to pretend that state school is not so bad...

[RichTeas]

We are in an area with no shortage of preps and indies; the state schools are not bad, but for us, definitely not the preferred option. Yet it looks like it's going to be state all the way through. So far DS (Y3) doesn't have any idea of the types of schools that exist, as we have never openly discussed it, but I expect soon he will be clued up enough to question the system he finds himself in. It feels disingenuous to fib that we're happy with just a state education (when we're not), yet we don't want him to grow up feeling he's missed out by over-egging the independents. I suppose it could be worse, he could be in private and then forced to come out, but the issues is the same I wonder how others explain this kind of mismatch...

Sparkling/Usual I've also never had to have such a debate in real life. I know a few other families who privately educate, most who I've met through the DCs activities and its not something thats ever discussed, we might complain about schools but theres no war about one being private and one being state.

Its a total mn issue as far as I'm concerned.

We frequently drive past a private girls school, that a lot of friends of my DDs go to. It is a fabulous school. However I bluntly tell them that we couldn't afford it, even though it would probably suit my youngest to a T. Her older sister would actually not choose that one, but might prefer to go to another private school where several of her friends go.
They know that they go to what we consider to be the best State schools and are quite happy.

No grammar schools here either so the whole 11 plus stress thing was new to me too.

Funnily enough though DS1 told me tonight that his mate from Rugby has had a load of detentions. Don't know mate but DS said he goes to one of the local private schools. I have no idea how you deal with that as a parent.

Oh the middle classes angst about bloody everyhting.

From schools to alcohol units. From the contents of the perfect lunch box to going out in the sun.
They worry about what they eat, drink, watch, read, hear and even what they call the room they wee in!

As an outsider I find it fecking hilarious.

Ohhh ok. Now I understand what you mean Ever. No its not about diversity, we live in Hackney, my children are mixed race and I think most of the private or state schools in the area are equally reflective of the diverse area we live in.

Its more that I have an issue with them being around wealthy or monied people. I'm not knocking anyone else choices, you're all entitled to educate your children how you choose and good luck to you. However personally I would prefer my DC to go to whatever the local schools are. I think that going to what are termed 'rough' schools will do them good, they've in recent years had a very comfortable upbringing and I think that a good dose of reality is beneficial to them. I want them to be tough and have more of an idea what its like to be poor (which is where they come from) and experience the realness of life.

You would think that a person who had never set foot in a state school would have been able to write her original post with correct grammar.

I have never set foot in a private school and spotted it straight away.

This country us getting more segregated by the day it seems.

That's interesting scary.

Having expereinced much of the realness of life, DH and I are intent on trying to avoid a lot of it for DC.

Is not us. On phone.

But I don't want to catch the angst word. That lunchbox thread was unreal. I don't want to seem like I don't care but really.....

I haven't read the whole thread but can I just offer my own perspective?
I have 3 DDs.
DD1 and DD2 go to local prep schools. DD3 has just started at our village school in Reception. It is excellent. I am seriously wondering why we spent the money on the other two from Reception when such a good education was available for free.
Clearly there are good and bad state schools (and good and bad private schools) but to assume all private schools are better than all state schools is just wrong in my opinion.

I guess word thats the beauty of parenting, we all do it differently.

DH and I are from really poor, inner London backgrounds and we both feel really strongly that one of the biggest elements of our success now, (where we are in position to privately educate, own our own London home, regular travel, I have my own business which does work internationally) is down to having rough, tough upbringings. I'm not saying it was all pleasant and I would obviously not want to see my DC come to any harm but I would much rather they were toughened up a bit and I guess (even though I hate this phrase) were streetwise and know how to get by.

It quite hard to explain but I am a fan of tough love and I suppose this is just an extension of that.

Sparkling I sometimes wonder if I have done the right thing catapulting my DC into middleclassdom. Are they now fettered by the twin pressures of The Farmers' Market and thinking they really should try to listen to more opera?

