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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

To want to know why rape is so common?

352 replies

AnneNonimous · 09/08/2013 15:00

And want to understand why it happens?

I have been raped twice, once as a 14 year old and once as a 20 year old. I'd say 99% of the women I know have been raped at some point in their lives too. Growing up I almost accepted it as some kind of right of passage. It was just something that happened to women.

I was discussing this with a good friend of mine recently. She has been raped before and said she thinks its something all men have in them. She revealed to me that her husband had told her when he stayed the night at a female friends house recently he had imagined raping her.

I don't believe her, or don't want to believe her at least. I must admit my faith in men is extremely sparse and my life experiences have probably left me bitter but I do have a dad and a brother and I wouldn't want to believe they could ever be capable of being a rapist. I am disturbed by what my friend has told me about her husband and have never liked him but also know there won't be much I could tell her to make her see this.

But the fact still remains that it's very very common. If not rape then some kind of sexual abuse/assault. Aibu to want to understand why this is?

OP posts:
bumbleymummy · 10/08/2013 10:59

I actually think prettykitty and Del boys are making some interesting points about the naming of the WBY campaign. Although I'm not sure this is the best place for it, given the content of the thread. Another thread about it might be a good idea.

fluffyraggies · 10/08/2013 10:59

I've been raped. I've never told a soul.

A few months ago i plucked up the courage to say i had been raped on a thread here on MN. I could only type one line.

The amount of posters who said simply 'i believe you' reduced me to tears. Of comfort.

That's what the bloody title means.

FGS.

grumpyoldbat · 10/08/2013 11:04

I feel some people have seriously misunderstood the we believe you campaign. It's about taking time to listen to the whole story rather than automatically assuming the woman must have asked for it. It's about considering all the facts about what happened before making a decision on what you believe happened yourself which is precisely what a juror should do HTH.

BTW I'm not anti men, just anti men who rape and sexually assault. Nothing against the rest of them. I'm also against women who make FALSE claims of rape.

What amazes me is people can read the comments on here and still wonder why victims keep their mouthes shut.

gordyslovesheep · 10/08/2013 11:09

I think it's a deliberate misunderstanding - and if those supporting the campaign are anti men does that make those opposing it pro rape?

I am guessing not but then I am a rational human being

flippinada · 10/08/2013 11:11

Can't we have, just once, a thread about rape which is simply supportive?

Wait, what am I saying? Of course not Sad Angry .

MNHQ
KateSMumsnet · 10/08/2013 11:13

@delboysfileofax

Fluffy- but it's nit about ending victim Blaming is it? I would be a huge supporter if it was. Indeed if that was the main thrust it would be called "end victim Blaming now" or some other suitable moniker. It's not though. it's about strongly believing whatever the complainant says.

The We Believe You campaign aims to, among other things, explode some pernicious myths about rape. A lot of the myths busted here show how misconceptions around rape often center around the victim and their actions.

delboysfileofax · 10/08/2013 11:21

And that's great, katemumsnet, and rape myths should be challenged I have no truck with that.

I can't speak for the other poster, but my issue with it is that I think its very dodgy ground and contrary to our whole judicial system to have a movement which states unequivocally that one side is always right. If people want to believe that, it's their lookout but in the interests of fairness that person should not be allowed to sit on the jury for those types of cases.

Tanith · 10/08/2013 11:21

The We Believe You campaign is designed to correct the automatic assumption that someone complaining of rape must be lying.

All other crimes are believed, are they not? Someone who has been robbed is believed, someone who has been assaulted is believed, someone whose car is stolen is believed. The campaign is about extending that automatic belief to rape and sexual assault.

Conviction of the perpetrator is something entirely different. We believe the elderly lady who has had her handbag snatched - convicting her accused assailant is for a court of law.

gordyslovesheep · 10/08/2013 11:23

exactly Tanith

PrettyKitty1986 · 10/08/2013 11:23

Annie - your non-replies are extremely pointless. Either reply like a normal adult or do what you are suggesting-ignore.

Get - I have no reason to clutch at straws. I am simply saying what I see.

flippinada · 10/08/2013 11:28

Yes, excellent posts Tanith and Annie.

GetStuffezd · 10/08/2013 11:32

So Pretty, are you still maintaining that a woman like myself; a rape victim and a supporter of the WBY campaign does not have the moral conscience, intelligence and personal integrity to sit on the jury of a rape trial and make my decision based SOLEY on the evidence presented?

Again, you have poor expectations of women.

delboysfileofax · 10/08/2013 11:37

Tanith, I would disagree with you wholly there, people who are robbed aren't always believed, people who have there car stolen aren't either.

CoalDustWoman · 10/08/2013 11:38

Victims in rape trials are witnesses. As they are testifying under oath, I would tend to believe them just as much as I would believe witnesses to any other crime. It's those on the jury who do not believe witnesses that I worry about. Or those who have a fuzzy concept of consent. Or those who think that men are entitled to sex with a woman because of x, y or z and think that an absence of "no" means that eerything's A-OK.

