Aibu to have bad vibes and avoid unsupervised, 5 year old neighbour

[jessieagain]

I am wondering if I'm being unreasonable about this and what you would do. We have recently moved into a new flat. Next to our flat is a playground.

I take my 2 year old there a couple of times a week.

I doesnt get used much as there is a big and much better playground in a park close by. Occasionally there are 1-2 children there with their parents, sometimes a couple of 4-10 years olds together or an older child 9+ by themself. My son is quite interested in playing with other people and usually runs up to them so we end up having a chat.

Twice however there has been a young girl about 5 who has been by herself, she has a bike with her that makes my son pretty excited about so he runs over to her.

The first time she was quite bossy to him about not touching her bike and was shouting no at him, so I distracted him and got him away to play on the swings. She followed us over and kept trying to talk to him and me, I tried to discourage her hanging around us by not really answering her questions andby talking to ds but she kept in trying to talk to us. I decided to leave the playground and take ds to the park so we could get away from her and she suddenly started whining and begging to come too. I said she couldn't as she needed her own parent to take her and she started shouting an crying saying that she wanted to come and it wasn't fair etc. I said goodbye, picked up ds and walked away quickly.

Yesterday we met her again at the playground and it started similarly with her saying ds couldn't touch her bike so I told ds we needed to go back to our flat (fortunately he had had enough of a play so didnt mind). I picked him up and started walking away. She started running towards us with her bike, shouting for us to not go and then she fell over on top of her bike and started crying as well. I was about 6 metres away from her by then, so called out that she was ok and should go home to her parents and kept walking away.

I was very uncomfortable about this whole situation, I think she is far too young to be by herself and her behaviour is too erratic and hysterical so I don't want her near me or ds. I get a really bad vibe around her and don't want to be around her again, but I feel bad about this as she is only a little girl. Aibu about this?

Or, indeed, what Jamie said.

Eyes- that may be true but now 100 people have advised her and she is still making excuses not to. she is no longer ignorant or un certain she has been educated here and decided to still take no notice?

Spotty, was that a serious post?

But she also said it was. Right next to the park. Like a communal garden. Obscured by trees and bushes? The bottom bit of my garden is obscured by a bush.

Cjel

I agree it is frustrating. She does sound very nervous and a bit freaked out so maybe a gentle approach will reach her.

Well, all she has to do is pop over to the playground next time the weather is reasonable and she can have another go. It's not as if incompetent and indifferent parents change overnight IRL.

It's not always about 'reporting', just getting some advice.

Yes. I am serious. The lady at the shop said she was going to call the police on me because I was neglecting DD and had a "cavalier" attitude to her safety because I allowed her to go for sweets by herself. I sometimes leave her in the car if I'm going into the same shop for a few bits. Her choice. She can come with me if she likes. I am generally quite careful but I had never considered that I was taking an unreasonable risk by letting her call for a friend. Am I? Would someone really phone SS if she fell over and I wasn't there? This is making me feel very anxious.

The problem is that there is a 5 year old who is willing to go with anyone - I would ask where her mum was and take her home - tell the mum that she was asking to leave with you and you are worried she will just go off with anyone. The mum then makes her decisions with knowledge of her daughter's behaviour (in that she is happy to go off with strangers).

Fair enough each parent makes their own decisions but surely you would only let a child be unsupervised if you know they are capable and will follow instructions such as not talking to or going off with strangers - abd

I take your point Spotty I did say upthread that playgrounds can be treated as communal gardens.

Presumably though your child is not following strangers home and crying so won't be reported!

And it is any parent's responsibility to ensure that their dc have the skills to play unsupervised.

Your daughter is 11 Spotty, however young she looks. It's not really the same, is it?

I know she's 11 but what I am trying to say is that because she looks so much younger someone will see her fall or out alone and phone SS and say I am neglecting her. I shall,just have to keep a closer eye on her. It's so,difficult to know what to do - she is off to high school soon and will be getting a bus. I'm very worried about that already.

I find other people's children intensely annoying and more than a little gross.

I would still have stopped to make sure she was OK, the same way I stop if an adult has an accident in my vicinity. Because they are a person and so am I.

The OP has nothing to lose if she picks up the phone and either calls a non-emergency number or SS or NSPCC and lets them know that there is a vulnerable unsupervised child. She knows where she lives, roughly her age, possibly her name(?).

No-one is suggesting that the OP get 'involved' just that she reacts like a normal human being with a bit of compassion.

All kids are protective of their stuff, they just are, hell, so am I.

Spotty I get where you coming from but I hazard a guess no one (even on mumsnet ) would call SS for a child falling over.
It is the crying for help attitude that would worry most and that it was not just once she has been there alone.

Most parents I know do the 'thing' you know the thing where you spot a kid who is by themselves and look a bit lost? You kind of lurk in the vicinity until they are matched up again. If that doesn't happen after a while you ask them where Mum/Dad is?

