To be outraged by children's centre

[quertas]

I've just received a letter from my local children's centre congratulating me in the birth of my baby (well he was born 3 months ago so thanks but the moment for congrats has rather passed) and stating that 'an appointment has been made' for next tues (letter arrived today) for someone to come and visit me at home to tell me about the services at the children's centre. Aibu to see this as a bloody liberty and to wonder where the actual fuck this person gets off inviting herself into my home?

hetienne so you are explicitly saying that the aim of the CC worker in coming around is to assess the situation of the family (even though other services will already have done this) with the intention of finding out about past medical & social history?

That is not what people upthread have been saying and if that is what they are doing people should be told.

You don't see why someone might disclose insecurities to someone who is not perceived to have power? Really?! It's well acknowledged that the power imbalance between social workers and service users is a reason why many service users feel disempowered and thus, less likely to engage.

Generally GPs etc aren't calling children's centres and giving them the full background details of everyone who lives nearby

Often social workers will refer families to children's centres, but many families in those situations mentioned don't currently have a social worker. I think you imagine all these services are a lot more joined up than they actually are.

And actually, yes - all those examples are things that have come up recently in home visits I have done. Lots of families/mothers are desperate for someone to come and listen and help. Someone might for example call to enquire about free nursery for 2 year olds, and then everything else comes out at a home visit - I imagine the point of making these new baby appointments is to provide the same opportunity.

Not sure what you mean by "aren't the front line" really.

NiceTabard - the intention of the CC worker coming round (I imagine) is to see what the family's needs are, and what needs the CC can meet. That's the whole point of Children's Centres

Well said hetienne. A voice of reason in all the hysteria

The midwife & HV surely are the front line in referring. Not SW - most families don't have SW. All women see MW & HV when they are pregnant / having a child.

You are really contradicting yourself about who is doing what and why. You say there are lots of free services and the person is coming around to talk about that - but then that actually the free services are for vulnerable families and so actually they won't be talking about that unless they deem the family to be vulnerable when they come and see them. You say that most of these services are via referral and then say that they aren't.

All I know is that new parents already have plenty of contact if they need it.

if they are hiding something / refusing contact then the fact it is someone from CC rather than a midwife isn't going to make a blind bit of difference.

Also interesting that all the people pointing out that there are women with post natal mental health issues who would be utterly stressed by this are dismissed.

There needs to be a balance here.

I am really glad that the CC round here didn't do this when I had my children.

Oh sorry I didn't realise it was your job.

That makes more sense.

Often, HVs and SWs will refer people to Children's Centres.

I assume this CC is doing these home visits so they don't miss anyone who needs their services who hasn't been picked up by health services/doesn't have a social worker.

In some cases, meeting the outreach/family support workers and having a name/face might mean that if someone is later affected by depression, DV, gets into debt, needs benefits advice, they feel more confident about contacting the centre and asking for help.

Surely it is better to extend the offer, than invite yourself into the home of someone who might be vulnerable and freak out about it, when chances are all that's going to be said is it's X pounds for baby massage on a tuesday.

If people aren't opening up to HV & midwives & GPs and SW (if they have one) then that needs addressing. Not just sending more and more people into the homes of women who are at their most vulnerable which is potentially very stressful for the woman and will result in her pulling back from all such people.

Where is the balance in this. Having at least 3 different sets of people in your home after you have had a baby and are maybe feeling unwell is stressful and difficult for many women.

Is it really such an imposition to just phone and say "no thank you" to something that bothers you?

It might be taken as the authorities as a "lack of engagement" and thus raise a red flag.

Many women with PND type issues have these fears.
Women on this thread have said that they had those fears.
Someone on this thread said that not "engaging" with the CC should be seen as a cause for concern. So maybe those fears aren't unfounded?

You need balance, to pick up the vulnerable who need a certain type of help, and yet not pressurise women who are vulnerable in a different way. And still identify children at risk. It's a huge, complicated and difficult task. With all of the recent tragedies we got "lessons learned" "not sharing info" etc and clearly the system is not working. The answer is not just to send more and more people into the homes of everyone.

You are really contradicting yourself about who is doing what and why. You say there are lots of free services and the person is coming around to talk about that - but then that actually the free services are for vulnerable families and so actually they won't be talking about that unless they deem the family to be vulnerable when they come and see them. You say that most of these services are via referral and then say that they aren't.

