To complain about this??

[absentmindeddooooodles]

My ds is 2.9. He goes to the nursery down the road one day a week. ( cannot afford for him to go any more regularly) just to get socialised and to try and work on seperation anxiety. velcro child syndrome

Went to pick him up today and was met by three of the nursery workers "wanting to have a talk".

This got me really worried as they looked very....strict. like I was being bloody told off.

To cut a long story short....they told me that as my son is still in nappies I would have to think about taking him out of nursery until the problem is sorted!! ( problem him not being potty trained)

They talked for a good ten mins about how its an inconvenience to them having such a big boy needing constant monitoring incase hes done a poo.

I didnt want to get into an argument and never would infront of all the kids, but did put across a couple of points:
. He is in "the baby room" as they call it. Babies from birth to 3 years. There are fewer older toddlers than babies....so I imagine they should be all set up forpchanging nappies.
.theybe never said anything to me before about him being in nappies being an issue. I have even had discussions with his keyworker about the favt that I had tried potty training him but he got a v bad bout of chicken pox right in the middle of it so we have gone back to square one.
. I dont personally think he's too old to be in nappies. He's not 3 until april and as long as he isn't rocking up to his first day of school in pampers Its fine.
. He is currently undergoing a diagnnosis for adhd and possibly as. It's bloody hard enough to get through the day without making him do something hes not ready to.

Their response to all the above was that he is more than old enough to be using a toilet and by him not doing this its taking time away from the babies who actually need looking after!!!!!

Out of the three of them who spoke to me....the youngest one ( about 16 on placement) told me it was disgusting to have to clean up a fully grown childs poo!

Im reeling and actually v embarassed as there were quite a few other parents round while this was going on.

Now I know ianbu to not be impressed with the way this was dealt with......but aibu to not have potty trained him by now?

Should he be totally out of nappies by this age? This is my first dc and moat friends dc are younger thn mine. A family member had their dd totally dry through the night by 2.5....but all kids are different.....surely its down to the individual?

Im sorry this has been so epically long...but am at a loss!
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im horrified at this. to be blunt I think they sound as if they are using the 'potty training thing' as an excuse as they are not able to support your DS in his needs - I think tellingly they make a thing about this in their incrimminating emails.

Which I think is far worse a form of discrimmination.

They sound quite thick I hope you run rings around them and throw the book at them. The college should be withdrawing any placements for the foreseeable for a start.

OP I'm also really horrified by this
I have 2 DSs, DS1 potty trained aged 3 yrs 4 months, DS2 hung on until 3 yrs 6 months
Their nursery could not have been nicer about it, they managed it really well and were completely relaxed about getting the DSs used to the potties/toilets but not rushing them into anything until they were ready to come out of nappies

It would have broken my heart if someone had inferred that my little boys were "disgusting"

I really hope that you get a response from the council & OFSTED

Yes thick and nasty too. The 16 year old has some excuse as I supposed she was just reflecting the behaviour of the senior workers in this establishment. Probably she was too dim('top student' - ha!) to realise just what bad 'role models' these women were. But I think her college will be grateful they found out just how bad this nursery is and presumably they will not be allowing their students to be placed there in the future (if it's still open).

Although it is difficult to apportion too much blame to a 16-year-old, I can't help wondering if she is really suited for a career in childcare. Working the tills at PoundStretcher might be more her type of thing.

And as for the 'Manager' there are no words, really. How does someone like this spend years in childcare and rise to a managerial role?

OP, YANBU. You are dealing with this very well, keep it up. Hug your little boy from me. I think most of what I want to say has already been very well said by others. I hope that they get into a lot of trouble for this.

they know nothing about child development nor about special needs.

I feel a bit sorry for the 16 year old. She's just a child herself. Yes, her comment was inappropriate but she's 16. She's there shadowing people who she has been led to believe are professionals, and is probably just following their lead as she will have been told to. I doubt she knows any better and at 16 won't have the confidence to challenge an adults behaviour. I echo the comment about her probably having no idea about her statement, I certainly doubt she wrote it.

The poor girl has now been reported to her tutor and will be having a very awkward conversation in the near future. Yes, she'll be learning a harsh lesson which she will learn from but even so, I imagine she'll be devastated.

