To have discplined my SILs children as she was doing nothing...??

[Shinyballsandtinsel]

Two days ago, DH, me, our three DCs (9, 11, 13), granny, SIL and her two DCs went out for a meal in the evening (early about 7.00pm) for one of granny's landmark birthdays. We went to a chain pub, which later on turns into a club with bouncers on the door, no children after 9pm etc. It is in a town well known for stag/hen nights, however this time of year it is mostly Christmas parties.

It was very very busy, behind our table there were two long tables of about twenty people each, which looked like work do's. The bar was also very busy - there were steps leading down to the restaurant bit from the bar.

Our food arrived quite quickly. When we had finished our meal, we were waiting for the staff to bring plates for the birthday cake. My SILs older DC started running around and around the table very fast (aged 5yrs). SIL sat there doing nothing. Then the her younger DC started doing it also (aged 3yrs), whilst they were running the 3 year old ran into the legs of a fully laden waitress who nearly dropped all her plates. SIL still just sat there. They were running within close proximity of the people sitting on the end of the work do tables.

SIL was completely oblivious to it all, so I grabbed the 3yr old on his next run around, and plonked him down on a chair beside me, and said in quite a firm voice "sit down now, those people are having their dinner and Granny is about to have her cake". He immediately burst into tears, SIL glared at me, grabbed him on her lap. The 5 year old continued to run around the table, and then ran up the steps on her own into the bar area, my DH went to get her back, when she arrived back he put her onto her chair, she immediatley slid off under the table and started the running around thing again.

They have behaved like this before, I often make excuses for not going out when they are going to be there, as the children's behaviour, or rather the mother's complete oblivion to their behaviour actually winds me up. In the past she also literally just sits there whilst her children run around other people's tables, talk to strangers eating, ask if they can try some of their food (I kid you not!) and generally act as if they are in a playground. SIL has said in the past she thinks it cheers people up to see her kids smiley faces, and they are so freespirited and cute nobody could get annoyed with them..... Hence why I usually make my excuses, but as it was granny's landmark birthday couldn't get out of it.

Anyway, the saga continues - we all take it in turns to do Christmas dinner, this year is SILs turn to do it at her house. Today DH has received a telephone call to say that we are no longer invited for christmas day, as SIL is upset that I took it upon myself discipline her child, and it will ruin their Christmas if I do so again.

I am of the opinion that I am quite pleased not to have to go around there, and am happy to break away from the big family Christmas and start having Christmases at home with just our family, but Granny has now rung up very upset, and asked DH if I can apologise and make an excuse, i.e. say I was stressed at work or something.

I am not happy to do this, as I am not sorry. AIBU to not aplogise even though it will probably upset MIL?

Me and DH have already talked about Boxing Day, and our oldest DC said they would like it as they never get a chance to talk to granny properly when the younger ones are present. This is true as the younger ones always want to be the centre of attention.

Last time they were all over here granny was talking to our DS, SILs oldest DC went upstairs into his room and disassembled a Lego technic digger he had spent hours on and bought it downstairs wrecked. SIL thought it was cute, and actually laughed, as "she wants to help make his Lego" while our DS was almost in tears.

If you don't want to apologise don't do. But I do think your being unreasonable

so I grabbed the 3yr old on his next run around, and plonked him down on a chair beside me, and said in quite a firm voice "sit down now, those people are having their dinner and Granny is about to have her cake". He immediately burst into tears,

You grabbed a 3 year old child plonked him on his chair and said in a firm voice?? Wow...just wow. If anyone grabbed my child and plonked them down I would be having serious words. Your an adult and you intimindated a small child enough to make him cry? Yet you don't think your being unreasonale?

You knew what the children were like before you went for the meal. You didn't have to go. Granny isn't your mother. The children are not even related to you! You were very unreasonable putting your hands on someone elses child. That disgusting behaviour from an adult woman.

Bullshit would I apologise.

I'd actually phone SIL myself. Say it's a shame we're not all going to be together Christmas Day, but if you'd like to come BD that'd be lovely.

That way you get CD to yourselves, appease MIL and control the kids in your own home by setting up games/DVD to keep them amused.

I am busy picking fence splinters out from my arse.

What strikes me is that GRANNY & OP's DH would both have stepped in. But neither did. Why are they not just as culpable as the SIL, in colluding to tolerate the bad behaviour & not confront the SIL or discipline her kids?

OP has therefore made a rift that the others would prefer to avoid. That they probably prefer to avoid for good reasons. It seems to me that OP has shown herself to be just as stubborn as the SIL in her perspective.

