To ask your views on bdsm relationships

[McNewPants2013]

I have been reading a lot of books about this and have came to a conclusion that with a trusting relationship it can work.

So what is your view.

I would be worried that the gimp mask would restrict my vision whrn doing a three point turn.

I'd like to believe that people can be into this and still be healthy/have healthy relationships, and maybe they can, but unfortunately not in my experience.

I got 'introduced' into some practices by a friend who had a 'sub' relationship with a guy (which ultimately culminated in some really nasty abuse).

Tried out 'sub' myself, and met some really nasty characters who did use it as a way to set the scene for abuse. Included occluding my mouth/nose in order to get off watching me struggle to breath. Again, not saying all are like this, just the few in my experience! I was also in a really vulnerable/unhealthy place at the time.

Decided to try out 'dom' instead, but couldn't get over the guilt aspect of it as I didn't enjoy meting out any of the punishments people wanted. Got out finally after one rather obsessive person wanted to get in a bathtub and have me light him on fire (with a bucket on standby for when he "couldn't take it any more"). I literally felt broken-hearted for the guy because I can't rationalise that kind of 'desire' away without some serious self-hatred or psychological damage being at play.

Again, I had a rather warped life for a while, and met a lot of messed-up individuals, and perhaps in that context, bdsm is a no-go. No idea how it would work with healthier individuals involved.

Not for me is my view.

I don't think it's something I'd want to try but it is interesting reading people's views.

If you ever thought about the fire bloke Solari (which I can imagine you'd do your best to avoid thinking about him) did you ever come to a conclusion as to why/how being set on fire and sex had become linked?

I don't even know you and I'm relieved you didn't do it, it must be very difficult to come to terms with the knowledge you're capable of doing such a thing to another person (maybe in a Millgram way).

I'm not laughing at you feeling bewildered and isolated SGB, as I often feel that myself, but the image of you standing with alarm on your face, getting crowded in by zombie like Non-Weirds, did make me laugh

AgentZigzag It was quite complicated reasons when he actually got into it, and I asked him a lot of questions (like to understand the roots of these things).

He equated fire with some sort of Divine being, or entity with massive power over him, "like the closest you can get to God" - in his words. He also had massive guilt over things he'd perceived himself as having done wrong (stemming from severe criticisms/chastisement in childhood).

Without an adult or authority figure to 'punish' him anymore, he sought a kind of ultimate relief by offering himself up to "Fire" (personified) as a replacement. Being burned and suffering pain was his punishment, and being allowed to live and not entirely consumed by the fire was his salvation - his kind of "OK" sign to keep living from God.

He was entirely aware that his practice of burning himself (which he did when not helped by others) could end up killing him, and in fact that was a necessary part of the experience for him, that death could be possible, and pain inevitable.

He was a very, very tortured individual, and I do still think of him actually because I wish I could have reached out to him in some way that would have made a difference. But it was like he was too far gone, or too far away, and so desperately clinging that I had to be another person to cut him off completely.

Poor bloke

Thanks for answering.

Mind boggles how scarification is legal..

Arguably, the same could be said about tattooing...

Missed the bit about scarification . Its definitely at the mild end of the spectrum though when you consider things like tongue-splitting and suspension (hanging from hooks in your skin).

Body Modification

Sorry, should put a trigger-warning for that body-mod link, some of it is quite graphic, and some parts may be triggering/disturbing.

What you do to yourself is different to two people hurting each other Andro.

Possibly?

It's up to you whether you kill/maim yourself as it's your body, but hurting someone else enough to bruise/cut would be illegal if it was in another situation, like when someone's prosecuted for punching their partner, regardless of whether the partner withdraws their complaint or not.

But then that would put tattooists/doctors/dentists in the firing line because they hurt other people

The difference has to be the intent behind it?

Drs etc are strictly regulated by the state, but in a private relationship it's not possible to be sure of the intent or make an accurate measurement of it.

When I first read about medical violence I was quite surprised because you don't think of what they do as violent because it's for caring reasons, but it is, without a doubt.

I wonder how doctors come to terms with hurting other people.

Is the caring reason behind it enough to overcome any guilt/distress.

Anyone up for posting a separate thread on that one?

What do you mean by a bdsm relationship? Do you mean a relationship in which both parties indulge in bondage and sado masochism? or do you mean a relationship in which someone is totally submissive to the other, possibly with S&M involved?

I have been into bdsm for some time, although in all honesty, not really that much over the past few years - it has sort of lost its novelty/appeal.

I have considered being totally submissive - why? because i suffer from anxiety and the thought of someone else making all my decisions for me and not having to think for myself has a deep appeal at times. I have a partner who i trust 100% with my life, and i would also trust him to have my best interests at heart - but trust him to make the right decision??? ARE YOU MAD????? In theory, its all very romantic and it does have a regular role in my fantasies but that is where it would have to stay for me! I am too much of a control freak and a feminist.

