"Selfish" of me to want Dh's family to care

[Sparklymommy]

Ok, so dh and I have been together thirteen years. We have four children, aged 10, 7, 6, and 4. Dd1 (10) was the first grandchild on every side and doted fought over by everyone in the early days.

All of my children are involved in performing arts and regularly perform in festivals, Shows, pantomimes. Dd1 is in her 5th pantomime this year. Dh's family have seen her once. Last year. When dh gave them the tickets.

In fact, in 8 years his parents have seen her in 2 dance school shows, 1 variety show and 1 pantomime. His sister (who now has 2 children herself) has only seen her in the panto last year when dh gave the tickets.

I wouldn't mind but this year dd1 is in one pantomime. Ds1 is in another. SIL is taking her children to a pantomime further afield to watch. I am hurt. SIL is dd1s godmother but does not bother with her anymore.

Last night I happened to be discussing how upsetting this was, especially as my own father, who would have supported the children and watched them, died five years ago and apart from my mother no one ever goes to watch them. All the other children get extremely excited when they have family, friends and that in the audience and my children don't get to feel like that.

Dh overheard my conversation and shouted at me that I was being selfish. And his sister didn't want to see the local, professional, panto, the one dd is in because she didn't like any of the cast. What about her niece????

I am in two minds. I would so like to buy then tickets as their Christmas present so that they have to go but panto tickets aren't cheap and I can't really afford it. And I wouldn't be so upset if it weren't for the fact that they go to the theatre about twice a month, but never to watch the dc.

Sorry, just seen how long this post is.

yabu, watching children perform is incredibly boring to all but the parents and occasional doting grandparent, if they support one, they'll have to support all four, that's a lot of torturous evenings to expect other people to endure.

The real problem is the lack of interest in your children. It could be because you have so many, do you expect them to take them all if they ask for one (or have in the past)? They may be rude cunts that lost interest or they may have been driven away by unreasonable expectations. What happened?

My daughter is in a dance company which puts on a show at the end of the year. Tickets are quite expensive (the equivalent of 35 pounds for an adult and 20 for a concession). Half the show is about the kinder and junior students who aren't that great at remembering their choreographies. I asked my parents out of courtesy if they would like to come but they said it was too expensive for them so I went by myself (and was asked why the rest of my family didn't come). I didn't take that to mean that they don't care. They always like to watch us dance when we go to visit them.The school does not allow video or photography either.

"With regards to SILs children, they have no hobbies"

So there have been no activities in your SILs children's lives that you could have watched and supported them in? How utterly astounding in this day and age (unless they are only 2!).

No nativity plays, No school concerts. No sports days. No prize giving. No nothing.

Not that I'm suggesting for a moment that you should want to watch other people's children involved in their activities, but had there ever been something, just one tiny little thing, anything at all, in your SILs children's lives then you would have had the opportunity to lead by example and make your point to all your ILs in the kindest possible way.

Shame that those IL nephews and/or nieces have never ever done anything.

What does your DH think of all this, because it sounds like it really is quite an issue?

Op, I agree with you, YANBU at all in my opinion. You're not asking for them to attend everything, nor even something each and every year, but to occasionally go and see something - that's what families SHOULD be about. If not to see the performance, then to see their grandchildren/nieces/nephews doing something they are good at, enjoy doing, and most particularly, where they are given the opportunity to, well... shine, I guess.

But, sadly, your DH's family is clearly not that sort of family - take that as your cue as to how you interact with them, and how much effort you make for them. They can reap what they have bloody well sowed.

No nativity plays, No school concerts. No sports days. No prize giving. No nothing.

It's not that the OP's SIL's children don't do anything. It's that they don't do anything as interesting, beneficial and, let's face it, downright UCAS-point scoring as the OP's children's hobby.

No, SILs children have, up to now, never done anything. Oldest is 5, and in reception. She never went to pre-school, and does very little.

I have attended teddy bears picnics with all the children. I have also taken the oldest one to kiddy discos, and parks.

I was discussing the issue with my own mother, who is supportive and cannot understand why they don't want to watch the children.

Friday your attitude is quite grating now. My daughter is a performer, whether you agree with children on the stage or not is not the issue here. Yes, she will be having approx four afternoons out of school to do that. As she is advanced at school that is not an issue as far as I am concerned. Se will learn far more of use to her (as she wants a career out of this at the end of the day) than she will miss in our opinion. I am aware that she earns UCAS points for examinations. Having not been to UNI myself I do not fully understand how they work, no. That is not the point. The point is that taking exams ARE educational. As decreed by central government when we asked for clarification.

Yes friday's annoying me too.

I have a friend who's two children do this sort of thing. They appear in a local amateur panto every Christmas, and everyone who knows them is expected to attend, tickets set aside for us etc.

I can say for a fact that everyone sees going and having to sit through two hours of drivel a chore. We know they work hard, but it's always crap. Panto is for kids, and as an adult I find it tedious anyway but when it's a shoddy and badly acted as this one is it's even worse.

Friend is obviously living her dreams through her kids, I'm not saying you are OP, but I think a lot of stage mums do.

As decreed by central government when we asked for clarification.

UCAS isn't central government, or indeed any sort of government: it's a private company, funded mostly by the fees paid by students who apply, with a small amount coming from the universities themselves.

Any awarding body can apply to UCAS to have their qualification given a tariff, and it's usually done simply on how long it takes to achieve for the average candidate.

