Men looking at my 13year old daughter

[marmitenot]

I went out with my 13 yr old dd yesterday and a couple of her friends. My daughter, although very pretty (doesn't get it from me!), is clearly a young teen and yet men (old and young) were leering over her and distinctly 'checking her out'.

The looks they were giving my daughter made me extremely uncomfortable and really cross.

AIBU to expect men to control themselves around children?

I just asked teen dd if she ever experienced this and she just said 'yea but I usually just say look at the pervert in a really loud voice so all my friends turn and gawk at him'.

That girls going places lol.

Very good point slipper.

I had this alot betwewn the ages of 11-15.
I was very tall....but not at all developed. I had no boobs
And was very obviously young. It really distured my mum as it was all the time.
This is by no means meant to sound big headed......im just sharing my experience. It happened most between 11-13 and after that I began to look older for my age so marginally more acveptable. By 14 I could easily get into clubs etc so I guess I looked old enough to be chatted up. Plus if you are in a club for over 18's etc then I think everyone takes it as a given that you are rhat age or older.

It was disturbing when I was young though. Especially when I was in my school uniform. Leering is the right word. Its horrid and I know id hate to be in the mothers position.

No bloke would nudge his mates and blatantly perv at a pre-pubescent child. They mustve been looking over innocently.

It cant be BOTH - she cant look like a pre-pubescent child AND have blokes openly slobbering over her regularly.. I just don't believe it. The VAST majority of men don't have any interest in children. Those who do are likely to go out of their way to hide it.

So none of the stories told on this thread seem true to you? You seem...inexperienced.
I can add mine - being 11 or 12 and having some sleaze pinch me on the arse when I was getting off a tram. Ugh.
There's a really big gulf between just looking and leering. I think some posters are being disingenuous to deny this.

Quite, Freudian. That's why I applied my comment to any gender.

It makes me cringe if I see a group of mature women embarrassing a young lad as well.

Eeew, not the 'Poor men, they can't help it, they are slaves to their DNA' bullshit.

I'm old enough now that I see 12 and 13 year old daughters of my friends getting openly leered at and cat called when we go out, and if they are in school uniform so much the better. It's sickening when it becomes so obvious just how many men would entertain thoughts of paedophilia, if not actually carry them out.

It makes me glad I have a son. I don't understand how some mothers of daughters brush it off and call the OP precious. Maybe it's a denial thing?

No, fish, I don't believe it at all. It might happen very occasionally, but most men fancy girls/women who are fertile. OP says her daughter looks pre-pubescent. Therefore she wont have breasts/hips like a woman, but rather the figure of an young boy. Which is unattractive to all but genuine paedos.

Gatorade I have found that some mothers I know are proud that their daughters are considered attractive and can be oddly pleased that they receive this kind of attention.

I was with my 15 year old ds in a shop recently when a shop assistant, woman in her 30s was obviously flirting with him. He found it a pretty uncomfortable experience, and so did I.

It's baffling how women spend so much of the time defending male bad behaviour.

Because some women base their daughters worth on how attractive they are.

Ugly trait.

elskovs - So what I'm a liar? Don't know the difference between a glance and a leer? I'll be 50 soon - I know when my dd is being stared at in a sexual manner I am not a fool!

OP said her dd looks like a teen - not pre-pubescent - my dd has a gorgeous developing body but is still quite clearly a child - but as I said up thread - they are not looking at her face!!

I verbally assalted 2 blokes in the Apple shop in Brum city centre. they had closed around my 13 year old dd and were obviously making her uncomfortable. they obviously thought she was alone.

cue 5 foot tall woman literally spitting with rage and ask

Ducktowater, I understand the impulse to try to be non gender specific but the reality is that this situation is ineradicably gendered. That's the point of why the OP and others are so uneasy.

A group of middle-aged women embarrassing a young lad might be inappropriate, intrusive and silly. But the young lad will not experience this as part of a continuum of sexual intimidation, which he is expected to put up with in a variety of situations, which he is covertly and overtly told to expect and "suck it up" because it's "natural"; he won't be surrounded by news stories of young lads found murdered or gang-raped by predatory middle-aged women; his heart won't beat fast in terror at 5pm in the twilight walking home from school if he hears the patter of some Per Una court shoes behind him in a deserted street. He won't be told to carry a pepper spray when out and about in case Sandra Bloggs down the road is a covert paedophile, not to get in a minicab in case Mrs Smith drives him off and assaults him; or warned never to let his drink out of his sight on a night out in case a burly middle-aged woman takes a fancy to drugging him with Rohypnol.

Would those who think men leering at very young girls is natural be as okay with young sons of the same age being leered at by older gay men?

She said "my daughter has not hit puberty and looks like a child"

If even one bloke found her sexually attractive Id be surprised... but lots and lots?? No way.

posted too soon!!

asking them what the actual fuck they were doing talking to my child.

they left very quickly but dd was mortified.

still I felt bloody good. I wanted to kill the bastards.

totally understand op. these guys were at least 28/30.

Elskov - You think the OP is lying??

I always remember meeting this very beautiful 11 year old girl. She was stunning. And men used to leer at her pretty constantly. She was obviously a child.

This thread really appalls me.
I feel so worried about the future for my children when there are so many people so investedly denying girls' reality.
I had it (I remember it); I see it happening to other girls now. I can't imagine why women are so keen to deny it. Whose interests in this in?

I'm really not sure what point I am trying to make, but several of the posts so far have seemed a little odd to me.

I think anyone who has travelled to a different culture can agree that this is not a habit unique to UK males (whatever that means).

Indeed, I have worked and lived in 7 countries in 3 different continents over the last 30 years and have seen behaviour similar to that described by the OP in every country. It happens all over the world, often to a much worse degree than the UK

So what is to be done? Who is to blame? What is the ideal society that we ought to be striving for? Should we all be striving for the same society?

Could it honestly be a primitive urge that cannot truly be supressed?

My, you've led a sheltered life elskovs. Do you think we're ALL lying?

The OP may have meant she hasn't started her periods yet or developed very visible breasts- however, the changes such as hips developing can happen really early, my dd is only 9 but looks early teens from the back for this reason and is nearly my height.

To see whether an early teen is really an early teen or has breasts, they have to check her out. This is culturally sanctioned as normal man behaviour (as many of the posters on this thread have said). They may then decide she's too young, not developed, but the checking out and nudging or whatever has still taken place.

Men also leer at not very attractive women, it's not always about how appropriate it is or how sexually old the woman is- if they look somewhat non-childlike, they can then be a target for this. How strange to deny the OP's own experience and the experience of the many women on the thread who remember being leered at or their bottom pinched when they were still not fully developed (as indeed happened to me).

I think you are mistaken. Do you really believe that you meet multiple men with paedophile tendencies every time you go out? That's what you are saying.

This site is notorious for this rubbish

Indeed, I have worked and lived in 7 countries in 3 different continents over the last 30 years and have seen behaviour similar to that described by the OP in every country. It happens all over the world, often to a much worse degree than the UK I've just said it happens much less in my husband's culture (Eastern European), it also happens less in some Nordic countries I've visited. That's not to say women aren't found attractive or paid attention, they are, but they are not subject to the rude public culture of ogling and calling out as in the UK. There are worse societies as well.

And it also differs even in the UK- walk round a small village in many 'naice' areas and you don't get this- walk around some of the rougher parts of London and it seems almost endless. Men outside pubs standing around, saying rude things openly about the women that pass, shouting out when you are going for a jog, giving women marks out of ten etc.