I like to think I have muddied the waters with my love of flash cars and factor 15.

If this thread was in the right place I would never have seen it. I hid Education a long while ago.

For me ever ethnic mix aside, there is still the issue that aside from a few the majority of those attending private school have the funds to pay for it and have the kind of parents who want to pay for their childs education.

I like the fact that at a state school, typically there will be a wider mix of incomes, families and parenting approaches. There are less parents who can afford to or are willing to pay for the education. DH and I won't move out of our area because I like the diversity and the poverty and the roughness of it all so your situation is not something I've ever faced, but like I said I'm not knocking your decisions, they're just not what I want to do.

Also I'm not sure if I've made myself clear, whilst I feel 'life education' as I put it, is one of the benefits of state education its not the reason I don't believe in private schools. I don't believe in private schools because I don't believe that you should be able to buy a childs education and that the quality of education should depend on your income. I see life education, a dose of reality etc as one of the benefits of state education, it is why I send them to the local schools regardless of their ofsted and reputation but is not why I send my DC to state schools.

ChristinaF We are wondering the same thing and raking our brains, state school down the road with outstanding characteristics.
ScaryfakeNails you are girl after my own heart, toughening them up can only be a good thing, we do worry about DD being in her current school, "sheltered life" isn't even the right description it is more then sheltered, it is a cocoon.
Everlong same here, excellent state down the road is but the cohort 100% White British no diversity whatsoever, we can't identify with that, we need more diversity the that and we are getting that at private school where she is now, but of course at the price.
Regardless of what the OP asked originally, this thread has certainly given me some food for thought, perhaps it is time for a change in more ways then one for us.

ScaryFakeNails, I like your posts.

I'd make two comments:

Please don't underestimate how tough some (especially) private boarding schools are in terms of learning how to stand up for yourself. Whatever Eton's image, it is still made up of 1200 adolescent boys with the same proclivities as any other set of kids.

You are clearly very articulate. Your DCs are going to get a whole lot of education at home without even noticing. That is not true of every household.

Just out of interest, what did you mean by "raw material," OP?

I don't really have a dog in this hunt (as we say here in the US). I don't live in the UK at the moment, and my own education included both private and state schools (in the UK and the US). Some of the schools were excellent, some were mediocre on both sides of the Atlantic. Based on my experience, I wouldn't say that private schools are automatically preferable to state schools. But I wouldn't rule out either option for my own children.

Love threads like this, find the conflicting views so interesting.

What is particularly interesting is how the state sector peeps have such a strong view on private schools whereas the people who have chosen private school always seem to be defending their choice.

A lot of people I know say it's their choice what they spend their overdraft/money on but make it clear that private school would make then choke on their Pinot Grigio.

Equally the private school parents who do the drop off in 10 year old cars and wearing an old seiko don't have a hang up about their state school choosing friends wearing a Rolex and driving a £60k car.

Why do you all care so much about school choices?

The OP means, I think, that she thinks private schools are Naicer. Not necessarily better ('academic') but naicer ('manners and ambience'*&[sic]). However, she feels a bit embarrassed about communicating this so bluntly so is now saying it's all 'quite nuanced'.

FWIW I walked into a school and thought 'that's the one for DD1', which was the local comp where she now is. These Damscene moments are not reserved for the private - sorry, independent - sector.

*It's actually spelt 'ambiance' btw. Just saying. Given this is a thread about Naice Schools I thought I might point this Narstily out.

Ah, the lovely '10 year old cars' cliche. Can I just point out that in our neck of the woods, schools assess poverty on free school meals, not modes of transport?

Everlong, just out of interest, how does the prep school manage to be socially diverse and have children from all walks of life? Don't the fees get in the way for the poorer kids?! I get how a comprehensive can manage to not be socially diverse, but I don't see how a private school can be.

(My local comprehensive, btw, is 100% white. The private school is more mixed ethnically. But not socially.)