To have discplined my SILs children as she was doing nothing...??

[Shinyballsandtinsel]

Two days ago, DH, me, our three DCs (9, 11, 13), granny, SIL and her two DCs went out for a meal in the evening (early about 7.00pm) for one of granny's landmark birthdays. We went to a chain pub, which later on turns into a club with bouncers on the door, no children after 9pm etc. It is in a town well known for stag/hen nights, however this time of year it is mostly Christmas parties.

It was very very busy, behind our table there were two long tables of about twenty people each, which looked like work do's. The bar was also very busy - there were steps leading down to the restaurant bit from the bar.

Our food arrived quite quickly. When we had finished our meal, we were waiting for the staff to bring plates for the birthday cake. My SILs older DC started running around and around the table very fast (aged 5yrs). SIL sat there doing nothing. Then the her younger DC started doing it also (aged 3yrs), whilst they were running the 3 year old ran into the legs of a fully laden waitress who nearly dropped all her plates. SIL still just sat there. They were running within close proximity of the people sitting on the end of the work do tables.

SIL was completely oblivious to it all, so I grabbed the 3yr old on his next run around, and plonked him down on a chair beside me, and said in quite a firm voice "sit down now, those people are having their dinner and Granny is about to have her cake". He immediately burst into tears, SIL glared at me, grabbed him on her lap. The 5 year old continued to run around the table, and then ran up the steps on her own into the bar area, my DH went to get her back, when she arrived back he put her onto her chair, she immediatley slid off under the table and started the running around thing again.

They have behaved like this before, I often make excuses for not going out when they are going to be there, as the children's behaviour, or rather the mother's complete oblivion to their behaviour actually winds me up. In the past she also literally just sits there whilst her children run around other people's tables, talk to strangers eating, ask if they can try some of their food (I kid you not!) and generally act as if they are in a playground. SIL has said in the past she thinks it cheers people up to see her kids smiley faces, and they are so freespirited and cute nobody could get annoyed with them..... Hence why I usually make my excuses, but as it was granny's landmark birthday couldn't get out of it.

Anyway, the saga continues - we all take it in turns to do Christmas dinner, this year is SILs turn to do it at her house. Today DH has received a telephone call to say that we are no longer invited for christmas day, as SIL is upset that I took it upon myself discipline her child, and it will ruin their Christmas if I do so again.

I am of the opinion that I am quite pleased not to have to go around there, and am happy to break away from the big family Christmas and start having Christmases at home with just our family, but Granny has now rung up very upset, and asked DH if I can apologise and make an excuse, i.e. say I was stressed at work or something.

I am not happy to do this, as I am not sorry. AIBU to not aplogise even though it will probably upset MIL?

To be honest OP's DSIL was lucky no-one outside of the family gathering made a complaint to the venues management - seen this happen and a very embarrassed group of people leaving sharpish.

I wouldn't apologise, I am also one for stepping in if I think someone else's child s over stepping the mark (in a safety issue) and mum is ignoring it, SIL or stranger!

I have also been on the recieving end when my DF has threatened to smack my 3yo child when he failed to calm down in a split second (after DF had wound him up thoroughly for 1/2 an hour) and have been well pissed off with DF (and told him so). I'd grab that "Get out of Jail Free" card with both cards and tell MIL that while you are sorry that SHE (MIL) is upset, you think that all things considered you'd be better off letting the dust settle and you'll no doubt see you SIL in the New Year and you hope that MIL will come round on Boxing Day.

Enjoy your lovely quiet Christmas!

I've worked as a waitress on and off for years in my younger days.

Kids tearing round was always ny worst nightmare. littlies are below your line of vision if you are carrying stuff , they come out from unexpected directions - from under tables so are hard to spot.

Elf and safety nightmare, i was always terrified I'd drop hot soup or hot drink on them. If I was working in the situation you describe, I'd have sent the manager over to have a word.

Yadnbu

YANBU

A few weeks ago I was in a similar position with some friends and one of them let her 4 year old and 20 month old run around. The 20 month old disappeared and the mum told the 4 year old to go and watch her.... like he was going to be able to protect his baby sister from harm

It didn't go on for very long before a waitress told her to keep her children under control (in a nice way of course)

OP You did nothing wrong and you should NOT apologise. In fact, I believe you SIL owes an apology to you, your husband, your MIL and the staff in the restaurant.

She sounds like a lazy parent who can't see wrong in her little darlings and thinks everyone else should adore them too.

I think you should stay at home on Christmas day and invite your MIL round for Boxing Day, as you mentioned earlier.

Your SIL sounds like a spoilt brat, raising spoilt children.

SIL is having a hissy fit, you just need to stay calm and let all the hostility be hers. She's not happy you told her child off (in her eyes) her childrens' behaviour was ruining your evening and you were concerned for the safety of them. I think brisk approach of acknowledging her feelings and understanding her point of view is called for, doesn't mean you have to apologise/grovel etc. It's a bit of a "we have different styles of parenting we clearly need some space as families after the other evening" Be very very pleasant and let MIL know what is going on. She may of course side with SIL but provided you are always prepared to share space with SIL and it's her blocking you out there isn't much more you can do.

I had this from my SIL - hissy fit that I dared to invite inlaws around without her yet they regularly do stuff without inviting us...

Tricky one all around.

apostrophetheshowman .......raising spoilt children who will finish up with ASBOs because they were not taught how to behave properly.

My children are 3 & 5 and I do not attempt restaurants with them yet. It's too stressful; worrying about how they may behave and what others may think. But I also wouldn't want anyone else to 'plonk' my child down on a chair. But then again I would have dealt with it long before you intervened, in this situation.

