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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

To want to know why rape is so common?

352 replies

AnneNonimous · 09/08/2013 15:00

And want to understand why it happens?

I have been raped twice, once as a 14 year old and once as a 20 year old. I'd say 99% of the women I know have been raped at some point in their lives too. Growing up I almost accepted it as some kind of right of passage. It was just something that happened to women.

I was discussing this with a good friend of mine recently. She has been raped before and said she thinks its something all men have in them. She revealed to me that her husband had told her when he stayed the night at a female friends house recently he had imagined raping her.

I don't believe her, or don't want to believe her at least. I must admit my faith in men is extremely sparse and my life experiences have probably left me bitter but I do have a dad and a brother and I wouldn't want to believe they could ever be capable of being a rapist. I am disturbed by what my friend has told me about her husband and have never liked him but also know there won't be much I could tell her to make her see this.

But the fact still remains that it's very very common. If not rape then some kind of sexual abuse/assault. Aibu to want to understand why this is?

OP posts:
PrettyKitty1986 · 10/08/2013 10:12

If you enter a courtroom as a Juror for any trial/crime and have a preconceived idea as to the guilt of the accused then you have no business being there.

How is that disputable? If people are confident that they would not have any preconceived feelings about the potential guilt of the accused then obviously it wouldn't be an issue.

fluffyraggies · 10/08/2013 10:13

And i say cowardly because it's like muttering your opinion into a room previously full of people who are now mostly gone.

delboysfileofax · 10/08/2013 10:15

How is it cowardly? The 'we believe you campaign' does exactly what it says on the tin and other posters have confirmed that. Surely the default position should be that we don't know what happened until we heard the evidence?
If supporters of the 'we believe you campaign' can't do that then they should not be allowed on a jury.

fluffyraggies · 10/08/2013 10:15

Pretty would you say that people who support the campaign against racism have no place on a jury either? Because they will automatically vote a black defendant as innocent?

fluffyraggies · 10/08/2013 10:17

Like i said it seems cowardly because it's a bit of an 'out there' thing to say at the END, more or less, of a long thread about rape. Not so many readers will get down this far. IMO.

Start your own thread and see what happens. I think you'll get more 'traffic'.

PrettyKitty1986 · 10/08/2013 10:20

If in their support of anti-racism it meant they categorically always assumed that a black person (for instance) was innocent purely because they were black...then I would say that they should not sit a trial where the accused was black.

GetStuffezd · 10/08/2013 10:23

On a thread where many women have disclosed the worst thing that's ever happened to them, and others have said they are lurking but are unable to write their experiences down, I find it sickening it's been derailed in such a way. There goes any support anyone may have been gleaning from hearing others' experiences.

Honestly, why not start a thread entitled "MNers who support the We Believe You campaign should not be on jury duty in rape trials." I'd love to see how it pans out. No, let's fuck up someone else's thread instead.

delboysfileofax · 10/08/2013 10:25

Well that's your opinion but I'm not going to create a new thread about it. To draw on your point made to another poster, if that anti racist campaigner had started a we believe you're innocent just because you're black campaign then no they shouldn't be on a jury either. Same as an EDL member shouldn't be allowed to sit on a case involving a Muslim. It's simple really and prejudiced people shouldn't be allowed to sit on a jury

AnnieLobeseder · 10/08/2013 10:26

That excludes 99% of the general public from rape trials then. Because they will all blame the victim.

PrettyKitty1986 · 10/08/2013 10:27

Considering this thread has also discussed conviction rates etc, the post in question is completely relevant.

IneedAsockamnesty · 10/08/2013 10:28

Nobody who sits on a jury has no preconceived thoughts, that's one of the whole points of using your peers.

And jumping on a thread like this and coming out with stuff like until we have heard the evidence implies that everybody on this thread who has spoken about there experience has either lied or should be ignored because you have not heard the evidence.

The we believe you stuff is about challenging rape myths removing victim blaming and saying to a person if you have had a sexual experience that you did not consent to then we believe you.

Nothing to do with jury's nothing to do with anything other than a sexual experience with no consent IS rape.