Some really weird qualifications are in the UCAS tariff tables mostly because their awarding bodies want the kudos of being there. No-one seriously believes that a Pass in the British Horse Society Horse Knowledge and Care Level 3 plus a Pass in the Higher Level Sports Leadership certificate plus a Grade E in the CACHE Certificate of Childcare is equivalent to grade B at A Level, or anything remotely like it. That a qualification is in UCAS tariff tables says nothing beyond the fact that the awarding body put it up for accreditation. It is absolutely not evidence of educational worth.

The tariff system is being progressively withdrawn for anything that isn't in the Qualifications and Credit Framework, and I would predict that music, dance and indeed horse riding qualifications will disappear from the system completely by the 2015 or 2017 admission cycles.

At the moment, no university will accept anything off the tariff tables other than A Levels, IB, BTEC nationals and Cambridge Pre-Us other than in the most obscure of edge cases.

Thank you for clarifying that.

However, for a student/child who knows they want a career in dance, as a performer or a teacher, or a choreographer or anything else, dance exams ARE educational.

Central government recognises this (with or without the UCAS points!) and informed us that they should be marked as education off site. Our EWO disagreed. She has had to back down though.

If you are just doing all this extra curricular stuff for your children's future UCAS tariff, why do you want the rest of your family to sit through some tedious panto?

Until I had DD wild horses wouldn't drag me to a panto. I started taking DD to pantomimes only because she loved them. I don't think I would go to any other pantomime though. Also, you have four children. That is a lot of shows for them to sit through. And if they aren't interested in the first place then they aren't going to sit through four different sets of shows each time. It is a big ask financially and a big ask of their time.

I also think that most of these things aren't that interesting unless you are the actual parent of the performing child.

I think that you are selfish to want SIL to go to the panto that your child is in, rather than the one she wants to.

Your husband was probably quite hurt to hear you moaning about his sister for such a thing.

Yes, but SiL got do-nothing duds rather than future stars for children, so you think she'd exert herself a bit.

Does your DHs family have a tradition of going to other relatives' things? Some families just dont do it, so don't really see the need. If they think it's going to be dire because it's got children in it, then I don't blame them for staying away. They might just really like the celeb in the panto a bit further away. And you said yourself that pantos cost money to attend. I wouldn't expect an aunty to go see a niece in a panto, but if Grandparents lived in the area I would.

YANBU about the general favouritism, and you are certainly not selfish for wanting wider family to support your children.

when I was a kid I did the dance thing at the theatre a few years.The children just did 2 lots of 2 minute dance in a 3 hour show.Blink and you missed them.To be fair I think they only include them because they expect their whole extended family to come.You multiply the number of children in the troup by no of teams by all their family and friends and you have sold thousands of pounds worth of tickets before you start!

I am quite surprised that the general consensus on this thread is that "wild horses wouldn't make me go to a panto". Panto is big business, and a fabulous way of introducing young children to the theatre.

I think a lot of people have clearly seen some awful ones. The one my dd is a proper pantomime. Over 100 children auditioned for the 22 (2 teams of 11) places as a junior dancer. It's a fiercely contended audition (also a learning curve for children who genuinely want to have a career on the stage). It is not a "pay for your child to be on stage for two seconds" affair, its a proper production.

I also think some of you are misunderstanding. I don't expect anyone to fork out £22 a ticket, for four dofferent shows every year. Its one show. As I have said, I accept that perhaps I am asking too much over this issue.

I may be wrong but I don't remember my grandparents and aunties/uncles coming to see me and my brother in every pantomime, Christmas play, sports day etc. Regardless of whether its a professional thing or not I don't get the expectation that they should. My DS's grandparents live 100+ away so they won't ever see him in a play unless its planned out.

Panto is big business and a fabulous way of introducing young children to the theatre.

Business being the operative word.

Friday what's the matter with that? Theatre and Film in general is big business, I doubt anybody believes otherwise.

intitgrand totally understand that. I have family who live far away (which is why my family, apart from my mum, don't watch) but Dh's family live in the same road as us.

And I don't expect them to go to EVERYTHING. Believe me, the amount dd does, even WE don't watch everything!

I don't blame you for being disappointed and it's not like you're holding a gun to their heads to force them to go to every little thing. I think I'd be a bit miffed if my children were in 2 separate pantomimes and my SIL chose to take her kids to another one further away, especially when they live so close by.

It sounds like it's the general lack of involvement and interest on the part of ILs that's bothering you rather than just this one incident though. That and it's not really up to your DH what you discuss with your mum.

"I have attended teddy bears picnics with all the children. I have also taken the oldest one to kiddy discos, and parks"

If you genuinely think there is a disparity in the interest shown by your PILs (and you and your DH) towards your SILs DCs and the interest shown by your PILs (and your SIL and her DH) towards your DCs, then perhaps your DH could have a word with his parents and sister about it.

Would you be okay with the situation, as long as your ILs were involved with your children in other ways? If so, perhaps your DH could explain to all the ILs that you are really not bothered about them watching the 'performing' stuff (such as the professional panto stuff), as long as they become more involved with your children in ordinary family ways (the picnics and kiddy disco stuff). Would that be okay for you?

The reason I ask Sparklymommy, is I've been looking back over this thread and - while I totally understand that you are rightly proud of your children and love to see them progress in their chosen activities - you do come across (to me) as a bit precious, a pushy 'performing' mummy. I'm sure you don't mean to present yourself in that way, but I notice in your OP you said that your DH "shouted at me that I was being selfish", which makes me wonder if you are perhaps coming across that way with his family.

At the risk of being flamed, I wonder if the size of your family is a bit overwhelming for your in laws?