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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To refer to a black man as a black man

574 replies

ShakeRattleNRoll · 03/10/2013 23:55

The other day i was talking about this black man who lives down the road to a neighbour and she said it was politically incorrect of me to say 'you know that black man who lives there' after I had said it.I thought well i never.What's wrong with calling him a black man when he is a black man? How should have I described him? TYIA

OP posts:
digerd · 04/10/2013 20:39

I was told by an asian lady that in their culture the lighter the skin the more class you had and was desirable. Reason, those with darker skins worked outdoors and were usually 'peasants'. She was from Pakistan.

Bogeyface · 04/10/2013 20:45

Digerd

That used to be (historically) the case in the UK and northern Europe too. Thats why so many women poisoned their skins with lead in order to appear whiter, because only outdoor workers (ie, the poor) had sun tans. I saw a programme recently about skin whitening products aimed at the Asian market and how dangerous they are :(

Donkeyok · 04/10/2013 20:48

Yes think Michael Jackson and Elizabeth 1st lead white skin paint. Sugarhut spoke earlier of the fake bake white skins are using now.

2tiredtocare · 04/10/2013 20:50

I can't rtft but how come you gave him a present but don't know his name? As in ' I gave a gift to Andy at number 23'

justanuthermanicmumsday · 04/10/2013 20:52

Depends on the context since you were trying to help her pinpoint the guy you were speaking about I don't see the issue. But if you knew his door number, or kids or something else about him I.e profession that plumber guy down the road.

I liked that poster who said say the door number. I was mocking my nephew not long ago because he said mum do you know that lady at number 22 . we all immediately said that's such a brummy Asian thing to do, but apparently not. Loool it's better than saying black white or brown though :)

Ps I think coloured sounds really bad but that's just my view. As does a few other words that describe Asians but u didn't raise that so I won't delve into it.

Donkeyok · 04/10/2013 20:53

It was only a collectors motorcycle badge and he is into bikes. Seem friendly and neighbourly.

MistressDeeCee · 04/10/2013 21:45

2tiredtocare based on your comment I went back and took a look at OPs comment, and found it in all its glory. Thanks

well i couldn't guess what he was wearing because I hadn't seen him and i didn't know the number to the house and i don't think he's a fireman but he's most probably hung like one judging by his size

Now - that could have been a comment made by the OP that got some people's backs up, because now it has mine. I bet that neighbour pulls you up OP, because you normally talk gutter stereotypical shit like that. You just couldnt talk about a black man without mentioning the (possible) size of his cock, could you?

This is what causes threads like this to go haywire, when a discussion could be had about race and perhaps let those who are interested in understanding, why offence is taken/how not to cause offence. Im not of the mind that most people here ARE out to cause offence actually. But the OP is - I havent seen anybody else make such a crass comment. Not having read from the very beginning (I have now) I hadnt seen it, but given that its there Id say that should have gone some way to letting people understand why we get fed up with 'casual' racist stereotyping. No wonder the thread changed tack. OP went from he's a mate she's giving a present, to speculating about him being 'hung like a fireman'...yaaaaawn @ the usual nonsense, glibly overlooked.

Donkeyok · 04/10/2013 21:55

Holy Moley mistress your right - slipped by. Now was that a Freudian slip

YellowDinosaur · 04/10/2013 21:57

MistressDeeCee i'm sorry but you're seeing something that isn't there.

well i couldn't guess what he was wearing because I hadn't seen him and i didn't know the number to the house and i don't think he's a fireman but he's most probably hung like one judging by his size

She is saying she doesn't think he's hung like a fireman NOT like a black man.

Admittedly I haven't been back to find the post this extract was taken from and am relying on what you have copied, but she's not mentioning his colour here AT ALL.

Now your background and experience of insidious racism is possibly what us making you read it like this just as my white middle class background (albeit with an adopted brother who is black) is making me take it at face value.

But I personally find the insistence in finding racist overtones in statements that are clearly not racist just as bad as the subtle racism in comments like 'the back man on the bus' where his race is irrelevant.

YellowDinosaur · 04/10/2013 21:58

From memory the paragraph you quoted about being hung like a fireman was when the op was explaining that she didn't know anything else about the neighbour in question to use in her description to identify him to the other neighbour, hence using black as her descriptor

Mimishimi · 04/10/2013 22:01

In my neighbourhood, we would definitely say 'that white bloke/girl' if we were referring to someone white as they are few and far between. However, I think the subsequent comment about the probable size of his crown jewels is just very odd and probably does mean you are being derogatory.