AnnieLobeseder · 10/08/2013 10:28

And the reason there are 12 people on a jury is to give a broad base of experience and opinion. Everyone has prejudices - it's an idiotic argument that a jury should be free of prejudice. So as I said, in a jury where 11 people are probably willing to believe the victim brought the crime on herself, I'm happy to be the one person challenging that.

gordyslovesheep · 10/08/2013 10:29

so if you believe women reporting rape you are anti men - in the same way an EDL member is anti Muslim?

I disagree with you - I am very fond of men and I believe women - on a jury I would listen to the facts and base my verdict on those

GetStuffezd · 10/08/2013 10:30

You have a poor opinion of other women, don't you? We Believe You is about giving women the strength to report their rape and speak out. You know, fear of not being believed being one of the MAIN reasons people don't report rape...
Do you Really and honestly think that all the supporters of WBY would immediately damn a man accused of rape? Really?? Totally disregarding evidence and testimony? Maybe you believe rape victims shouldn't be allowed to be on jury for a rape trial. Or victims of racist abuse shouldn't be able to sit on jury for a racist attack...

fluffyraggies · 10/08/2013 10:31

Oh good lord.

I cannot believe you are honestly saying that you think women are unable to differentiate between encouraging the end of the victim blaming that goes on in our society surrounding rape, and being on a jury.

And by the way you don't know the beliefs of the members of a jury unless they declare them. That's the idea of having 12.

delboysfileofax · 10/08/2013 10:37

Get- yes I do believe that, because that's exactly what it's supporters have signed up for. It's there in the title. We. Believe. YOU. How then can a supporter of this sit in a court and state that one could listen to the evidence and vote accordingly if that person has already signed up to the idea that the defendant is automatically guilty. It's great that the campaign challenges rape myths such as clothing etc, but the main thrust of it is that aggd is automatically telling the truth. If one wants to have that opinion, fine. But then they shouldn't be allowed to serve on a jury

delboysfileofax · 10/08/2013 10:38

Gordy- if you automatically believe the victim then yes, you are no different

GetStuffezd · 10/08/2013 10:40

You are judging others by your own standards.
I am behind the WBY 100% but my moral conscience would not let me convict ANY person of ANY crime if the evidence was not there and not robust enough to leave no reasonable doubt.
Says a lot about your low expectations of women, to be honest.

gordyslovesheep · 10/08/2013 10:41

you have totally misunderstood the campaign then Del - it's about supporting women so they report rape (most rapes are unreported) not about ignoring a fair trial

delboysfileofax · 10/08/2013 10:43

Fluffy- but it's nit about ending victim Blaming is it? I would be a huge supporter if it was. Indeed if that was the main thrust it would be called "end victim Blaming now" or some other suitable moniker. It's not though. it's about strongly believing whatever the complainant says.

PrettyKitty1986 · 10/08/2013 10:45

But that seems like a contradiction Get. If you believe the victim 100% of the time -are completely behind WBY (and I'm not staying you shouldn't or shouldn't be btw) - why would you need evidence ?

If you are that certain that the accused is in the right?

AnnieLobeseder · 10/08/2013 10:46

Seriously? You're getting pedantic about the name of the campaign on a thread where women are bearing their souls?

Folks, I would suggest turning our backs and ignoring this obvious troll/person of limited grasp of simple concepts/the most bloody-mindedly literal thinker ever.

GetStuffezd · 10/08/2013 10:49

You are grasping at straws, Kitty. It's extremely crass and offensive on this thread where people are disclosing their horrors.

AnnieLobeseder · 10/08/2013 10:52

baring, not bearing.

fluffyraggies · 10/08/2013 10:56

I think nit picking over the title of the campaign is a little juvenile. Sorry.

Surely - do you not accept that at the moment women are being given a raw deal when it comes to approaching the justice system for a fail trial? This campaign strives to change that.

I support the campaign and yet am perfectly capable of looking at an individual case. The campaign (for me) is about changing the way a woman is treated when she has been raped and approaches the authorities. Giving her the confidence to think that she will not automatically be treated as a liar.

Hence 'we believe you'. It's a SUPPORT network.

If the title were ''everyone sign up here if you think all men should be thrown in prison if a woman says they should'' then i wouldn't support it.

I imagine there will be a broad selection of women who support the campaign. They're not all going to be called up for jury duty at once. On a rape trial. I think men are quite safe from us Hmm

I think you are being small minded and obtuse to be honest.