Still chuckling at those who are rape myth believers who say they don't know anyone who has been raped. As if anyone would tell you! Can't you see that?

MrsHoarder · 10/08/2013 11:41

Delboy the WBY is not a legal test. If an acquaintance told you their house had been robbed, I assume your first response would be to sympathise, maybe ask if their insurance company is being helpful etc. The WBY campaign is to encourage people to tell a woman who approaches them as a friend and tells them about a rape/sexual assault that you believe them and it wasn't their fault.

If a friend told me that their purse had been snatched I would sympathise, not ask if it had been a mix-up or any of the other things a jury may have to consider. Likewise if a friend tells me they have been raped, I will sympathise, including telling them that I believe what they are telling me. This doesn't mean that I wouldn't be able to consider a legal defence on a jury.

SirRaymondClench · 10/08/2013 11:45

I was raped when I was younger (in my 20s) was a 'date rape' type scenario although it didn't have a name like that at the time so I thought it was my fault.
Also was the 'potential' victim of an attempted rape, luckily he was so drunk he couldn't manage it and I managed to get away.
Maybe it was the situations I put myself in.
Or maybe it was them.
I never reported either because I don't think anyone would have believed me and with rape it seems it is the victim who has to prove themselves innocent and not the accused.

delboysfileofax · 10/08/2013 11:46

Fair enough MrsHoarder, I didn't look at it that way, and I think that (as you have described it) is positive. However I still think supporters of this movement wouldn't be objective if on a jury. On the thread ref the campaign there was a female convicted in court of lying about this and she got two years. Supporters were still falling over themselves to state they believed her

SirRaymondClench · 10/08/2013 11:51

Sorry can I just say I had only read the first page of the thread. The views I expressed in my above post were just how I felt about reporting it at the time.
I don't know what makes these men do this.
There seems to be a surge in my experience right now of hate towards women.
Only last night I reported a 'friend' on facebook for writing a post which I deemed full of hate where he said that basically Peter Sutcliffe had the right idea about women and that women should have their heads bashed in with a hammer. Facebook disagreed with me. That kind of says it all. This man has two children (one daughter) with his ex and he directs all his hatred towards her. Disgusting.

grumpyoldbat · 10/08/2013 12:13

delboy a woman who makes up a rape allegation is scum. The existence of a woman like that does not justify the treatment that rape victims get when they speak out ie instantly jumped on as must have deserved it. To get TRUE justice both sides must be listened to and atm the victims often aren't. This is what the campaign is trying to address. This and trying to create an environment where victims can feel safe to speak up and get adequate support to recover in some way from what happened to them. I think this thread just proves that victims are still correct in assuming the best policy is to keep their mouth shut and suffer in silence.

I'd be much more worried about a juror who blindly bought into rape myths tbh. I still maintain that a fair trial requires all testemonies to be actually listened to, listened to and not just heard and tbh the campaign actually encourages this IMO.

Loa · 10/08/2013 12:26

I would be surprised to hear that any woman over 30 has not been at least sexually assaulted in her life.

I would have said I haven't but having read more I think it depends on what you mean.

I've had my breast and arse touched when I haven't wanted. I've certainly had fair few leers and nasty comments made throughout my life - I have large breasts. I don't think it was acceptable behavior but didn't feel unsafe.

Worse place for this Secondary school - never on the bus to and from but actually on the school site often with adults round - who would tell me off if I made a fuss.

As a young adult - after being very over protected as a teenager so not being street wise- especially at University and first few years working I did put myself in potentially dangerous situations though I often didn't realize this till later- drinking in mixed or men only groups, being in houses and cars alone with men and groups of men I didn't know all that well often drinking and I was never treated with anything less than total respect.

In fact only felt unsafe with a few lone taxi journeys but made dam sure they knew I was expected at other end and they knew I was on my way and it was never touching more what was said.

Dackyduddles · 10/08/2013 12:55

I am fully capable thank you Delboy of supporting a campaign such as WBY and sitting on a jury.

You are conveniently avoiding the subtly of such a campaign and painting it black and white (excuse a mild pun based on discussions) only. SA /rape is not a clear cut issue. Neither is racism. I can believe in that too and still sit on a trial concerning that. This is because I'm a functioning intelligent adult, like most people are.

LurcioLovesFrankie · 10/08/2013 12:59

Sir Raymond - first, so sorry to hear about your experience Sad

The facebook thing is dreadful. Have you thought about phoning 101 and reporting it as a hate crime/ incitement to violence?

SirRaymondClench · 10/08/2013 14:21

Lurcio thank you xx

I have just deleted the vile beast and blocked him
It stuns me just where Facebook drawer the line really. It also sickened me how many of this idiot's friends (a couple of females as well) 'liked' his moronic rants and agreed with him. I suppose he can get away with it because he put 'lol' and 'Just joking!' after every poisonous comment.
I have seen this kind of bile before numerous times from him regarding his ex and women in general.

YoniMatopoeia · 10/08/2013 14:38

And even when women do go to the police sometimes they are not safe www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013/aug/09/police-169-staff-predatory-sexual-behaviour