To complain about this??

[absentmindeddooooodles]

My ds is 2.9. He goes to the nursery down the road one day a week. ( cannot afford for him to go any more regularly) just to get socialised and to try and work on seperation anxiety. velcro child syndrome

Went to pick him up today and was met by three of the nursery workers "wanting to have a talk".

This got me really worried as they looked very....strict. like I was being bloody told off.

To cut a long story short....they told me that as my son is still in nappies I would have to think about taking him out of nursery until the problem is sorted!! ( problem him not being potty trained)

They talked for a good ten mins about how its an inconvenience to them having such a big boy needing constant monitoring incase hes done a poo.

I didnt want to get into an argument and never would infront of all the kids, but did put across a couple of points:
. He is in "the baby room" as they call it. Babies from birth to 3 years. There are fewer older toddlers than babies....so I imagine they should be all set up forpchanging nappies.
.theybe never said anything to me before about him being in nappies being an issue. I have even had discussions with his keyworker about the favt that I had tried potty training him but he got a v bad bout of chicken pox right in the middle of it so we have gone back to square one.
. I dont personally think he's too old to be in nappies. He's not 3 until april and as long as he isn't rocking up to his first day of school in pampers Its fine.
. He is currently undergoing a diagnnosis for adhd and possibly as. It's bloody hard enough to get through the day without making him do something hes not ready to.

Their response to all the above was that he is more than old enough to be using a toilet and by him not doing this its taking time away from the babies who actually need looking after!!!!!

Out of the three of them who spoke to me....the youngest one ( about 16 on placement) told me it was disgusting to have to clean up a fully grown childs poo!

Im reeling and actually v embarassed as there were quite a few other parents round while this was going on.

Now I know ianbu to not be impressed with the way this was dealt with......but aibu to not have potty trained him by now?

Should he be totally out of nappies by this age? This is my first dc and moat friends dc are younger thn mine. A family member had their dd totally dry through the night by 2.5....but all kids are different.....surely its down to the individual?

Im sorry this has been so epically long...but am at a loss!
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Your DS sounds like a very sharp little boy, I have a DS of the same age who is also still in nappies and has a mild speech delay so I know that potty training at the moment would not be right for him. I hope you would consider removing him from such an unsupportive environment, I'm sure there must be much better nurseries or preschools close to you.

So the spelling errors in the 'statements' are actually real? I thought you had retyped them hastily on a phone!

How 'proffessional' of them! Even if the author was dyslexic, you'd think that something as serious in nature as this would warrant a spellcheck on their half. They sound like they don't have two GSCEs to rub together, let alone the capacity to look after someone else's children!

Oh my word, doodles. Hope you DS is settling again.

At least they are digging a big hole for themselves.

Theres no way ds will be going back there. Just hope that no other kids have been affected by their actions in any other ways.

Re the spelling mistakes....crazy isn't it!! I know judging by my own posts I dont have a leg to stand on in that respect...but I assure you all correspondence with themwas all correctly spelt and punctuated :)

Have just had another email ping up so will have a read and update.

i hardly ever comment on threads but I can't believe what I've read!

These 'proffesionals' sound appalling. I wouldn't want to trust them stacking shelves with their attitude, let alone caring for young children. The more attention you can draw to this the better, and I NEVER think that about situations!!

Sorry, read more of the thread, why don't you take him out until he's 3 when he'll have his free 15hrs? Is there any preschools near you that do short 3hr morning/afternoon sessions? If so, get him on a waiting list for one of those. His behavioural problems at nursery, is it possible he's bored? He sounds very intelligent (from what you've stated of him) and you say he's in the baby room so may not be recieving enough stimulation. If you put him in a preschool setting, this would not be an issue as most only take from 2/2.5yrs so he'll be with children his own age or older. The preschool my dd went to were very relaxed re potty training, they'd take them at any stage.

Witness statement from x member of staff present in room.

I was aware that mrs doodles was having a private conversation in the corner of the room as I had been made aware of the situtation before she came in.
I did not hear the full talk bit saw that mrs doodles became hostile when confeonted with info about ds.
I work with ds for the afternoon session amd can say that I second him having learning disabilities of some sort. He cannot count as high as the other children of his age and gets confused between certin animals. He cannot say his alphabet past j. He is not potty trained and cries when we put him onto the toilet.
For this reason I believe in my opinion that he would be better off in another nursery where thwy can cater to his special individual needs.

I have been keeping out of this thread because I don't have DC myself but if a 16 year old placement student can have a "professional opinion" I guess I can comment I just wanted to let you know I am furious for you Your son sounds lovely and the way the nursery staff have treated him and you is beyond inappropriate and unprofessional. They had the opportunity to apologise to you and learn lessons but they have gone on the attack instead! They are being bullies, plain and simple. They should not work with children.

I know the threat of social services is scary but I think the nursery is mentioning them as a bluff. Also remember that social workers have seen children who have been genuinely abused and know the signs, I think they would be annoyed if their time was wasted with statements like:

"Ds came into nursery wearing leggings last week. Navy blue girls leggins. I do not think this is appropriate for a male child. It is blurring the lines between gender issues.'"

It's obvious how much you care about your son and you are doing the right thing by reporting the nursery to Ofstead, their shocking statements speak for themselves. Good luck and keep us updated.

I do think hes not got enough stimulation in that room. He is bright and is much better with older children. As thats what hes used to.

Unfortunatley the older room in this nursery is the only preschool I have acvess to until I pass my driving test. Grrrr.

doodles, is the subtext to this that they think he has additional needs and are trying to force him out, do you think?

