To have told SIL "no...NOT Pardon!"?

[MrsMushroom]

We're abroad with DHs family.

DD aged 4 didn't hear something SIL said.....DD said "What?" and SIL said "WHAT? WHAT??? I think you mean PARDON don't you?"

I HAD to say..."No...in England "what" is fine. Or If you prefer..."sorry, I didn't catch that."

Was I rude? I just don't want DD saying "Pardon" or even worse "P'don"

Oh and Merry Christmas everyone!

If my as yet unborn daughter ever says the word toilet, in my hearing, I'll wash her mouth out with soap and water.

This is going to be a tricky learning curve for her - because my husband does say toilet - and I don't comment or criticise him for it.

Thing is, actually correcting someone's speech is more rude and declasse than any amount of sub-Mitfordian flimflammery ... Think on't, Vipers!

Maybe it makes me think of people toiling away, trying to do difficult shits or something...........

I think I would rather like to spend far more time with people like usual.

Purely because so many other people care far to much what others think and have delusions of grandeur.

Nancy, the word you are thinking of is spelled khazi and I believe is military in origin, also popular amongst cockneys.

I really don't care whether anyone other than my own ds says 'what' or 'pardon', was merely trying to explain to the pardoners why 'what' isn't necessarily rude.

I don't think many people have said they would correct someone else (other than their own children)

But toilet is far to practical and visual a word to say in front of your grandmother when she is dressed for dinner.

I refer the honourable members to my reply of 13.49. It's all about undersanding the mores, and choosing what to do about them.

i hate 'bathroom' or 'rest rooms'

Sorry, Cat I thought we were all calling one another rude ... That'll teach me to skip to the end!

I agree correcting anyone other than your own children IRL would be rude.

I couldn't care less about the toilet/lav napkin/serviette stuff. It's just that having "what?" barked at me is a particular bug bear of mine. "what did you say" is ok, preferably prefaced with a sorry, but "what?" can never sound anything but rude or abrupt.

I think we were all expressing our likes and dislikes of words and saying we found some to be rude or offensive but not each other personally :)

My boss says "toilet"

I do an inward shudder but I would never correct him or comment on it.

Going back to the OP, the people who have said SIL was right to correct DD because 'pardon' is more polite than 'what' are missing the point... Because language is social, it isn't just the girl's choice of words that is being criticised, it is her identity.

Imagine an American SIL who 'corrected' the little girl when she asked to go to the loo and insisted she called it 'the john'. No-one would think that was OK. Well, the same thing is going on here: the SIL tried to impose her linguistic codes on the child, and the OP did the equivalent of saying "Calling it 'loo' is fine DD; that's what we say here".

A Sgt once asked me why I said lavatory instead of toilet (I was a Trooper at the time.) I replied that is rude to knowingly cause your grandmother to spin in her grave.

"I couldn't care less about the toilet/lav napkin/serviette stuff. It's just that having "what?" barked at me is a particular bug bear of mine. "what did you say" is ok, preferably prefaced with a sorry, but "what?" can never sound anything but rude or abrupt."

It's the barking that's rude, not the word.

I've never heard anyone say "what?" in a way that comes across as polite.

My parent are of lavatory speakage. However, given up on their children and grandchildren who all merrily say TOILET.
My parents would say 'I beg your pardon' or 'what'. I have compromised and tend to say 'sorry?'.
I used to get told off at school for 'what' and laughed at for 'lavatory'.

Seeker. You make a valid point about social signifiers and job interviews, etc. However, it is probably worth also bearing in mind that, in many entry level jobs our children may go for, they will be interviewed by people solidly of the middle class. Not powerful, rich, upper class people.

So rather than being utterly convinced that, because one is 'U', one is right, it would also be worth our children understanding the offence that their 'correct' language could cause. For example, if my mother interviewed you for a job as a newly qualified teacher and you said 'what' because you didn't hear her, she would think you were very rude with poor manners. She couldn't give a stuff if you want to say scent, and lavatory, and napkin. But 'what' she would consider actively rude. Which is why, rather like 'bog', resolutely pressing on with using it because you are 'right' may be short sighted.

Why aren't you meant to say pleased to meet you? Are you meant to say 'How do you do' (i.e. a phrase just as meaningless as I beg your pardon)?

"Why aren't you meant to say pleased to meet you? Are you meant to say 'How do you do' (i.e. a phrase just as meaningless as I beg your pardon)?"

The only response to "how do you do" is "how do you do"

Another example of how bonkers the whole thing is.

I understand what you mean about the "what" at entry level interviews thing - that's what I mean about knowing the "code" and being able to choose whether to use it or not.

Talking of things we only ever read on MN I don't know anyone in real life who uses the word 'rude'. Also 'gracious' which we see all the time

I'm becoming bilingual on MN as well

I probably would say "sorry?" in a job interview situation because a lot of people do think "what" is rude wrongly

You don't say "pleased to meet you" as you don't know if you are

You should say "How do you do?" to which the correct response is "How do you do?" but I would only really do that if meeting someone formally or at work.