It is only a thing I have acquired since having kids, but I know most other people do it because I have seen/experienced it.

behind thank you, I am getting to know one of the neighbours quite well. She has lived here for a year. I will ask her about the girl next time we meet.

• I would not leave my 5 year old alone unless the flats were gated, the park communal and I could see DC from the window where I was. Even then not for long and not every day unless I considered it to be my garden, could see it from my flat and I was watching whilst at the sink or something

• I would also not take someone else's child away from where they were unless handing them over to lost children's area in a centre

• Nor would I wish to return them home to a potential conflict situation

as you are essentially saying to the other parent that their parenting is wrong *if I genuinely think that I would rather ring out of hours SS as and stay anonymous to the other parent, coward that I am.

But I also would not be ringing SS over a child using her complex's ammenties unless I really did suspect neglect...

It is not a clear-cut situation as pictish has already pointed out.

I have ended up being responsible a countless number of times for other people's kids even when there parents are there You have probably all had the same...your kid is building a castle then another comes across, all well and good til you realise you've been making small talk for two hours whilst their dad is playing on their mobile or pushing a child - not your own - on a swing whilst their mum is sunbathing or playing peek-a-boo on transport whilst their parents pretend they don't own them.

The parents are not there but neither are other neighbours' kids - it's not like playing out in the street - and tbh in this day and age even a group of kids can't always look out for each other if there is someone predatory.

I have savlon plasters and wetwipes in my handbag at all times. You cannot put cream on other people's kids. I would have offered a wetwipe and plaster though.

As for being held responsible - yes this HAS happened to me - a child once cycled past mine and shouted hello. We said hello back and said child then hit some mud, fell off bike and broke front tooth.
I went over as you do and helped him up, picked up his bike, wet wiped the mud off him and consoled. I then heard that he had told his Dad that we had put him off whilst cycling and his Dad was considering asking us for cash towards the dental costs. I live somewhere fairly litigious so it wasn't completely unfeasible despite being outrageous.

So the situation does suck. I also would not want to be avoiding my block's park. So...

1. Would go back with my son's bike in tow to avoid territorial toy rows.
2. Would have two capri suns and two biscuits cos I am soft even that is dodgy ground with allergies etc
3. Would make small talk with child if there to try and suss out the home situ.
4. Would tell girl she is not safe going off with strangers, she does not know me, if being pestered upon leaving.
5. Would monitor how often she is alone before calling out of hours SS as it could be her Mum is within radar but wanting to use other mums for unpaid childcare

but it is a lot trickier, all of it, than people are making out.

Candycoatedwaterdrops, I think you're deliberately downplaying the description of events on the other thread if you're suggesting they are not comparable in concern. The case of child abuse/neglect at the forefront of a lot of peoples' minds at the moment highlighted the inadequacies of a Child Protection Service that looks at incidences in isolation. Is it so farfetched to imagine a scenario where a child is both sworn at and name called in public and left to play in a park on their own at other times when their presence was not wanted? Equally, this may not be the case at all but to not be concerned by a very young child being sworn at and humiliated in public and to look at in isolation is very short sighted in my view and says a lot about why children are failed. It says an awful lot about they way we view children in this country and their rights as individuals to be protected by the law.

Jessie, glad you are making a friend with your neighbour, great idea to run your concerns by her, but please do pass info on to someone (police,nspcc,ss) as well.

Wtf? You ran away from a hurt and crying 5 year old because she creeps you out? You sound horrible. It's not unreasonable to think her behaviour is odd, because it probably is. But she's just a tiny child behaving the only way she knows. You should show more compassion.

beyoncecastle yes I was worried about being blamed by her for her falling off, just like the situation you described.

Especially since the first time we saw her my ds was chasing her on her bike and she was shouting at him to go away. When I did get him to stop she then came back and started talking to us again. I thought this behaviour erratic and unusual as one minute she was shouting for us to go away and the next she was wanting to be friends.

Considering her erratic behaviour I was worried she would blame the fall on ds.

I think YABU op in the way you speak of that child, and also the fact that she fell over and you walked off and left her. Not good. You need to call ssd and run the situation past them. They may already know of this little girl. She appears to be very vulnerable and could be at risk. You need to try and sort it out, not walk away.

"I thought this behaviour erratic and unusual as one minute she was shouting for us to go away and the next she was wanting to be friends."

I think it would be in a 25 year old. 5 years old? Not so much.

The OP's "odd", "selfish", "heartless" feelings and responses are not at all uncommon when confronted with vulnerable and 'at risk' children. Lots of us find thoughts of abuse and neglect intolerable so we deny them and replace them with other thoughts and feelings (a defense mechanism) that can appear strange to others but are easier for us to live with. I think the OP may doubt her reactions and thoughts which may be why she is posting.

There has also been some discussion about how much 'evidence' is enough to report to SS. I think SSs are happy to be the judge of this. They all have a Duty Officer who will take calls of concern. You can inform them of the scenario and they will ask a few questions and will decide if it needs further action. You can do this even if you do not know names, ages and addresses and this will give you a steer on how to handle any similar situations in the future.