There is so much wrong with the staff here that it hard to know where to begin.

Professional fucking opinion ??!!?? ..... I've never read anything less "professional" in my life and wouldn't trust this lot with a stick insect, let alone very young children.

OP - am so very sorry for you and your son. Won't repeat what everyone else has already said but this whole thing is absolutely horrific on so many levels. Do please pursue this as far as you can, it's nauseating to think of other vulnerable babies and toddlers (.. and I don't mean vulnerable as in having any form of special needs, I just mean that tiny children are vulnerable full stop) remaining in the "care" of these dishonest, lazy and (at best) misguided idiots. I'm so pleased the other mother has agreed to help you - that should reassure you, not that you should need it, that you're not imagining things, not getting hold of the wrong end of the stick or being unreasonable in any other way .... after all, this woman is all but a stranger to you and has nothing to gain by "siding" with you and telling "fibs" about what she saw and heard. In fact, arguably, her supporting you could potentially - if the nursery get wind of it - quite possibly make things awkward for her, so the fact she's so readily agreed to back you up speaks volumes. Presumably she is just as shocked and horrified by this as we all are.

I really hope you get somewhere with this. For me, it wouldn't be about getting a (hollow) apology from such people, but about ensuring they are hauled over the coals by the powers that be (OFSTED, college etc) and that other kids aren't exposed to their ineptitude and lack of compassion. I should imagine that all the other parents who use this nursery would be very very interested indeed in what's gone on - regardless of their own child's development etc ...... when you place your child in the care of so-called professionals, you expect decency, honesty, compassion and transparency. Not this complete load of shite they've dumped on you and your son. Poor thing. FWIW, my now 10 year old daughter who's hugely advanced academically (said not to boast but to point out that toilet training "delays" aren't directly linked to "intelligence" for example and can occur for all sorts of reasons) wasn't potty trained until she was about 3 - can't remember exactly - but do recall she was very reluctant for whatever reason and I did sometimes wonder if we'd ever get there. But of course we did. Your son's progress doesn't sound like a "problem" to me and it's appalling that he's been caused stress and anxiety about it.

I thought he was doing well with his alphabet and numbers ( upto 20!) Hes not a friggin genius!! Hes 2 years old and doing bloody well in my eyes!

I second the opinion that you will get a faster response from the Early Years LEA team. There will be an advisory teacher in charge of this nursery/preschool, they will also do inspections.

My jaw was hanging whilst reading this thread. Just unbelievably awful....and then there were the emails taking it all to a whole new level The idea that a student on a placement feels it is acceptable to diagnose autism is staggering.

"t I second him having learning disabilities of some sort."

Oh so it's based on a vote now? They dig deeper and deeper...

I don't know why they keep bringing up that he might have special needs when you are already aware of that and seeking a diagnosis and support and you told them that. They were the ones not making any allowances for the fact that he might have special needs. His possible special needs don't excuse them pushing potty training or speaking to you so rudely, if anything they should be more sensitive! I don't know what they expect to gain by bringing the issue up! They are only making themselves look worse.

Their attitude towards you and your son reminds me very much of some of the experiences of people who have posted on the SN needs board.

Doodles, it sounds like you are doing a fab job. Them, not so much.

So, the manager said she noticed you becoming hostile, and the keyworker says you were becoming hostile so she called the manager over.
If they are going to lie, they should at least be consistant.

Manager statement About 5 minutes into the conversation I could see that keyworker was becoming intimidated so I stepped in and calmy explained

Keyworker statement I called over my manager to assist with the conversation but mrs doodles was in he end asked to leave as she was not taking our constructive suggestions well.

Thankyou cat.. I agree about the intelligence and other delays are not directly connected. Ds can make alot of really good observations and generally has quite a high level of intelligence. .....but has real behavioural meltdowns whilst with me which is the issue aswell as no concerntration span and a few other bits.

He has never ever had an episode of this at nursery according to them. They all dismissed the idea of him javing adhd as he was so well behaved when with them. He plays nicely on his own most of the time, drawing and painting etc. Like you say in no way a stelth boast just factual.

Id hate to think that this was to do with any potential sn. Its more to do with sleep patterns and hyperactivity when in the house or out and about with me specifically.

They have a couple of sn children in that class. ( one with severe autism, one that uses a wheelchair due to a condition that I dont really know much about, and one that has such severe allergies that it affects almost everything he does) so if it is to do with any sn he may have its even more reason to bollock them!!

Go in and grab his progress book before they have a chance to alter it too.

Can't remember what it is called but it will show that the emails are bullshit.

Good grief they are a bunch of fuck Muppets who are stupid enough to put in writing just how stupid they are!

The 16 yr old writing in "her professional opinion" is just jaw dropping. I wouldnt trust her with a guinea pig let alone a child.

Hope Ofsted throw the book at them.

I have read this whole thread like this

Agree calling the Early education and childcare unit - google EECU, also great suggestion re calling the student's college. I have chaired a Pre-school for years and honestly cannot say how wrong this all is!

Ps my son aged 2.9 cannot say any of his alphabet, nor count beyond 3 or 4 (by rote). The accepted level of speech for a child's age is the number of words in a sentence to the number of years they are in age - so 2 years=2 word sentences.

Oh my giddy aunt! I'm speechless. My flabber is well and truly ghasted.

As others have said, this "nursery" have completely screwed themselves over by putting all this in writing. They've implicated themselves in multiple policy violations and acts of discrimination. Keep copies of everything from them so you can pass it to Ofsted and the LEA.

How vile. I'm so glad you're not sending your ds there again.