Yes that's true she was just following their lead, but to be honest she sounds quite uncaring and not a very nice girl. I wouldn't use her to babysit. I think she is unsuited to childcare.

It's great that you got in touch with the college and they were so helpful. It doesn't sound like the 16 year old wrote the statement but it is shocking that she said changing your child's nappy was disgusting in front of him. It's better for her that this is addressed now so she can learn from it.

Nnnnnnn its a very harsh but much needed lesson for the girl. She can't afford to be so impressionable and take everything the other adults do as gospel. If she suspects something is wrong, or the children are been let down, she needs to be able to blow the whistle instead of being a meek little sheep. Harsh, but true.

I agree that her 'statement' was likely forged, but she put herself in a bad position by being a cheeky little 'yes man' and putting her two cents in (the 'disgusting' comment) when she really didn't need to. For that, her head should roll, devastated or not. She failed that child when she chose to stick the boot in.

I agree that 2.9 is too young to expect a child to be toilet trained, and totally agree that what you have faced from this nursery is awful in that respect.

However, every one of the statements describes your reaction as "hostile" - what did they mean by that?

She may only be 16 now but it won't be long before she able to qualify. Regardless of her age, I think it is very worrying that she has that sort of mentality going into a workplace like that. I don't expect all caregivers to fart rainbows, but at the same time should not be using the word 'disgusting' in any sort of context to describe children. Not on.

Sorry am only on page 6 but I just need to say...

gender issues!!!!

On the one hand she's diagnosed him as autistic, all by herself, what a clever little girl, don't worry OP you can call off the paed now FFS.

On the other hand they don't want to spend time with your son because they need to be with the children with sn.

What the flying fuck are they talking about.

I am incandescent with rage for you, but also happy about their pathetic attempts to bully and intimidate you whilst handily leaving a paper trail.

Right, read the rest of the pages.

Definitely contact the council, probably via children's services I think?

Also, just a word of warning, in my experience, people are often very nice and understanding when you approach them unexpected, but after some thought and investigating can be easily reassured and become not helpful at all.

Basically I'm saying, don't be surprised if the college speak to the nursery, with whom they have an existing relationship, and becomes neutral and vegy distant woth you, making it clear that they sont get involved.

If they get told its a 'difficult parent' who was hostile and they had to ask to leave, and now you're spreading lies about them... And they partner with the person/ establishment saying this, then it suddenly won't seem so clear.

I have rather too much experience of trying to complain about truly awful behaviour and had people close ranks very quickly. Sorry if this doesn't happen but don't want you to feel distraught if it does. They are only a side point to the whole thing anyway, as the council & ofsted are the ones who will actually investigate and do something about this disgusting nursery.

I worked in a nursery at 17. Some of the girls in my class worked in awful nurseries but were able to recognise that, and spoke to our tutors and were moved elsewhere. Sixteen year olds aren't stupid!

Sorry you are going through this op x

Agree with asking for his progress book today before they doctor it.

If they refuse day it's lost etc,ask for it in writing that they have lost it/you can't have it. They are probably stupid enough to give you more written evidence in which to hang themselves.

In fact, even better, put your phone in your pocket and record. No doubt they will be truly unprofessional when they see you. Send off the recording to ofsted.

If the Nursery is on a school site and feeds directly into the preschool it is possible that it comes under the umbrella of the school itself.

Children's services at the council should be able to clarify.

As an aside - ds1 wasn't potty trained until he was three and a bit. On doctors orders after an early attempt result in him withholding and becomings very constipated for a year. As a consequence, with ds2 I deliberately waited until he was totally ready which was when he was 3 and 9 months. Totally sorted within 5 days. Dd was 2 and 4 months. Different children and different approaches. I never ever had any comment from preschool apart from "when he's ready, we will help". In any case, after the first few weeks of preschool both of the boys regulated themselves and simply didn't poo at preschool.

Just caught up on all the replies!

Having slept on it I do feel quite bad for the young girl. It would be a shsme to affect the rest of her life with one ill judged confrontation. However I dobfeel that she should be discipline d through college. Her manner wasvery confrontational.....arms crossed staring straight at me, chin out kinds thing. I think she has a hell of alot of growing up to do before she is ready to bedoing rhis course...if ever! At 16 years old theres no way that I or any of my friends would have followed an example like that. I was painfully shy but I still woupdveblown the whistle on behaviour like that.