I'm sorry if my posts were confusing. I don't know how this particular CC organise their services, but I don't believe that most of their services are yoga and massage courses that have to be paid for - they wouldn't be allowed to operate like that. I'm not sure where I have said their services aren't by referral - the chances are that if they are only advertising paid for services, then the other things they do will be by referral (eg. families are referred by a family worker to something that is relevant to them). The CC worker will be coming round to introduce themselves/the centre, and I would imagine to make an initial assessment of the family's needs and to signpost them to any relevant services. If the OP has no issues at all, it might just be a case of leaving a leaflet and letting her know when the baby weighing clinic is. If it turns out she has poor English, her husband's just been deported and she also has a 2 year old it might be a case of letting her know about ESOL classes, a support group, and giving her details of free nursery places (or arranging another visit with an interpreter).

I suspect the CC has gone for this approach as it has a better take up rate than offering visits (fewer people opt out) but as I said I don't know of any CCs in my city that do it this way.

Still better to offer than tell IMO. For the reasons many people have given.

What you say there sounds quite sensible though. In this area there is very little support available even for people who ask for it.

Social services will not be knocking on your door because you don't want to go to your local CC unless there are other major issues going on. There are no 'red flags' which incidentally is one of the most overused terms on MN.

Women with post natal mental health issues are not always entirely rational when it comes to concerns about "the authorities" and SS, unsurprisingly.

I mean you could say to them "Look don't be silly, saying NO to the CC won't trigger anything, you're being mad" but that would be unhelpful and anyway how do you know which women to say it to.

Hetienne. Your last 2 posts are spot on

My friend manages a CC and there's a massive push (driven by Ofsted) to increase 'reach' and 'uptake'. I imagine that this CC is under the same pressure and is giving this strategy a go.

You can just say no thanks, OP.

I received the appointment letter when I had DS2, I already had a 4 & 3 year old then too. I have Bipolar and I am quite ill with it. I had been off meds for the pregnancy and was very very low. I totally understood why they would probably want to contact someone like me.

I still don't want to know about their services though. I have enough to do trying to keep my head above water so my DC don't notice that mommy is mental without having to go to baby aerobics or whatever was on. My DH called, because I don't use phones at all, to cancel the appointment - they were very shirty with him when he said I wouldn't come to the phone. The were shirty with him when he offered to go there with the DC to collect the info...

They turned up unannounced anyway when I was home alone and came in and talked to me about their services - there classes etc. I tried to explain that I couldn't get there, its not far, just too far to walk, about 10 mins on the bus, even if it was next door I couldn't go though. I have never taken my DC anywhere without my DH - ever - eldest now 6yrs. It didn't matter how fantastic the activities, how cheap or free even - I couldn't go.

They didn't understand this - they then started going on about domestic abuse ffs. To say I was pissed off was an understatement. They knew all about my medical conditions all there in black and white but clearly had no fuckin understanding of how it can effect someone. It was totally pointless - unless the point was to send me into a serious spiral of paranoia and depression??

I am already dreading the repeat as I am due next spring with DC4...

Whatever the reasons behind it I think it's bloody rude. I would take enormous pleasure in answering the door and saying 'I'm afraid this is not convenient for me and I'm sure you understand that with a new baby, cancelling appointments I didn't make isn't high on my list of priorities. Thanks for letting me know the service is there. If I decide to pop in some time it will be lovely to chat then.'
Jeez, this sort of thing annoys me so much. I had a health visitor 'just turn up' before my DD was even born. Wouldn't have minded but she knew the answer to precisely none of the questions I asked her. I'm sure they just do these visits for the free tea and biscuits.

Babydubs I am sorry that happened.

I am better now but had a similar experience. I couldn't leave the house except for things that I absolutely had to do. Which was taking DD1 to nursery and back and that was it. DH did everything else and hold down a full time job. It must have made you very angry to have that accusation about your partner.

1 in 10 women suffer MH problems around pregnancy / after birth and many have pre-existing conditions. Of those, plenty are going to be upset rather than helped by having all these people coming into their homes / stressed at having to deal with cancellations and so on.

There really needs to be balance.

I am involved with the management of a Children's Centre. They are having to do a lot of form filling to justify their existence at the moment, and quantify uptake and so on in a particular way. I imagine this visit is rooted in that. So yes, in a way it is bums on seats.

OP, I do understand about the 'automatic' appointments as they irritate me too. But you do have the option of confiding in them and opening the door to a lot of services and support that are not advertised, if you feel you want to. If not, just say that you don't need a visit and that you will ring them if you need anything.

You are the front line, my lovely, because you are unhappy. xx

And congrats as well babydubs!

Trouble is Boffin that even if you do ring - they still come! even when you say you are not interested - they want to know why! when you explain why, they are not actually qualified or experienced to understand some of the complex answers given resulting in all kinds of deeply offensive conclusions being made.

In my experience its not as simple as saying no thank you.

In that case something along the lines of being out of the country for the next few months will surely suffice?