I think you were already agitated before you even got there though, as you clearly didn't want her to come in the first place and were probably dreading how her children would behave from the very beginning. So perhaps it's a good thing that it's now all out in the open a little? As others have said, enjoy Christmas at home now.

I wouldn't pander to her at all though. Do not enter into the drama. If you apologise, you're basically enabling her to continue as before.

By blaming you for this whole situation, she absolves herself of any wrongdoing, and she can continue to believe - and strive to convince others - that she is in fact, right. Iyswim.

If you acquiesce and say sorry, there will be a next time and a next time and a next time I suspect, and I don't think being coerced into an apology from guilt, due to subjective wrongs is right. If you want to apologise, it needs to be of your own volition, anything else is a false apology.

You do need to take a stand, otherwise this struggle will continue for years ahead. But what route you take will leave a ripple for years to come, as others have said. You've had some great advice though, especially about what to say.

Do come back and tell us what you chose to do.

YANBU

(As a nanny i would take a 3 and 5 year old to restaurants and actually they could and did behave, for myself and their parents, its not that hard IMO!)

i would never allow my children to behave like that and would be embarassed to be sitting at a table with children behaving like that (in case strangers thought they were mine)

I would be greatful not to have to spend any more meal times with them in future tbh, and teach your children manners.

I would have said to your MIL that actually you were expecting the apology to come from SIL for letting the kids run around so dangerously without any attempt to get them to sit down or for not bringing anything to entertain them at the table with, and for risking the whole group being thrown out of the restaurant early as a result of their bad behaviour etc etc.

My ds are now 4 and 7 and are very well behaved when in restaurants normally - but if I know we are going out, especially to a nice restaurant where it's likely to be a long meal, I have a bag full of bits to distract them when needed - colouring, reading, little toy cars etc. And the odd few treats such as little bags of crackers or sweets in case there are long delays in the food being served or they don't like it. Things like mini smarties that you can use to dole out sloooooowly and turn into a game or use as a bribe reward and so on.

Hope you stand firm and enjoy your christmas at home!

Have a lovely quiet family Christmas and don't whatever you do apologise!

I also think your mil is being very unfair on you trying to emotionally blackmail you when your sil is the one who has chucked a hissy fit

Hell would freeze over before I apologised.

In fact, I would relish not having to spend time with them again. I despise that kind of behaviour and more so, the parents that sit and watch it.

OP, do you think your MIL would like to come to you for Christmas Day? [evil grin]

seems like a win win to me :)

Now you can invite granny without the SiL there.

I would be telling Granny that you are no way going to apologise for stopping SIL's rude badly behaved children running riot in an adult restaurant, you weren't stressed except by their bad behaviour. And if she wants you to go for Christmas she had better deal with her daughter and her lack of parenting skills, by pointing out that people do not like their smiling faces when they are out for a grown up civilised meal.

what did your DH say to his mum when she called? Hope he's backing you and saying no way. Plan to spend a lovely home family christmas and see Granny on Boxing day start a new tradition

Sounds like SIL is throwing a tantrum and we don't respond to tantrums do we?

i have older children than yours. if i go out the last thing i want is to have kids running around my table whilst i eat my dinner, and most certainly not trying to taste my food or trying to interact with me.

i spent years either arranging babysitters or making my kids behave.

the reason why kids are banned from some restaurants is because of parents like these.

thankyou on behalf of the guests for sorting them out.

,i would always take it to the parents,if they do nothing,then theres nothing you can do,you cant control everyone!

Of course there is something you can do! As OP did. If parents do nothing they can't expect the general public to be as indulgent. I would certainly control a 3 year old niece or nephew by picking them up and holding onto them!

dreaminofthesun is quite right-parents who won't control their DCs get all DCs banned.

I used to hate kids running round when I was a waitress.

My view is this is a good time to break the Christmas tradition and have Christmas on our own, in our own home. The only times we have had it at home we have loads to cook for and it's not particularly enjoyable, so earlier posters are right, this is a get out of jail free card!

Will give it a couple of days, and see what DH thinks, but I will not be apologising for something I don't feel sorry for.

i can't believe your SIL thinks that other diners - who have not brought children with them - are delighted to see her kids' shiny happy faces poking into their food and interrupting their meals. If dh and I - or if I and any of my friends - had gone out without our children, we would be really enjoying the child-free time. The last thing we would want to have someone else's kids bothering us, just because their parents can't be bothered to keep them under control.

Randommess's response is the best imo, and your idea of having Granny round for Boxing Day (don't tell SIL or she'll sabotage it) is splendid.

Hope things turn out well and you have a lovely Xmas.

YANBU

I think you should tell Granny that you are sorry SiL feels that way, and you respect her wishes to invite or uninvite whomever she pleases. That you are not sorry for removing the children from a dangerous situation for all concerned. Suggest Granny comes for Boxing Day or New Year?
By apologising you may find SIL continues trying to manipulate situations like this.

As a parent I detest this kind of behaviour. As a waitress I despised this kind of behaviour. It's rude, it's annoying and it's unacceptable. Nobody wants their meal disrupted by your dc's. nobody wants to SHARE THEIR FOOD with them! The staff don't want their safety endangered by your child and they definitely don't want to clear up the filthy mess they leave behind. It's not cute, sweet or heart warming!
I would have done the same thing, and if SIL had got annoyed with me, I'd have told her straight to sort her kids out or suck it up! As a waitress I would have asked her to make them sit down, and so would my mangers. It's dangerous and bad for business.
Do not apologise. Enjoy a peaceful Christmas at home and send Granny an invite.