Mind, I couldn't apologise, either. I'd probably send my DH around with the kids & stay home. Not saying that's ideal solution, but still the best I could do.

Ah, seems my BD suggestion wouldn't help after all

Tistheseason - I wish she had the balls to have serious words as I would then have been able to tell her what I thought of her child's behaviour, instead she tries to emotionally blackmail and drag her mum into it.

It was our meal out with granny which we arranged, SIL invited herself, so why should I not go out for a meal with my family because she can't look after her kids properly?

TisTheSeasonToBeJolly What is disgusting is a supposed parent, not controlling their DC's.

you intimindated a small child enough to make him cry

I doubt OP did this at all, and the child has no clue what discipline is, and cried like most spoilt kids do.

If you read the post at all, OP and DH wanted to take MIL out but SIL invited herself and DC's.

OP is not the unreasonable one.

The kid burst into tears because they'd been allowed to get totally over the top, and when pulled up suddenly it shocked them.

That's not "disgusting" behaviour by the OP, it's lax parenting by the SIL.

SILs nose is out because deep down she knows she should have sorted it.

If your kids can't behave in a restaurant you shouldn't take them.

"Sounds like SIL is throwing a tantrum and we don't respond to tantrums do we?"

Tell her to go and swivel on a fat one.

SIL sounds like a nightmare and I bet she is the type of parent that everyone slags off behind her back because she is so ineffectual and lame.

Don't apologise. You're a relative and you doled out some mild discipline to a nephew/niece because their mother was too limp-wristed to do her own job herself.

That's your opinion. I think it is disgusting to put your hands on someone elses child and make them cry.

Shinyballs, I would see this as the Christmas gift that keeps on giving.

The kids are brats, sil is either thick, lazy or just a downright shit parent and you no longer have to tolerate such shite.

I guess im disgusting then, since i disciplined my niece and nephew before.

She didn't make them cry. You can't judge a child's reaction to anything until after the event, a lot of times.

DS burst out crying yesterday at school drop-off time because the TA had locked the class door before he'd been to kiss me goodbye. The TA didn't make him cry. She didn't know in advance his reaction to this.

More likely the little twerps aren't au fait with being told that the sun doesn't shine out of the arses and it knocked their noses out of joint.

Dh's SIL was like this. We haven't spoken to her in 4 years and it's bliss. Her children were never disciplined and often got themselves into scrapes which resulted in dh having to rescue them.

One day she was in the same place as us and tore strips off my eldest for no reason. I tore strips of her and told her I'd never speak to her again. I haven't and never will.

I'm awkward and difficult but who cares.

Op didn't make the child cry, being reprimanded and given a little discipline made him cry.

Op also didn't know that the child wasn't about to run into a waitress/waiter again in the next few seconds so picking him up and putting him on a chair is acceptable IMO.

So annoying having children peg it about whilst Im trying to enjoy my food.

Tistheseason - it wasn't me putting my hands on him that made him cry, it was that he was stopped from doing a potentially dangerous activity. i think it would have been more disgusting to leave him at the risk of a scald from boiling soup or a head injury from falling plates, don't you?

A 3 year old sees no difference between a familial aunt and an aunt by marriage.
OP is the children's aunt not some random stranger, TisTheSeason , I would be happy for any of my ILs to remove one of my children from danger.

Oh please! Tistheseason, what a ridiculous thing to say. The OP didn't hurt the child. Kids cry when they don't get their own way but that doesn't mean we should pander to them. If we were afraid of crying children we'd end up in a world where kids run amok whilst hapless parents stand by and do nothing ....... Oh yeah, we do!

We need more people like the OP if you ask me

Agreed Aspi, when i take my daughter to restaurants, she knows to have her backside firmly planted on the chair, i'd be mortified if she bumped into a waitress, she'd be banned from restaurants in future.

F that waitress were carrying hot liquid, or a huge stack of plates and cutlery, the child was likely to have been seriously injured. The OP was saving the child from a potentially seriously dangerous situation. He was surprised to have been sat down, but at the end of the day, as well as being annoyed, the OP was removing him from danger. If his mother is too stupid to do this for herself, then she needs to reassess her parenting style!

This is a new one for mumsnet

OP: am I being unreasonable?
Tistheseason : yes
Everyone else : NO!

TisTheSeason is not the only yabu, There are a few of us fence-sitters, too.

I think that we can go with the majority! Tistheseason is obviously one of those people who thinks 'my DC- my rules', which is fine in the home but unworkable outside. Elsewhere people can impose their own rules-you can 'have words' if you like but, other than removing your DC, there is nothing you can do.

If its unreasonable to stop a child from being seriously injured, then society is royally screwed.