for him to get a grip or else the OP must leave him. With this in mind, there'll be a limit to your husband's tolerance. He sounds like the best person in your life and he should be prioritised over this incredible carry-on.

I would never ever offer help in any kind ever again.

You've been far too kind, almost like an indulgent parent, and they treat you and your dh with utter contempt.

So no more help, not even putting together of bicycles and disappear for a bit.

When you are up to contact again, I would just keep distant from your sister and very polite with your parents.

Your parents sound especially dim with their refusing to discipline children who are wreaking their home. Those children will remember their gps as suckers. That's it.

I think you need to just let them find their own way and stop taking responsibility for any of their happiness.

It's already bitten you on the bum.

You are amazing btw. I'd've said fuck off to each of them and held the front door open at the first sign of bad behaviour.

'Some people need to be dipped in Vagisil to stop them being such irritating twats!!

Thanks to Pinterest for that one

mmm, not sure I'd send an email saying No More, which some have suggested

What actually is the best result for YOU now? what do you want?

Now only you can answer this, but I shall venture a few guesses

1: more respect from them.

2: contact with your DNs

3: less imposition on your husband.

ok, 1 is the big one.

everyone is unanimous that you need to do less for them at this stage. They are taking you for a ride in all sorts of ways. And while you've been willing, that needs to stop at this point.

Distance is needed.

2 to keep contact with yoru DNs you do need to have some sort of relationship with your sister. you said she is sulky and sometimes spiteful. Now, I think the aim is to draw lines with her without actually pissing her off so much she severs contact.

I would wait from now on to be asked to do stuff. ignore hints, snide comments and digs, which will certainly come. Just put your emotoins to one side when they happen, don't respond and talk it over with your husband later. When, if, they actually ask outright, you can say that you're not in a position to do that atm. or that you have other plans. You can say it without being offensive, simply calm and reasonable.

They will not like the new newyear (no one ever likes situations changing) but by keeping calm, you'll be keeping the possibility open that once the tantrums have passed they will adjut to the new status quo. That will hopefully mean it's possible to have contact with her children. I would advise not letting her know just how much you want it though because if she's spiteful, she may very very well use them to play games with you; withholding contact to punish you.

3. putting yoru husbnad first and standing up for him when they act so badly towards him - again, calmly- will help your husband a lot. You and he need to be a team here. He could very justifiably be furious about their criticism of his family and he would rightly expect your support.

Maybe you can't do this all at once. Your father has been ground down by your mother I suspect. But you are not living with her nor your sister but with a very supportive man and hopefully by starting to try these things, you can begin to change things and build on that.

OP - so are you going forward, putting yourself and your husband first and changing plans for next year then - or will it be a repeat of this Christmas and you can entertain us all again next year?

My favorite expression is ' a face like a slapped arse '.

I'm glad you've got a nice husband to support you. It sounds like there is a massive load of jealousy and resentment from your sister over your better circumstances. There seem to have been horrible comments made about your fertility problems. I would struggle to forgive those and the lack of respect given to your partner. I would step back from it for a while and stop letting them treat you both like shit.

My sister has no children and dotes on nieces and nephews; she does spoil them and sometimes goes way over the top and makes our presents for our children look crap in comparison. But the children don't really care - they enjoy the presents and I love my sister and enjoy her pleasure at pleasing them; I am happy to share my children and have a perfect babysitter at virtually any time. I really hope she is able to have children as I can tell she will be a wonderful mum.

Hope the new year brings much happiness to you and your partner.

what a nice post always

slapped arses are just red though, or is that the idea? Cat's bum mouth is a good one. I initially presumed the face like a stopped clock just implied a frozen expression, the sort you get with botox and trowelled on make up.

Thanks ladies. DH and I had a lovely night out with friends yesterday, and we had a talk about the future this morning. He was urging me not to be too precipitate and not to prejudice contact with my niece and nephew in the future - echoes some of the good advice on here. I realise that I need to put DH first and move away from my mum, dad and sister a bit.

My mum called yesterday evening as if nothing had happened. I said that I couldn't talk to her then (which I couldn't - we were at our friends' house) and she started kicking off about me 'starting 2014 with bitterness'. I simply wished her a happy new year and said "bye!". That is a big step forward for me, since usually I'd be appeasing her.

And, bling, DH says that we'll go ice skating in hell before we entertain them for Christmas again, and I agree!

Glad you had a good one newname! Start 2014 as you mean to go on! Happy New Year!

well done for not falling for your mum's manipulation, is this a stronger, more determined you?

My mum used to say a lot of the things to me you mention your mum saying. Fortunately for me, I read a very good book about detaching when I was in my early 20s and I learnt to detach and let the emotional blackmail wash over me. I got all the tears, tantrums, "you are so cold" comments, etc. But after a while they stopped. I think she finally realised that they weren't going to work on me. Now I am in my late 30s and my mother and I have a good relationship. But she still knows where the boundaries go and if there is any sign of emotional blackmail, then I make it clear immediately that it is not acceptable. At the start I used to walk off or refuse to engage. It was very hard to do. Now I just take the piss and she gets the hint.

It sounds like you are already detaching, and that is great. Keep going. It may get more difficult for a while, but long term you may be doing something great for your family relationships.

Yanbu they sound horrendous. Never ever again. Go away for Christmas, or have a 'quiet' one, they are ungrateful selfish individuals, the lot of them. Stop being a doormat, and start being assertive! You sound lovely, they don't deserve you or your dh.

Good on you op, 2014 the start of a new assertive you!