YellowDinosaur · 04/10/2013 22:09

Just been back to check that post as it was playing on my mind. The context is as I'd remembered - she is responding to posters who are asking why she couldn't have found anything else to describe him. The fireman bit is in response to someone's post saying couldn't she have said the fireman (or whatever) at number X. She doesn't mention his colour in the post.

Context being everything and all that....

printmeanicephoto · 04/10/2013 22:19

Stupid pc rubbish.

When I worked for a Council I heard a rumour that we couldn't say "can I have a black coffee? Don't know if it was true. If it was then it's pathetic pc bcks.

If he's black call him black.

MrsDeVere · 04/10/2013 22:21

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AmberLeaf · 04/10/2013 22:31

Yep, all the baa baa black sheep being banned was a lie, much like the black coffee one.

MistressDeeCee · 04/10/2013 22:36

Its a black man & she's mentioned how big his cock (probably) is. Anyone who is pretending they havent heard the ongoing stereotype about that when referring to black men is being deliberately obtuse.

For the record, Ive not come across a black person who minds being called black. What we DO mind is people who assume they know better than us what we be called (its not black people who invented the pc rubbish) - & those who will hurriedly explain away any stereotype, if its mentioned 10 ways are found to 'prove' it doesnt exist. Yes, the black man with a big dick stereotype does exist - white people named it Mandingo Syndrome at one time, didnt they? Big 'joke'. Easy enough to look it up

curlew · 04/10/2013 22:37

You know, I have never heard of anything that somebody feels they can't say because of "political correctness" that isn't racist, sexist or homophobic. Or disablist.

It's fine to identify someone by the colour of their skin, if it's relevant, and if there isn't any other way of identifying them. It's always better no to use physical characteristics to describe someone if you can avoid it. If you're taking about a particular person, and you wouldn't mention their skin colour if they were white, it's not OK to mention their skin colour if they are black. So "Please could you take this down to the finance office and give it to Steve, please? His desk is the one on the left- he's the black guy" is fine. "I was taking to a black bus driver today and h said the Number 32' not going to run on Sundays any more" not OK. Oh, and it's not fine to make assumptions about the size of a men's cock based on the colour of his skin.

Nobody ever banned black coffee. Or white or black boards or baa abaa black sheep. Or Christmas.

MistressDeeCee · 04/10/2013 22:40

& YellowDinosaur dont tell me Im seeing something thats not there - the OP is talking about a black man - even if not in that sentence - & she is mentioning him in context with a particular stereotype that often comes when talking about a black man. Or perhaps he was a white fireman & Ive somehow missed the point. Having heard the stereotype probably a million times, please do excuse me if I see it in a post discussing a black man, then his size, and find it offensive. Context? The context is the original post.

Sindarella · 04/10/2013 22:47

Hes lived there for twenty years, you had given him a gift. Surely then, you know his name? Like, you know dave from over the road?

Kendodd · 04/10/2013 23:35

Oh dear, I'm really going to get flamed but, I always thought black men did have big dicks. Mentioning it in the context the OP did is offensive though, I mean you just don't refer to peoples genitalia.

I have had two black boyfriends, they both had big dicks, race comes with certain physical characteristics, I thought a big dick was just one of them?

AmberLeaf · 04/10/2013 23:39

Jesus Christ.

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 04/10/2013 23:47

I can see loads of big dicks on this thread.

Kendodd · 04/10/2013 23:50

Oh dear, I've really embarrassed myself thinking aloud Blush

unlucky83 · 05/10/2013 00:43

married - white people get Lupus too!! ....and have done for centuries
Name actually comes from Latin - in medieval times - when the butterfly rash some people with lupus get made them look like a wolf...or some people say it looked like a wolf bite...It is more prevalent in women and in Afro-Caribbean and Asian women (1 in 250) vs Caucasians (1 in 750)...
And it is still little understood and difficult to diagnose/test for...

digerd · 05/10/2013 08:12

I cringe every time I hear the term "white person". I am not white. Only dead people are white. I prefer the american term 'caucasion', despite it being a mouthful.
Nothing to do with the colour of skin, but when I was in Germany one of my DH's many BsIL said " English women are good for only one thing, and that's in bed, nothing else Shock"