To find it amusing how women that are obsessed with how they look and are in love with themselves...

[Nonalphamum]

.......are often perceived by others to be 'very beautiful' when often they are not.

I am thinking of two examples really; the first is a mum from my DCs school. Early forties and totally obsessed with the way she looks and constantly putting 'selfies' on Facebook of herself posing. she is average looking but I know lots of women that are far prettier and more natural. Yet because she thinks she is gorgeous everyone queues up to tell her how gorgeous she is and lots of mums at the school seem to be taken in by it too 'X's mum is so beautiful'. I think they are taken in by it as she wears nice clothes, has hair extensions, fake tans, nail extensions etc.

The second is a woman I know from an online forum. Again average looking but totally in love with herself and absolutely covered in fake tan and make up, and posting constant selfies again on Facebook. She is known as the 'beautiful' one from the forum but in all honesty I think lots of other members are far prettier and more natural.

I know I'm going to be accused of being jealous, and I'm truly not. I just can't understand why people are taken in by that kind of person. It's like if a person loves themselves then everyone else assumes they must be beautiful. A bit like the Emperor's New Clothes scenario.

Ah ok, so I guess to you the very idea of posting pictures of yourself is beyond belief. So harder to put yourself in the shoes of someone who does, and I imagine it does feel like salt in the wound to see others claiming low self esteem when they might not actually suffer from it. If it's any consolation, probably some of them feel as bad as you do, they're just trying a different coping strategy.

I can see how it would feel like they had less of an issue. But I don't think it's any indication of how low they feel.

I don't know, I think some of the most attention-seeking behaviour can be among the most destructive and result from the most dire confidence problems. People who've been abused as children for example, and only know how to boost self-esteem through sex - that usually involves attention-seeking behaviour but no-one would deny they have a real self-esteem problem.

To me it is you see,it must be classified differently somewhere because one extreme wants attention,the other doesnt.Whats weird in my case is I know Im not hideous in my brain but I hate photos and id hate people to gawp

Surely if you truly believe you are ugly/plain/fat the last thing you do is seek validation? Validation of what, exactly? How would you feel if you didn't receive any comments along the lines of 'Guwjus Hon, U R stunning.' ?? Would you feel worse? Why risk it?

Think of it with a different issue.

Say you have two girls, both hate their bodies, want to punish themselves, both hate themselves and have low self esteem. One turns to anorexia, one turns to bulimia. Is the bulimic suffering less because she still uses food as a comfort?

I totally second that book "A Woman In Your Own Right" recommended by Zoe. It changed my life, at 16. I came from an abusive, misogynist household and could easily have ended up crippled by low self-esteem - it made me a feminist and gave me an understanding of myself and other people that has been useful ever since.

Do you feel equipped to be the judge of who else has a confidence problem? and do you understand the difference between ego and self-esteem? or that an introvert can be very secure?

Interestingly Limited, another way of inflating the sense of self temporarily is to put other people on the defensive where they have to defend something. The exchange is very draining for the person who is defending or justifying or exchanging but it has an energising effect for the challenger.

Drama-baiting can come across as aggressive but it's a sign of low self-esteem too, in the wardrobe with attention-seeking, drama-loving, approval-seeking...

subliminal As we are talking about the kind of girls who wear a lot of makeup there is validation to be had in that they've disguised themselves. Put on a mask as it were. They probably would feel worse if they got no compliments. Why risk it? Because the reward is high for them.

Ladybigotes, I wish I'd read it at 16!!

the whole fake tan false lashes and 'selfies' on face book tends to go hand in hand with lower socio economic status.
Presume the people fawning over her percieve themselves to be a bit lower than her in the pecking order...such that she is (to them)something to aspire to

Isnt it hard to work out who is doing it for attention and who isnt?how would one gather this?is it a persin who cant cope without make up ever?or cant go out as themselves as ill put it?

Sorry im not with you,what exchange?

See this is interesting,explain away im very open to listen x

Hard to know, think you'd have to get to know each person. It's horrible that so many people feel so much pressure related to how they look, society and the media accentuate it so much.

Of course the same applies to some men. ex

Lazysuz, that might well be true.

So how dya know if its fitting on or self confidence.?

It's not an easy one to distinguish. People are too complicated for that.

of course I have seen this sort of thing (or what looks like it) certain women get to 'hold court' and they become the nucleus of the in crowd.
Perhaps they are just able to catch the attention of a few key people and then everyone else follows suit?
It becomes a kind of heresy to not agree that 'x' is so beautiful/lovely/gorgeous

I think its easy to get caught up in a certain look and overdo that look and not feel "right" without it, when in fact less is often more. That might be the false hair, nails and eyelashes thing or it might be loads of eye makeup and so much hairspray the hair is without movement!

It is possible to get subtle hair extensions, with the aim of making your own hair look thicker so that it doesn't look fake, or to use one application of fake tan a week in winter to get a bit of a glow, or to get the shortest false eyelashes available to thicken up your own eyelashes.

I agree there are some people who think that the application of hair, eyelashes and false boobs somehow magically makes them join the beautiful club, but of course the face is still important...

I also agree that theres nothing worse than a woman who is quite plain who thinks and acts like a spoilt beautiful princess. Even in a spoilt beautiful princess that would be annoying enough...

I wasnt passing judgment I was just speculating about the processes underlying the erm..phenomena :o