Will see what the college have to say about it. TThe tutor said hed call me back after hes had a chat with her ( sometime around 930am today) Someone said about maybe the college and others becoming unhelpful after speaking to eachother. ( sorry cant articulate well....ddsdecided sleep was for wimps last night) Anyway Im not too worried about the college doing this....mmy mum is quite high up there having been there for about 14 years....her depeartment is right next to rhe health and social care so knows this tutor well. My partner also works at the colleges other site and I went there plus worked there myself. Helps to know the right people )

R.e the statements. I thinks whats mire likely to have happened is theyve all sat round the bloody table at lunchtime and written the lot of them together. Then sent them at intervalls to avoid suspicion.

Ive been trying to work out who would have written them:

The manager is actually quite articulate and I know has been educated to quite a high standard.....I'd be really surprised if she had written all the emails with all the spelling mistakes. I know people can write very diffrently to how they talk......but the emails just dont match up to her! Shes more of a matrony type. Shes theonly member of staff over about 25 in the whole place and plays son that alot.

The keyworker: used to be really nice!! always cuddling the kids and doing all the creative bits and bobs with them

Just catching up!

They made a big mistake firing off those statements. If they had these concerns they should have acted upon them surely. If they thought SS needed to be involved don't they have a responsibility to report their concerns?

Basically, if your DS had turned up next week potty-trained (and in BOYS clothes) they wouldn't have said anything would they? Or would they have created a new problem?

It's so tit-for-tat it's laughable. The collusion if not forgery of statements, unreal!

I would expect closed ranks too. Sadly. Easier not to rock the boat.

X-post. Hope the college come through for you

Gah posted too soon.

Anyway. Again the emails dont quite fit. :-/ could be totally wrong on this one or any of them I realise, but having thought about it all a bit more it does seem v weird to me that the style of writing is so far removed from how any of them talk.

Im gutted about the keyworker. Shes genuinley a really nice girl. ( I think about 22) and ds has always gone straight to her....built quite a bond. :(

Now I dont want this to sound snobby, derogatory or anything else....but the language in the emails seemed quite.....erm.....common/slangy iyswim?

There are two people who were in the room that talk like that.......the 16 year old girl and another member of staff whos known as "babs" ( nothing to do with her name)

I genuinley dont think the 16 yo sat down and wrote them.....but babs is the one who does alot of the admin. All the forms and emails to parwnts etc. I think its more likely that she has actually written them while the others have told her the kind of things to write.

Im probably thinking waaaay too much into this but have been up all nigjt with naff all else to do.

R.e their attitude to sn etc. Thats still really getting to me. I just dont understand why they would try and pushds out. According to them he I so well behaved and you would never know theres any sn of any kind. This is exactly what theyve said on a couple of occassions. So which bloody way is it?!?

I think theyve always had an issue with the fact he crieswhen he goes in though. This is where it does show. He gets really excited about thenprospect of going to nursery ( ive worked really bloody hard on this)all fine until one of them take him off me. You can see a couple of them making faces thinking here we go again. But ive always been told he stops crying 2 mins later and is fine the rest of the day. I know it can upset some of the othwr kids especislly if babies are sleeping but its just part of it right?
Snother thing I feel they dont like is the favt that ds doea not have a nap in the day. They work yltheir lunch hours around when the xhildren nap in the baby room ( shift basis) and ds plus one other child are the only ones to dont sleep. ( the othrrs sleep from one to tjree hours!!)

Im juat clutching at straws now. I'll stop. Haha.

Still have 2 more statements to come. I will be going to the nursery in 15 mins when they are properly open to ask for his record of achievement as they call it. Am also meeting the other mum down there and shes coming hime with me to write out a statement :)

She phoned me last night and is appauled at ehats happened. Luckily she semi knows the dad that was there at the time so is going to speak to him at pickup timr today. So fingers crossed for another helping hand.

Am off to the council at 11, so will see how that goes. :)

Thanks for all the support again!

Good luck!

Good luck getting hold of OFSTED today absent - I am absolutely gobsmacked by how appallingly this nursery has treated yourself and DS.

Everything crossed for you here.