As to S&M we have indulged and it is a massive adrenalin rush, in fact its like nothing on this earth (ruling out drugs as i have never taken them) in terms of a "high".

It works for us, to be fair we don't do it very often now as it is ME that is the leader in terms of wanting it rather than DP. DP indulges me rather than the other way around and he has never ever gone too far as he knows when i want to stop, we don't have a safe word, as stop and no mean what they say. I'm not into role play but i admit that feeling of vulnerability is intoxicating. My fantasies are extreme, our reality is tame and loving.

In working with them for a portion of my life, I've reached the following conclusions (just my personal opinion):

a) They have a single-minded focus to "do what's best", and literally block everything else out.

b) They don't care, numbed by their own stresses and personal issues.

c) Doctors, like every other population, have a small percentage of sociopaths and sadists (unfortunately).

Do doctors hurt people?? if they do, i suggest they are doing it wrong

I think the doctors hurting people is referencing the violence some women experience from them during childbirth, as in having procedures they didn't consent to, or are actually screaming "No!" at. There was a thread about it recently (might still be running).

oh, that is quite different solari, sorry :( I have a few friends who are doctors and they are very blase about things though - I do think there is a high level of arrogance in the medical profession too, but as you say, that is quite another thread.

It's not just the violence of the symptoms, the dehumanisation of patients allows medical interventions that are not always in the interests of those patient.

That the intrusive/violent procedures performed (which most medical procedures could be defined as), aren't necessarily because of any care for the patient, there are other factors which inform the decision of the doctor etc (arrogance/public health/gatekeeping funds).

Doctors must realise this is happening and have to live with it.

And they obviously do given all the failings in hospitals being made public recently, and have just met criticisms defensively, close ranks, and aren't past outright lying about what they do.

I get that Agent, my mum has a pituitary tumour. It is benign and she has had it for the best part of 50 years. She has already had to have her adrenal cortex (or medulla, i cant remember) removed as that was the treatment back when she was diagnosed all those years ago. With recent developments in medical physics etc, they wanted her to have something called a "gamma knife" to shrink/remove the tumour. I have a bioscience background so questioned the doctors on the need for this to happen - as in, what would the benefits be and risks. IMO there wasn't any benefits as there would be no change in my mums condition, her adrenals are gone so she will still need steroid replacement therapy, there would be no change to her treatment regieme and there was no significant risk of future malignancy. The doctors faces were a picture when i said, "you know what, i really don't think this is a good idea" They had to agree that the benefits would be minimal and im buggered if my mother was going to be a guinea pig for their new toy and told them as such. Had i not been there she would have had agreed to highly invasive treatment she didn't need.

Most people are still encouraged to trust them without question, which is helpful if you're having a painful procedure, but (same as police) they're fallible, and that's frightening, so not many people tend to question them (selective ignorance is bliss).

It takes real balls to do that, bloody good for you LEM.

I know from being in hospital myself, that it only takes a day or two to be institutionalised by their routines, you very easily start submitting yourself to the dehumanisation process, which makes it much easier for them to see you in terms of stats/research they've read/what they've been taught/tradition.

Although saying these things, I've always found any times I've had in hospital/doctors to have left me with huge admiration for the fantastic people who work there (probably because I've wholeheartedly submitted and left my dignity at the door )

The books I read is normally a women who isn't very confident in sex and perhaps doesn't deserve to have sex.

Normally the subs are in control of every thing and this is one part of her life that she has no control over.

The Dom kind of gets what the sub needs and will push past what she thinks she needs.

I don't get why the need to use things like floggers and whips, but that because if you loved someone why would you want to hurt that person.

In the medical world, if someone has a dislocated sholder that needs resetting. It may be painful to reset but then the healing can begin and the patient then can live a life without pain.

Setting a dislocated shoulder is a violent event, where both people have to submit to the procedure.

It's only viewed as necessary violence because you can see the obvious result, but not every procedure is as black and white.

It just comes down to how we've constructed different acts of violence.

Some are legal and you could define as necessary, others aren't, but the boundaries are always shifting over time, and if they can be shifted, what makes one boundary right over another one?

It's acceptable to forcibly sterilise women in China some some societies now, and in the past in WWII, but we've drawn the boundary that it's not OK to violate someone in such a way. Thank. Fuck.

BDSM isn't illegal (in most cases), and why it's not (not that I think it should be or anything) is interesting.

I don't think it should be illegal. I suspect that in a bdsm relationship things can turn abusive and when that happens the relationship should stop immediately.

I think that why safe words are important in this relationship. Because if it something that the sun don't want and she uses the safe word it goes from a bdsm relationship to one that is abusive.